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CNN Live Event/Special
Guns in America; Horrific Sports Injury; Women and Careers
Aired April 01, 2013 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NARRATOR: Tonight, you know of the news.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People in this country, it seems they love to build someone up.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am coming soon.
NARRATOR: Now it's time to get to THE POINT with Donny Deutsch.
DONNY DEUTSCH, CHAIRMAN, DEUTSCH INC.: I'm chairman of Deutsch Incorporated, which is one of the world's top ad agencies. I'm the author of two books, "Often Wrong, Never in Doubt" and "The Big Idea."
NARRATOR: CNN's Margaret Hoover.
MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: I spent four years in Washington in government service, including two years in the White House. I wrote a national best-selling book about how to save the Republican Party.
NARRATOR: Rick Reilly.
RICK REILLY, AUTHOR: I'm an ESPN columnist, essayist and author. I have been covering the world of sports for more than 30 years.
NARRATOR: Jason Taylor.
JASON TAYLOR, FORMER PROFESSIONAL FOOTBALL PLAYER: I played professional football for 15 years. I also majored in political science and criminal justice.
NARRATOR: And Kayleigh McEnany.
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, FOUNDER, REAL REAGAN CONSERVATIVE: I'm founder and editor in chief of Real Reagan Conservative, a network of conservative writers dedicated to promoting conservative values and principles. I wanted to empower Americans to have a voice.
NARRATOR: Let's get to THE POINT.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HOOVER: Hi, everyone. Welcome to THE POINT. We're going to be here all week at this time. You already know the headlines, and so we're going to get to the point of each story and we're going to talk about what everyone is talking about tonight, Kevin Ware, this real-time injury that everyone watched and now can't seem to find it in themselves to watch it.
REILLY: Well, it was interesting, because I have covered sports for 33 years. This is the worst one from what I hear. But I can't bring myself to watch it. I like how CBS pixelated it out after the first couple times.
HOOVER: To the point, that was actually a very good call on CBS' part.
REILLY: And I thought it was disgusting that Deadspin and other Web sites ran the whole thing, because Kevin Ware's mother is watching this and family. And it's the worst injury I have ever seen. He broke his leg in two places.
People on the bench, his teammates were vomiting. Guys were crying, his teammates. And yet he was taken off. He's had the surgery. He's going to be all right. He's going to take a year to come back, but the idea that you would show that over and over and over on a Web site, I just think that's wrong.
HOOVER: You are a professional sportsman yourself. You haven't been able to watch it yourself.
TAYLOR: No, and like he said, kudos to CBS for pulling it after showing it a couple times and pixelating it. But I couldn't go to Deadspin and watch the whole thing and see the actual ball.
I have been in this situation before on the football field when a 320-pound guy, where a couple of us hit him and his ankle snapped. In the middle of the crowd noise, the play is going on, guys are yelling, you could hear the snap, hear him screaming as he's laying on the ground. And to hear a grown man scream that way is gut-wrenching.
HOOVER: Did you pile on?
TAYLOR: No, we literally got up and ran the other way. And then instantly, the blood is in his sock and you could see it happen.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: So you can't make yourself watch this?
TAYLOR: No, absolutely not. For his teammates sitting right there four feet away having to see this, it's unbelievable.
DEUTSCH: This is an interesting media point. It's interesting.
I was out to dinner that night with a bunch of adults and a bunch of young people. And a 12-year-old boy said, oh, my God, my friend just tweeted me or texted me and said I have got to see this guy's leg break.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: But this is what happens with the media now. We are so fixated.
And thank goodness media outlets all made the right decision.
REILLY: They all didn't.
DEUTSCH: But initially they don't. But it's just in this Twitter world and this tweet world and this quick imagery world, how that's what young people were all of the sudden on.
And I'm so happy that the networks and everybody realized what a horrible thing this was to watch. But it's very hard to keep the genie in the bottle now when these things happen because of the way media is now.
MCENANY: Yes, absolutely.
And I just want to make sure everyone knows just what an awesome guy this kid was. He got hurt. But he was telling his team, win for me. Win for me. Worst pain of his life.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: As they're dragging him off.
MCENANY: As they're dragging him off, win for us, win for us. That is so cool. That's a team.
REILLY: A couple other cool things. Rick Pitino, coach of Louisville, sure have gotten on the team plane and gone back from Indianapolis where the game was to Louisville. He stayed around, spent the night there, was there when the kid got out of surgery to make sure, hey, are you all right?
The other nice thing, there's not much nice in this, but the kid does live in Atlanta. So he gets to go home now. That's where the Final Four is. So he can be at recovery at home. They're going to take him to the game Saturday night. Maybe Louisville wins. He will also be there Monday night for the championship game.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: What does this say about college sports? I mean, some people are saying, look, these college athletes aren't even compensated for what they do. His entire may be blown before...
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: So, what are you saying, pay them?
HOOVER: Well, some people are suggesting you should pay college sports.
(CROSSTALK) REILLY: You would never do it. With Title IX, you would have to pay every single athlete at the school.
It doesn't say anything about college sports, except that I love it. I love the passion of it. The way you're talking about the way these guys cried for him. They all wore his jersey afterwards.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: But what these guys do get, they don't get paid. But let us not forget they get a chance to go to college, a lot of these kids. Let's not minimize them.
