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CNN Live Event/Special
CNN International: Brexit Coverage. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired March 29, 2019 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: And a very good evening to you. We should be officially three hours away from Brexit. We are not because of events that happened today.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The ayes to the right, 286; the nos to the left, 344.
(Crowd Cheers)
QUEST: (Voice over) So the nos have it, the nos have it. Again, after the British Parliament rejected the prime minister's withdrawal agreement, Brexit is now set to happen on April the 12th and the people behind me are voicing the anger about the delay.
Following the defeat, Theresa May says the platform is very much - very uncertain.
THERESA MAY, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: The implications of the House's decision are grave. The legal default is now is that United Kingdom is due to leave the European Union on the 12th of April, in just 14 days time. That's not enough time to agree, legislate for and ratify a deal and yet the House is being clear, it will not commit leaving without a deal and so we will have to agree an alternative way forward.
(END VIDEO)
QUEST: The numbers just didn't add up for Theresa May, but the scales have been moving and tipping towards her. Look at the vote totals. Since the first meaningful vote, more MPs have come to her side. We had meaningful vote one, meaningful vote two, and number three with 58 majority against. And finally the withdrawal agreement failed by its smallest margin yet, and it's important to note, Theresa May's agreement got more votes than any of the alternatives put forward earlier in the week in the indicative votes. Bianca is with me. You've been banging on about that fact, all these (inaudible). But I suggest to you that the indicative vote this is week was seen as something akin to a parlor game.
BIANCA NOBILO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes.
QUEST: Next week they will be far more serious.
NOBILO: It was literally that. They were testing the water to try to get a sense of where there might be a majority and then they're going whittle down the options and then vote on the most popular ones next week. So that's exactly...
QUEST: But even here we had MPs discovering them, yes sir, what MPs (inaudible), yes, I just got a version on my Chinese menu.
NOBILO: Yes. (inaudible).
QUEST: Yes, so but -- but I wonder if that changes next Week because ...
NOBILO: It does.
QUEST: You know, look -- you stop me when I'm going wrong here. I'm going to start again, but to stop there. Start again. A no deal is pretty much off the table.
NOBILO: From the lawmakers I've spoken to this evening they think there's a sliver of a chance it could still happen, but as far as the indicative votes go, it's not an option.
QUEST: Fine, so it will be something like Customs Union which then has to be rolled into some form of a withdrawal agreement so she can present it to Europe.
NOBILO: Exactly, and that would need to be negotiated with the E.U. of course because it needs to be agreed on both sides before the summit really on the 10th of April.
QUEST: But the customs union supplants the backstop.
NOBILO: Exactly. This is why people think it has Legs, because it would obviate the need for the backstop. But then you're, looking at the prime minster and her party and her duty as leader to keep it together. What are those Brexiteers going make of that?
QUEST: Don't need them. Don't need them if labor goes along with it.
NOBILO: They're all thinking about Brexit. The prime minster has two duties. She has the prime minster, she needs to deliver Brexit. She is the leader of the Conservative Party and members that I've spoken to believe that if she pursues a softer Brexit, she is going to risk a fracture. She's already had MPs leave and go to the independent group.
QUEST: But is it not possible you have you just have your customers union until you can negotiate your full trade agreement?
NOBILO: There will be concern among Brexiteers that I speak to, they're just going to be roped into that for perpetuity, so they're not going to be keen on
that notion. However, most of them now just want Brexit with the option to harden the relationship in the future rather than no Brexit at all. That's what it's come down to.
QUEST: Isn't it hard to have, well it's not for us to have sympathy one way or the other, but you know what I mean. The hard - the Brexiteers, the hard-line Brexiteers had their chances on numerous occasions to get what they wanted and they didn't. They were stubborn.
NOBILO: It was this was the game of chicken everyone kept referring to and they just made the wrong call. If you're talking about sympathy, I speak to MPs all the time and most of them believe so strongly in what they're standing for, and you have to have a bit of sympathy for those that decided they were going compromise on moral purity even though their colleagues didn't. Now they're sitting there thinking, well I didn't stand by my guns because I wanted to give her a chance of getting it through but some of my colleagues did. There is obviously frustration there. These are politicians.
QUEST: I know that you think I'm too soft on Theresa May about what she's been through in all of this in terms of, shouldn't she get some credit for stubbornness?