By the way, are they exploited? Yes. By the way, does the NCAA make a billion dollars? Yes. But these kids, thousands of kids who ordinarily would not go to college, get a free entrance to college, as well they should.
So let's not go so, oh, my God, the exploitation and boo-hoo-hoo.
And the other thing I'm going so say about this young man, this is a guy who was probably not going to make the pros. He was rated the 76th top sophomore player.
REILLY: He was a backup.
DEUTSCH: He was a backup.
And in a strange way, and this sounds like an amazing kid, once he recuperates, I think he's going to have kind of a hero status, if you will. I think his future, 20, 30, 40 years ago, there may be some silver lining to all of this, because we're so riveted to the story about this young man.
TAYLOR: It will be very difficult for him to come back. You have been around long enough.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: I'm saying outside of sports. I'm saying as a banker or something else, we are now celebrating at this young man.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: ... 10 years from now.
REILLY: You were friends with Joe Theismann. How was he?
TAYLOR: Joe Theismann went through a very horrible situation. But, thankfully, medicine has changed nowadays to where Kevin Ware has a better chance a better chance of coming back than Joe did at that time.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: Joe had a very hard time talking about it. The times I have been around him, he didn't want to speak about it. But I'm sure he's dealt with it and moved on from it.
But it's very, very hard to see it. But we have to understand, when you take the field, whether it's the basketball court, the football field, whatever sport it is, you're taking a risk. When you watch him to jump to block a three-pointer, he's done that a million times.
DEUTSCH: But you're taking a risk and getting paid for it. And that's the big point.
TAYLOR: No, I understand, but for years, I did not. I played high school football and college football and I didn't get paid for it. And I would not change that.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: Theismann did text Kevin.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: And tweet him.
By the way, the other thing people are talking about, 11.7 million Americans tune in to watch "The Bible," the show on The History Channel last night. Everybody is watching it. Everybody is talking about it.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: What does this say about religiosity in the United States? Are you surprised 11.7 million people watched it?
DEUTSCH: No, I'm not surprised. I think it says not as much about religiosity or whatever that word was.
HOOVER: It's a long word.
DEUTSCH: I think it says that we as a country right now are worried. And I'll tell you why it's interesting.
REILLY: Relax.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
DEUTSCH: Come down. Gallup did a poll of 143 countries as far as importance to religion to them.
And actually, the wealthier -- the most affluent countries in the world, religion was less important on a daily basis to people. And the poorest countries in the world, religion was a bigger part of their life. Relax. I'm not saying religion is bad.
But what we tend to do, when things are not good, when we're worried about things, we tend to reach out to religion more. I think the reason "The Bible" was so successful, right now, now more than ever, this country is reaching for religion.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: But, Donny, there's an exception to that statistic, and it's the United States of America, the greatest country on Earth, where 73 percent of citizens profess Christianity as their belief.
This is a country founded on Judeo-Christian values and the minority adhere to those values. There's a minority, like the professor last week, who had his students write Jesus on a piece of paper, rip it up, step on it and stomp on it, and expelled the kid who did not participate in this exercise.
There's a minority who wants to take under God out of the Pledge of Allegiance. But they're the minority . The majority showed up to watch "The Bible."
DEUTSCH: By the way, we all love religion. I'm just saying right now it's hotter than ever.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: The country was not based on Judeo-Christian. It was based on freedom from religion.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: But, no, this nation was founded on Christianity. It's one nation under God. This nation is founded on Christianity. Yes, it was.
DEUTSCH: This nation was founded on independence. It's not founded on Christianity.
TAYLOR: On Christian principles. Put it that way.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: And part of what makes us so great is our religious freedoms. Now, whether it's Judaism or it's Christianity or you're a Presbyterian or whatever, Catholic, whatever it is, you have a right to practice those things here.
So I think the idea of 11.7 million people watching "The Bible" doesn't mean we're afraid of something.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: You asked as a marketer why right now religion may be bigger and hotter than ever.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: Because people realize "Jersey Shore" is not a good show. DEUTSCH: If we went around the table right now and if somebody was losing a loved one or losing a job, we'd probably reach out to religion more. And I think this country is a little worried.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: To your point, we have a secular government. But we have a population that self-identifies its religion.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: I'm sorry. I think it's great that as a society we have 11.7 million people watching "The Bible," as opposed to watching "Jersey Shore" or any of these other myriad of reality shows.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: More people watched "The Walking Dead" last night or the night before than "The Bible."
So people would rather watch zombies than Christ walk across water. It's a great show by Mark Burnett. He didn't take any slants and he knows that the biggest special interest group in this country is Christianity and he played to them.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: You just admitted my point that the biggest special interest group are people in this country who are Christians and profess that belief in our religious...
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: Why do you keep saying Christians? Why do you keep saying Christians?
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: The country wasn't founded on it.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: Because I'm not Christian. I'm Jewish.
MCENANY: But 73 percent of the nation is Christian.
DEUTSCH: Is Judeo-Christian...
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: No, no, no, 73 percent are Christians, but Judeo- Christian values are what I'm referring to it.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: Religion, although obviously a wonderful thing, I think is the great divider in this world.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: It's very interesting, is it's the cause...
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: It underpins our society and the values we have.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: But your values in your religion and my values in my religion are different. Whose are better? Whose are better?
MCENANY: Both of our values. I consider us having common values.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: But a lot of the wall doesn't feel that way. That's the point.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: You know what's in the top 25 most religious countries? Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen. You don't want to go live there, do you?
I don't want religion in my government. I don't want religion underpinning my society.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: You don't have religion in your government. We have a secular government.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: Coming up, a Princeton mom who says the main reason women should go to college is to find a husband. Does she have a point? We will talk about it right after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REILLY: OK, now, where did you get your degree?
HOOVER: Bryn Mawr.
REILLY: And what was your degree?
HOOVER: A women's college, by the way. Spanish-language literature.
REILLY: So did anybody here get an MRS degree?
Did you, Kayleigh? MCENANY: I did not.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: There's a woman...
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: There's a who was in the first graduating class of Princeton who wrote a letter to the school paper saying, women, get your man while you can. Get your Princeton guy before you get out. You will never come across a talent pool like this again.
Here's what she wrote: "Here's what nobody's telling you. Find a husband on campus before you graduate. Yes, I went there. You will never again be surrounded by this concentration of men who are worthy of you."
She said she got married, but she didn't marry a Princeton guy. And that's why it fell apart, because this guy wasn't worthy of her.
So what do you think, Kayleigh? We will start with you. You went to Georgetown. Were you looking for a guy? Is that the whole point?
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: I think that's the point of life for a lot of women is finding a husband and having a family.
And that's certainly what has brought me ultimate happiness is embarking upon that journey. But we have pulled a little bit, a little excerpt out. But we didn't read the broader context. And she was saying just that. She was at a conference and she recognized women weren't asking about her career. They were asking about her finding a husband because they recognized that's what ultimate happiness is. She recognized that and I don't think it's bad that she wrote this letter.
REILLY: Well, you got a career and you have got engaged this weekend. Show the ring.
MCENANY: You can do both. You can do both. This weekend. There you go.
REILLY: All right, so how did you decide you're going to do this vs. go hard at the career? And you didn't do it in college, obviously.
MCENANY: I'm doing both. I'm doing both. I absolutely think you can do both.
But I don't believe that -- the feminists of the third wave want women to believe you cannot be female if you only want to be a stay- at-home mom. And I just think that's incorrect.
REILLY: Uh-oh. Uh-oh. Uh-oh.
HOOVER: I mean, Kayleigh and I gently disagree on this, maybe vehemently disagree on this.
I happen to agree with the part that women have the luxury now to pick whatever path they want. I, however, think that this is like a big April Fools' joke. In 2013, not 1950, women go to college to get a degree, an education, not to become married.
And, by the way, the best, best advice I got when I was in my early 20s was wait until you're a little bit older to hitch your wagon to somebody else, when you know yourself, you have some more experience. By the way, no 22-year-old man knows who he is either. You got to sort of figure out who you are and what makes you tick before you really commit yourself to somebody.
There are always outliers. Kayleigh is young. She's getting married, that's great. We wish you the best. You will have a wonderful marriage. But I think generally, for most people, it behooves you to wait.
DEUTSCH: I think -- I have three daughters. And I think getting married young is not the answer.
Having said that, I understand what this mom is saying. She's making two points. She's making one about what I will call target marketing. You will never be in an environment again with more like- minded people than in a pure social environment.
But I think the more important point is so many guys don't get married until their mid-30s because career, career, career. I don't want anything taking my focus away. Yet, women who do that wake up in their early 30s and they can't flip a switch as easy as far as, OK, tomorrow I'm going to find a husband and they're up against the clock.
REILLY: Why not?
DEUTSCH: Because they have a clock. And, no, no, guys, it's very simple. I really mean that. There are so many women I meet who have just been completely career-focused and all of sudden, they wake up in their mid-30s and they don't have the same time...
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: And they wish they had a woman like this to say this is what's important in life. Focus on this. And the career is important, too. But this is the ultimate focus.
REILLY: This is all elitist crap. She went to Princeton and no one is good enough unless you pick a Princeton guy.
You know who went to Princeton? David Duchovny. Sex addict. You know who went to Princeton? Carl Icahn. Corporate raider. Why must you be with like-minded people? What's so great about meeting people that are exactly like you and marrying them and spend the rest of your life? HOOVER: I want to know what Jason thinks.
TAYLOR: So if you don't go to Princeton, it doesn't work? The rest of us are no good.
REILLY: Exactly.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: I didn't go to Princeton. I can't even spell Princeton. But does that mean everyone else is doomed?
Here's the irony. I love that. Susan Patton has two sons, one of which went to Princeton and graduated. One is currently a student there. I have got two sons, a 10-year-old and an 8-year-old. If my wife kisses them goodbye in front of their friends or gives them a hug goodbye in front of their friends, they're totally embarrassed.
So I can only imagine what Susan Patton's sons -- my mom had to send a letter to the school to get me a date or get me married before I get out of school. It's just -- to me, this whole thing is just bizarre.
DEUTSCH: I find this fascinating coming off the Sandberg thing.
I have never seen an argument, the two sides of the feminist argument where women are so intolerant of the other view of the other side, this whole...
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: As not demonstrated by us.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: We have different views, but we're able to have a very civil conversation about it.
DEUTSCH: They didn't see what was going on backstage.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: Don't try to pretend there was...
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
HOOVER: All right.
And next up, we also have, you know, a bit of contention between Rihanna and Chris Brown. We had Chris Brown on "The Today Show" this morning talking to Matt Lauer. Let's hear what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MATT LAUER, CO-HOST, "THE TODAY SHOW": You understand that if you behave badly again, you're going to damage not only your relationship, but her relations -- her reputation as well.