NOBILO: I am sure there are character traits that are admirable. Her tenacity, her ability to take so much of flak. She's had huge amounts of criticism heaped on her from all directions. The point I've made to you in the past is simply the way in which she went about the negotiations, many critics said she shouldn't have triggered the Article 50 when she didn't have a plan. She gave away the U.K.'s leverage at the beginning unlike the E.U. whose red lines helps them in negotiation, her red lines ended up boxing her in and taking away a lot of the U.K.'s leverage. (inaudible) isn't the prime minister, but she may not be the best negotiator.
QUEST: No, it's not because of the prime minister. It's criticism of me. Thank you.
Chadwick Corbyn(ph) says it's time for Theresa May to accept her deal is dead. Moments after the speaker announced the vote tally, the leader of the Labour Party and the Westminster Leader of the SMP issued furious calls for the prime minister to move on or move out.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
JEREMY CORBYN, BRITISH LABOUR PARTY LEADER: Mr. Speaker, the House has been clear, this deal now has to change. There has to be an alternative found and if the prime minster can't accept that, then she must go, not at an indeterminate date in the future, but now so that we can decide the future of this country through a general election.
(CROWD CHEERS)
We must give ourselves time, and I suggest to the prime minster, we must now look seriously at the option of revocation. We need to apply the hand brake to this process, and quite simply, Mr. Speaker...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You've messed up.
CORBYN: The prime minster failed to take this deal forward. She does not have to confidence of the house. The prime minster has indicated her departure. She should now go and we should be having a general election.
(CROWD CHEERS) (END VIDEO)
QUEST: Matthew Doyle, served as political director for Tony Blair when he was prime minister, now communications consultant. He joins me now, good to see you, sir.
MATTHEW DOYLE, FORMER POLITICAL DIRECTOR FOR TONY BLAIR: Good to see you too.
QUEST: What a mess.
DOYLE: Absolutely, but one entirely of the prime minister's own making for the very simple reason that we have seen her resistance to doing anything that bring the parliament to a point of consensus. She was boxed in my other own red lines and the inevitable has finally happened that she's run out of road.
QUEST: So parliament will vote next Week on the Monday.
DOYLE: Yes.
QUEST: And I think it's an educated guess that they'll coalesce around some Customs Union?
DOYLE: The Customs Union certainly was the one that had the most support the last time and although people have been saying that tonight's vote did better, let's not forget that tonight's vote was a whipped(ph) vote, so therefore you would've expect the totals to have been higher tonight.
QUEST: But if it is a Customs Union is sort of what it looks like what it is, how do you take that Customs Union, attach it to the withdrawal agreement, which you have to pass any way and then go Brussels next week and say, we need a year or so to work out the modalities but this is what we want.
DOYLE: The short answer is you can't do it in the timetable that we have. We are looking now at there being a longer extension than that May deadline that has been discussed.
QUEST: Right, but when you go to them next week, you ask for the extension, you have got to have a reason to give it to you.
DOYLE: You have and there are commitments that we're going to have to give in return such as having European elections. But frankly, there are worse things in the world than having to hold European elections.
QUEST: But they're going to want to do more than European elections, that's just your - that's just your entry ticket into assets.
DOYLE: Yes.
QUEST: They're going to - I mean, that's a given. You're going to have to say if you give us this extra year or two, we believe what?
DOYLE: Well they have to believe that the prime minster is either going to change herself and therefore the dynamic will change or that she is at least going to come up with a new negotiating strategy. Where you're absolutely right is if they think she is just arguing for more time to have meaningful vote 5, 6, 7, 8, 327, then clearly they're going to say, "No, we've seen this movie and we know how it ends."
QUEST: Right, but at what point do you marry this Customs Union indicative to what they're going to talk -- I mean they're only going let you get an extension of any amount of time if you're basically saying, look, it's looking like we are going to ask you for a Customs Union.
DOYLE: Yes, that's correct and what you therefore can do, is use the Custom Union to replace what was in the political frame work. Because although today's vote was just on the withdrawal agreement, what MPs were very reluctant to do was to give this prime minster or potentially another prime minister a blank check around the future negotiation which we have no idea whether it could be even worse than the one that the DUP and others objected to.
QUEST: Can you see any scenario next week under which the opposition, Labour opposition abstains for MV4 where a Customs Union is attached or there's something. The prime minster basically says, I am prepared to go to them and ask so we can talk about other issues.
DOYLE: I think the only way in which she would win a sufficient number of MPs do that was that if parliament passed what's been called the Kyle Wilson Compromise, i.e. that is that it goes back to the public for a complimentary vote.
QUEST: The Margaret Becket(ph).
DOYLE: Exactly. What was pushed by Margaret Becket in the end and did relatively well within parliament although it ...