CHRIS BROWN, MUSICIAN: Absolutely. Absolutely. So that's why I'm moving forward positive.
LAUER: People in this country, it seems, they love to build someone up.
BROWN: And bring them down.
LAUER: And then they enjoy standing on the sidelines and watching as someone goes down.
(CROSSTALK)
LAUER: But it's also been said people like comeback stories.
BROWN: Absolutely.
LAUER: Do you think that the people who have been your harshest critics have it in their hearts to give you a chance at a comeback?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOOVER: So if Rihanna has forgiven Chris Brown, does America need to?
MCENANY: No.
TAYLOR: It's between Chris Brown and Rihanna. Look, she went through a very bad situation a few years ago. Chris Brown has apparently tried to get some counseling, may or may not have done his community service. Whatever it is.
REILLY: Community service monitored by his mother.
TAYLOR: Whatever their situation is, unfortunately, it's played out in the media for all of us because of who they are. But as long as that works for Rihanna, who am I to say?
MCENANY: I take the view that these guys are public figures. And what message does this send to our children?
He beat the crap out of her. We have all seen that horrific picture that makes you cringe. And what message does it send to our children when she takes him back and this guy goes out and starts bar fights?
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: First of all...
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: This whole role model thing, it's very hard when we're asking 18- and 19- and 20-year-olds to be role models.
And I also have a problem, my kids, whether they're going to watch Rihanna or not are going to brought up. They're going to understand they would never tolerate a man hitting them. So many parents now are giving -- oh, if a celebrity does something or the media does something and we're relinquishing the responsibility.
She's not a role model for parents who are on top of their children. And I don't believe that. And it's horrific what he did and I would kill him if he did it my daughter. But the right kids brought up the right way are not going to accept men beating them because Rihanna did.
REILLY: The problem is, I don't care if Rihanna takes him back or not. I'm just not going to believe -- I'm not going to let him get away with saying, I'm a completely changed man. He just threw a chair on "GMA."
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: He punched Frank Ocean, the singer.
He's got a pot prescription supplied by his acupuncturist. There's some holes in the story. By the way, he's like, oh, I'm on a goodwill tour to show the country how I have changed. Let me tell you about how he's changed.
TAYLOR: His new album.
REILLY: He's got a new album, right? Here's a song called "Till I Die." If I may, I'm going to quote from the lyrics.
"Pumps up, hoes down, ass up, nose down, damn bitch, I do it."
Yes, he's really changed.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: By the way, that's rapping.
And I also want to -- there's an interesting there that Lauer was doing that interview, who obviously has been dragged through. And I have to say something. I have been waiting to say this. I know Matt personally and professionally.
I have been on that set three days a week for the last several years. He is a gentleman. I have never seen a talent treat the crew better. He is such a class act, such a fine human being. The reality is Ann Curry, although a delightful woman and a good journalist, was not right for that role.
Everybody knew it. And I actually had dinner with Matt while he was negotiating his contract and said, hey, you're negotiating a contract. I don't think she's the right chemistry. Why don't you find somebody different? He said to me, absolutely not. I would never do that. So why he is getting blamed for this is so absurd. She wasn't right for that job. It's a business. Enough. He's a delightful guy.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: But the behind-the-scenes story that came out of "New York" magazine painted a different picture. And I don't pretend to know Matt. I have never met him. I'm sure he's a wonderful man.
But Ann Curry went to him when she got the job and said, let's go to lunch. I really want some advice from you. And he shunned her. And, you know, Jason, you know this. When you are on a team, your goal is to win the game or, in this case, to put on a good show and act like you get along, despite what is going on behind the scenes.
Matt Lauer was not a team player.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: What -- how can you -- honestly, you're just -- you're wrong. This show is his show. He wanted to do everything possible to make it work. Sometimes, there are things that just aren't working in business and in television and in marriages.
MCENANY: But shouldn't he have made more of an effort, Donny?
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: He made a real effort. I was there. He made year -- a long effort. And it was not his call. And he's one of the best guys around. The fact that he's getting kicked around is ridiculous.
HOOVER: All right.
With that, we're going to take it to opening day. Today is opening day in America. And we're going to get to the point of opening day when we get back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TAYLOR: Today is opening day. Major League Baseball opens up with a moment of silence to remember all of the victims of the Sandy Hook massacre.
Is it possible that opening day says more about America than it does about baseball? My point is, America remembers, but has Washington forgotten?
REILLY: You know, I was at the Super Bowl. I was on the floor when those 26 kids sang.
And I wept. I sat there and I wept. I never cried at a sporting event, just to know that those 26 kids represented 26 that weren't there. And now we're going to this moment of silence and still nothing has happened. It's easy to make a moment of silence. It's much harder to make a moment of sanity. And the Congress -- Congress is not acting. And Obama actually has let them off the hook by waiting so long.
DEUTSCH: My point is Obama blew it. We are a country with, unfortunately, a very short memory.
Not that we will ever forget this, but it becomes obviously less and less part of the daily discussion. If you couldn't get something done 10 days after that, 20 days after that, he blew it. This is, to me -- he was the president. And I have been a big supporter of him. This is one issue he should have just tucked that under his arm and gotten it done.
REILLY: You don't need Joe Biden. You don't need a committee.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: As time goes further away, it's getting harder and harder to get something done.
MCENANY: Donny, I think Obama blew it for a different reason than I think you think Obama blew it.
He blew it by focusing on guns rather than the real issue that could have stopped some of these shootings, which is mental health. You look at Jared Loughner. And I have right here timeline of his mental health. And it's frightening, some of the things you read. Psychologist said she saw signs of schizophrenia.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: There are always going to be nut bags.
MCENANY: But we have -- a classmate of his wrote you will see this guy on the news with an automatic weapon.
And then he shoots 19 people and six died. But this has been ignored because the focus has been on guns.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: It's been politicized.
DEUTSCH: It's not -- it's not -- it's all. You know, to said that we're focused -- we shouldn't focus on guns.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: We haven't heard about mental health.
DEUTSCH: We have heard a lot about it.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: It's not politicized. MCENANY: It's been politicized.
DEUTSCH: No, no, the average American, 90 percent of Americans want automatic weapons out of people's hands. They want background checks. It's that simple.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: Forty percent of guns in this country are purchased without a background check. Can you imagine 40 percent of passengers...
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: Let me finish. Can you imagine 40 percent of passengers getting on your airplane without being checked?
MCENANY: Jared Loughner passed a background check.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: That's one thing.
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: So to Kayleigh's point, what she's saying is, look, we can't just pass laws, blanket laws to make us feel better if they're not going to get to the heart of the problem.
To your point, Donny, I think if the president had run with it, tucked it under and run with it, there would have been a lot of backlash, because people would have said you're dancing on the graves of these children and you're using it to get...
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: So hold on a sec.
Isn't there someplace where we can agree as a country? Look, 89 percent of Republicans are in favor of background checks.
Now, whether...
(CROSSTALK)
HOOVER: There's a lot of places where we can agree.
But this is a contentious issue. This is a contentious issue, not just between Republicans and Democrats, by the way, but also between urban and rural America, who treat guns very differently.
(CROSSTALK)
REILLY: Look, I called all kind of NRA members for this. They don't need 30-magazine bullet chambers. They don't need hundreds. Adam Lanza got off 150 bullets in less than 5 minutes. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jason's trying to get in here. Jason's trying to get in here.
TAYLOR: I have to agree with Donny on this. I think Washington has dropped the ball. President Obama has kind of dropped the ball on this. And I hate to use a football analogy, but...
HOOVER: But you know it...
TAYLOR: But he has to take the football at this point. Immediately after the Sandy Hook incident and just put your head down and run it through.
You know what? We talk about sensitivities and people forcing down somebody's throat. Look, in a week's time, the NRA is sponsoring a race in Texas. Are they dancing on the graves of Sandy Hook? Are they using it for their benefit? Are they throwing it back in our face? President Obama could have got this done. It's not over yet. We still have time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No.
TAYLOR: It needs to be done.
DEUTSCH: Guys, we are a huge -- we are a country of the moment. Forget -- I don't want to make it a gun debate. What I'm saying, as an author, as a businessman. The window was never more wide open. And if you couldn't get it done then, it's not getting done.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Still -- still didn't pass (UNINTELLIGIBLE) reform during that window.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: More of this.
DEUTSCH: ... that way. Do you realize that both Adam Lanza and his mother had NRA certificates they found in the -- in the house? The NRA is half the problem.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... with background checks.
DEUTSCH: Fine. We'll work on mental health. But we at least -- you still need 30-bullet magazines?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That wouldn't have made a difference. It wouldn't have made...
DEUTSCH: He couldn't have gotten off 150 shots in four minutes.
HOOVER: But what we're embodying here is the question across party lines and across the country. People feel very, very strongly about this issue, that there's got to be places where our elected officials can agree on something. And that's -- and that's, I think, what everybody is thirsting for in this country. That's what we're going to see in Congress. TAYLOR: We're never going to -- like Donny said, it needed to be done in that immediate window. And it, unfortunately, was not done.
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: The things that are the most polarizing. The things that take the hardest change, you need something else to make it happen. He had that. That's my point.
We could talk about our gun debate for 17,000 hours. My point as a -- as somebody who is trying to be a change agent, it was never a better moment.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think Margaret is right. Margaret is so right. Let's get something done for these families. We owe it to them. Mental health, let's focus on that. Let's at least give it a shot.
REILLY: When we come back, we're all going to have a drink.
We're going to introduce a segment that's new. Of course, the show is brand-new. And it's a lot like my high school basketball career. It's pointless. And the first pointless winner we have involves the first time I've ever told a Victoria's Secret model to get out of here. We'll be back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
REILLY: Right. So have you heard about this Victoria's Secret model? Her name is Cameron Russell. And she says she feels guilty about -- about making people want the kind of body she has, because it's unattainable for them.
Now, this girl doesn't exercise and doesn't diet. And she says she doesn't want to promote a standard of beauty that most women can't attain. So my point is should we hold a telethon for this girl so she can quit modeling and get back to what is really important? I mean, either stop modeling or shut up. You can't do both, right? That's my pointless person of the day.
DEUTSCH: What is wrong with somebody who has been part of an industry that sees an issue coming forward with it?
REILLY: It's not -- by the way, whether she stops or not, and this isn't -- we all know if you have daughters, the problems that they struggle with weight, I'm going to come back to we think it's the parents' issue.
DEUTSCH: I also want to make another point: men like curves. I still don't understand why we're trying to get them...
REILLY: This is like Jason saying, "I feel bad that I'm 6'5", 240."
DEUTSCH: No. It would be like him coming out -- it would be like him coming out and saying, "We have problems with helmets in the NFL."
REILLY: He won the -- he won the lucky sperm lottery, and he got to be an NFL super star. You do have to work out. She doesn't.
TAYLOR: She's naturally beautiful. Good for her. But she came out and brought an issue forward.
REILLY: She went to Wellesley.
TAYLOR: Do you still think it's pointless?
REILLY: I think it's -- she went to Wellesley. She's got a degree.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have another -- I have another pointless -- I have another pointless story for you guys.
REILLY: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So what did you think of yesterday when you thought of -- you know, yesterday you thought of Easter, I'm sure. It's Easter eggs.
HOOVER: As 78 percent of Americans.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you know who didn't was Google. They thought of it as Cesar Chavez Day, which is why they put him at the top of the Google Doodles that they do, rather than the obvious Easter egg we all think of. It's outrageous.
TAYLOR: Yes, where's the Easter bunny.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's outrageous.
REILLY: The Easter egg isn't religious. It's cultural...
HOOVER: Yes, she's not asking for an image of the vacated tomb. She's just saying have an Easter bunny.
DEUTSCH: Who cares? Who cares? Who cares? What difference does it make? I mean, it's such lunacy to be of concern because Google didn't put an image of -- it's like guys.
REILLY: She said it's pointless.
HOOVER: But here's another one. Why wouldn't you -- why wouldn't you acknowledge Easter? You're Google Doodles. Like, they acknowledge April Fool's Day. They acknowledge, like...
DEUTSCH: Should they do Ramadan? Should there be a menorah the first day of Hanukah. But by the way, there are a lot of people who aren't Jewish in the country. Why -- why do we have to see menorahs?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One year -- getting information for this story, they've never featured Easter. A history of Google -- Google Doodles says they've never featured Easter. HOOVER: So Google features Easter. That's what it needs.
"Points for Trying."
DEUTSCH: OK. "Points for Trying." Budweiser. Bud Light, actually. The new symbol for same-sex marriages is the equals sign. And Bud, like a bunch of other advertisers, came forward. And put two Bud cans as an equal rights there. Equal like this.
I'm going to give them a try, because they were very smart. Obviously, I think a gay audience is probably a little bit more on the target. Why didn't they do it with overall Budweiser?
HOOVER: Yes.
DEUTSCH: Why just hedge a little bit...?
REILLY: You're going to beat them up for that?
DEUTSCH: No, no, no. I said it's a great thing. And by the way, I experience as one of the proudest things in my career was in the early '90s for IKEA, my client, we were the first company with first commercial, we did the first commercial that showed two gay guys shopping for furniture. And we've come -- there had been no gays in advertising. And at the time, I got such vicious hate mail. And we've come such a great, long way that now these huge corporations...
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: ... Budweiser.
REILLY: I love this. I love this. And I hope the Supreme Court comes down on the right side of history. And we know that America's 54 percent for this. That's up 21 percent from ten years ago. This is going to happen. My point is why shouldn't businesses be on the right side of the marketing?
HOOVER: Some people will say, you know, points for trying. This is a bit of slack-tivism, right? This is only online. This is only on Facebook. They changed their little icon. But if they were really serious about things like marriage, they would have signed on this corporate brief, where 200 companies...
(CROSSTALK)
DEUTSCH: But I'm going to say something on behalf of corporations.
HOOVER: ... serving free meals.
DEUTSCH: The only reason they did that is because the owner had come out against it. My point is corporations don't have a moral imperative. They have an imperative to shareholders. And if they can push the common good forward and advance their business -- it's not their job or any other job to push things like marriage. And I'm... TAYLOR: Michael Jordan once said that -- they asked why Michael Jordan never really got involved in political issues. They said look, Republicans choose to. So look, Budweiser put their toe in the water a little bit, a bit of a little something. It's better than nothing.
HOOVER: How about another golfer?
TAYLOR: I'll give you -- I'll give you points for trying.
REILLY: I thought that was despicable, by the way, what Jordan said.
TAYLOR: That he said that?
REILLY: He's never once taken on a cause. He could have supported -- he's never once taken, because how much -- how many yachts can you ski behind, as they said in Greece? How much money do you need to make a stand?
HOOVER: OK. So we're going to come back to "Points for Trying"? There's a golfer? A golfer?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
TAYLOR: Let's get points for trying. Listen, Andreas Harto. Have you seen this guy? He's a Danish golfer. He hit -- he hit a bad shot in a par three. He put the ball in the water. So he goes out in the water, takes his socks and shoes off. Realizes that "I don't want to get my trousers wet, as well," takes them off.
He hits a ball out of the water on his underwear on a par three about fifteen feet from the hole. Now he still -- here's the bad part. He still made bogey. So if I want to hit the ball in the water, I'm not going through all that. You know, just pick a drop, put the ball on the green, make a bogey anyway.
So I'm going to give him "Points for Trying." We're talking about it. He made ESPN. He made TV, so good for him.
REILLY: I don't see why it's a big deal. I cover golfers, a golfer all the time who takes he has pants off: Tiger Woods. So...
DEUTSCH: Ladies and gentlemen, the comedy stylings of Rick Reilly. Live from the Tiki Room.
TAYLOR: Wow.
HOOVER: We're going to -- we are going to pivot to all sorts of pivots for everything these days, Tiger Woods included. But are we overmedicated in America? We've got a new story coming up, and we're going to get to the point on that when we come back.
REILLY: Yes, we are.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HOOVER: Welcome to (GET TO) THE POINT. We're going to be here all week.
So my question is do you think Americans are overmedicated? And the reason I ask this is "The New York Times" crunched the numbers from the CDC, and it turns out that 11 percent of kids, ages 4 through 17, have been diagnosed with ADHD. This is 6.4 million children. By the way, that number is up 50 percent in the last decade.
So are we -- have we just -- is there a new normal, where the kids are? Or are we -- are we overmedicating our children?
DEUTSCH: Neither. It's basically just more information. Look, I, as a kid, would have been diagnosed with ADHD. There's not even a question.
HOOVER: Yes, I can believe that.
DEUTSCH: And I do think we can't say -- oh my God, we're overmedicating. We're overmedicating.
I'm going to make a point I made earlier about parents. No study is going to tell me, if I had a kid that had those needs, whether he needs medication or not. I'd do my own homework.
So I hate these things "we're overmedicating our children." We have more information out there. And so what parents do with it, it's up to them. That's all that says.
REILLY: You just said when you were a kid you would have been ADHD, and you're clearly not ADHD.
DEUTSCH: No, I had the coping skills to be able to navigate around it. Some kids don't.
And by the way, my parents would have made the decision, if I were diagnosed with it, do I need medication or not? We just have more information now.
HOOVER: But do you think is medication necessary?
DEUTSCH: Sometimes yes, sometimes no.
HOOVER: But isn't it possible that we're seeing all these kids and we're just medicating them immediately? In your case...
DEUTSCH: You keep making this, "They are overmedicating." My point is there are more options now, and parents need to have the responsibility whether their kids do or don't need medication.
TAYLOR: But they don't always have that, and that's the problem. I think we're too quick to medicate. You know, I agree with you that we have more information nowadays. So we're diagnosing this more often. Similar to the concussion issue in the NFL. They've always been there. But in the last 10-15 years we're diagnosing these better...
DEUTSCH: So are we overreacting? Are we overmedicating in the NFL?
TAYLOR: Not overmedicating.
DEUTSCH: My point is when we start making changes, does that mean now we're overreacting? Or do we just have more information?
TAYLOR: Well, I think you have to deal with -- I think you deal with each issue differently. Some kids need the medication. Some kids do not need the medication. They may be able -- similar -- I'm sorry, similar to you, they may be able to develop those coping skills to navigate through it.
But I think nowadays, parents are too quick to go to the doctor. And everyone wants to see pills. We get pills and medicine for everything. And I think as we do that, we're becoming increasingly dependent as we become adults.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jason is right on this. You know, I've seen kids laugh and say, "I went to the doctor and convinced him I'm ADHD." Students -- smart kids who got here. Some kids do it because they want the pills. You know, people -- there's a big market for it. Kids would sell their ADD medicine to others. That's why there's a study, 30 percent at the University of Kentucky have used illegal stimulants. It makes you focus.
REILLY: Before tests.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Before tests.
REILLY: And by the way, how come nobody is noticing that energy drinks up are 16 percent at the same time these Ritalin prescriptions are up? Energy -- these energy drinks like Monster Energy gives you 260 milligrams of caffeine. A cup of coffee, 60.
HOOVER: Wow.
REILLY: People are buying these energy drinks, Red Bull, like crazy. And by the way, we also need Ritalin to help you focus. Which is it? I think -- this survey, by the way, was done completely by phone. I think parents want their kids to get in good schools, and they start giving this medicine to these kids.
DEUTSCH: I've got to tell you, I so passionately disagree with this blanket statement. There are certain medications. In all medications, whether they're antidepressants or things that help children and certain ones that don't need to make a blanket statement that's saying parents are giving their kids medication. There are children, it saved certain children's lives.
REILLY: You think OxyContin is overprescribed? That's a drug on the street. And so many parents have got it.
DEUTSCH: That's a narcotic. OK. There's a little bit of a difference between a narcotic...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How about antibiotics? How are antibiotics that are making us, you know, more likely to get some of these, you know, horrific viruses?
DEUTSCH: I just think we, as a country, get into these blanket statements, whereas right now, we have more ability -- over-medication sometimes is a problem. Sometimes it's not.
HOOVER: Is the point over-medication; that is the point, over- diagnosis? Are we just over-diagnosing...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
HOOVER: ... kids with ADHD, and that's not what's normal?
DEUTSCH: My point is the diagnosis could be there. It's for the parents to decide what you do about that. Medication may be the answer. Medication may not be the answer. And so it's -- we can't hide our facts and say there are more diagnoses because there's more information now. It's what you do about it.
TAYLOR: But these doctors are also getting -- doctors will make more money by seeing four patients in an hour and prescribing pills than they will having a 45-minute counseling session.
DEUTSCH: Those are two different things.
TAYLOR: I understand. But -- but what we're over -- this -- I think this leads to helping overmedicate our kids. Instead of having a chance to sit down, like you said, and develop those coping skills. Look...
DEUTSCH: Some kids can't.
TAYLOR: ... if you're in the office for 15 minutes here, we give you a prescription, I make money from the insurance company. Next -- next patient.
REILLY: By the way, the doctors all say this ADHD can be mollified if people -- kids get sleep, get exercise and eat right. And we're getting rid of gym class! There's almost no gym classes left in school. There's a lot of ways to get up to this besides take more Ritalin.
DEUTSCH: Speaking of no gym classes, remember the commercial, "Bacon, bacon, bacon, bacon"? Well, bacon is hotter than ever. What is our obsession -- what is Margaret's obsession -- with bacon? When we come back.
REILLY: Those are so good.
HOOVER: We love bacon.
REILLY: I need more bacon.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DEUTSCH: Guys, who likes bacon? Raise your hand.
HOOVER: Who doesn't like bacon? I'm raising two hands.
DEUTSCH: Who's obsessed with bacon?
HOOVER: I like bacon.
DEUTSCH: We've gotten a little crazy in this country. And right now, Burger King has come out -- we have them here -- with bacon tater tots. Five hundred calories in ten of them. Now, we know that bacon, everybody loves it. But it is part of our obesity in this country.
HOOVER: What do you think? How is it?
DEUTSCH: They're pretty good.
REILLY: You know, I wear bacon cologne. So I'm not a good -- I'm not a good...
DEUTSCH: I want to ask you guys a question. Should we, the same way Mike Bloomberg in New York said, OK, 64-ounce drinks are hurting our health problems in this country, causing obesity, causing the whole economic downfall. Should somebody be stepping in and moderating bacon a little bit?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Have you ever been down south?
DEUTSCH: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is the fillet mignon of the south. I'm a vegetarian, but I eat bacon.
REILLY: Out of her cold, dead hand will you take her bacon.
DEUTSCH: But is there -- is there a line? Is there such a line of gluttony maybe we get to where..?
HOOVER: This is what moderation is about, right? All things in moderation. Bacon, my favorite bumper sticker, my husband has this on a T-shirt, "Bacon. It's meat candy."
REILLY: Speaking -- I mean, Burger King has always been great to bacon. Do you realize Burger King for a while had a bacon sundae? I hope we can show a picture of it. It was ice cream, bacon-flavored ice cream with bacon on top. I thought how great is that?
And I want to show you a dress that you definitely don't want to wear to the dog park. And this is a dress you -- yes, you don't want to wear this to take your dog to the baseball game.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's Lady Gaga's dress?
DEUTSCH: Wow.
REILLY: It's a whole dress made of bacon. How great is that?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wonderful.
TAYLOR: That's disgusting. I'm sorry.
HOOVER: There's a -- there's a SoCal California chain, burger chain in Southern California, that has a burger that is entirely made up of bacon. And then they put bacon on top and bacon cheddar cheese. And then just for fun, they put a cracked egg on the top.
DEUTSCH: I don't want to be the party popper. But somewhere along the line, our entire economy doesn't work because of health care issue. And we've got to stop at some point. But I don't want to be the fuddy duddy, but...
HOOVER: That isn't to say that, just because we like bacon means that's our obesity problem. Sure, we've got an obesity problem, but there's not a causation.
DEUTSCH: Literally, these fast food companies do not stop in the level of lard.
HOOVER: So should we ban all bad foods then?
DEUTSCH: No, that's the problem. It's a problem.
(CROSSTALK)
TAYLOR: I like bacon. I had a double order this morning at breakfast. But there's a restaurant in Miami. You know, they have a great bar. Prime 112.
DEUTSCH: I know it. Yes.
TAYLOR: They have bacon at the bar. They have a cup...
DEUTSCH: In glasses.
TAYLOR: They don't serve bar nuts. They have bacon.
HOOVER: Wow.
TAYLOR: And I will drive 45 minutes from the house to get it.
DEUTSCH: That is a great point.
TAYLOR: But what I will not do, I won't drink more than 16 ounces of soda, though. Keep Buzz (ph) happy, but I'll get my bacon.
DEUTSCH: Speaking of which, the show is almost over, who gets a bonus point? Who made the best point all night?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Margaret gets a bonus point.
HOOVER: For what?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let's do something for the Sandy Hook victims. Like you said, let's do something. We owe it to them and it's sad that we've done nothing so far. REILLY: I say Haley (ph) gets it, because I didn't realize that 30 percent of Georgetown students sell their Ritalin. You just said that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: University of Kentucky.
REILLY: Kentucky. Much different. So good point.
DEUTSCH: I think actually you brought up a point that Michael Jordan has never stood behind anything. And I think at that level -- I think at that level, you have some responsibility. Not take on every issue, but be less concerned about the endorsements. I mean, this is an icon of our times.
HOOVER: I agree with that. I hadn't realized that either. What do you think?
TAYLOR: I want to give a round of applause to Burger King for the bacon tater tots. But I will give a point to Donny. I think for the whole ADHD thing, you can't paint everybody with a broad brush. That every case is individual and different. Because I have friends that have kids that are very, very ADHD, and they have issues with it. So medication works for some. It does not work for others. Parents need to be very, very, very responsible.
DEUTSCH: I'm sorry. I got totally distracted. What did you say?
HOOVER: So have some more bacon. And that's it for THE POINT tonight.
DEUTSCH: Who wins? Before we go -- before we go, I just want to -- my dad is recuperating down in Florida, my best friend in the world. The greatest guy. I love you, Dad. Just want you to know.
HOOVER: All right. So that is THE POINT for tonight. We'll be back again tomorrow night. Thanks for being here. "AC 360" straight ahead.