QUEST: It was number two wasn't it?
DOYLE: No, it was ahead of the Customs Union. It was the top of the indictive(ph) votes but...
QUEST: But you're still going to have a deal but you're going to go with aren't you and you've still got the question then what you put against it.
DOYLE: Sure, but this has always been the dilemma for Brexiteers. The pursuit of the perfect Brexit versus what they may now risk is whether they're going get any Brexit at all.
QUEST: Have a look at our Brexit-ometer which we will see. We've been tracking the shifts in sentiment with our Brexit-ometer. Now there are a variety of issues. You see, we're going to have a general -- tonight, and this is as we sit tonight, do you think we are looking more at a general election, a no deal Brexit, second referendum, adeal or no deal? What do you think and why?
DOYLE: I think it's between the General election or a second Referendum. Because ultimately the deadlock in parliament has to be broken in some way and my view is that ultimately - the only way that that will be done is going back to the public and I think given the MPs don't want to risk their own jobs, one of those two that they'll go for will ultimately be going back for a second referendum.
QUEST: What is often called a democratic event.
DOYLE: Absolutely.
QUEST: Good to see you, sir.
DOYLE: You too, thank you Richard.
QUEST: April 12th or later, that's when the U.K. could leave the E.U. and it could well at Brussel's discretion. We'll go there live for reaction to parliament's vote in just a moment and we'll swing the Brexit-ometer a few more times.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Donald Tusk, the president Of the European council HAS called An immediate -- I beg your Pardon, an emergency submit on April 10th. That's two days before the date the U.K. is supposed to leave, April 12th. Meanwhile the E.U. commission says it regrets the results as it means Brexit is now happening on April 12th. E.U.'s chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, says they're prepared to discuss and to listen to more options.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
MICHEL BARNIER, E.U. CHIEF BREXIT NEGOTIATOR: We are ready to be even more anxious should the U.K. red line evolve. For instance, we are open to work in the principle of a permanent Customs Union should the U.K. decide to take this path.
(END VIDEO)
QUEST: We want you to join the conversation. Please, your phones and go to cnn.com/join. How should the European Union respond? Now they could ground the U.K.'s short extension. They could run a much longer one or they could insist the U.K. leaves in two week's time with no deal. If we look at it - if it stuck at 59 percent of you say no deal, one seems to coming to the rescue of the U.K. with a long extension. We'll leave it open a bit more to get some more reaction from you. E.U.'s reaction tonight, Erin McLaughlin is in Brussels. I'll bet they can't believe it, I mean just how long and how much more can this misery go on?
ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Unfortunately, it seems they can believe it. This was entirely predicted based on the conversations I was having leading up to the vote. One diplomat telling me that he could not see any feasible way that Theresa May would be able to bring this home in his words. So they prepared for this possibility, Richard, and they're, at this point, looking at two main eventualities. When all is said and done, one being that dreaded no deal, the other one being the prospect of a long extension, but there's divisions here in the E.U. on the question of the long extension. On the one hand you have the French who are saying they want to see a parliamentary majority for something before granting that long extension. We can see as the last few days have played out there in Westminster how difficult it is for parliament to show majority for anything at this point and then you have the Irish who are saying they want the E.U. to be open to a long extension to allow lawmakers there in the U.K. to reach some sort of consensus.
QUEST: What do you make of it tonight? You have covered this as long as I have; you have spent many more hours in the halls of Brussels and once again it's late on a Friday night and there's really - absolutely no certainty. Give me your assessment.
MCLAUGHLIN: If there's one thing that I've learned in the years that I've been covering Brexit Richard, it's don't try to predict the unpredictable. I am constantly surprised when covering this story with each twist and turn. You don't exactly know what's going to happen next, so it's really at this point up to the U.K. and at this point I also see it being up to Theresa May.
QUEST: Erin, thank you. It's late in Brussels. Go and have a drink on us. Thank you.
European stocks, they did not buckle with everything that was going on and they actually ended the week in the green. France led the region. Where the DAX are a decent gain too. FTSE closed high despite anything going on. I don't think that chart shows anything of particular use. You'll just have to take it for me. Wait a minute, there you go. We've pushed the right button and that shows the way that we can deliver the France market having the best of it. Earlier on the express, the former president of the ECB, President Jean-Claude Trichet, predicted the E.U. will grant an extension and it will do so with a caveat.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
JEAN-CLAUDE TRICHET, FORMER PRESIDENT EUROPEAN CENTRAL BANK: Provided there is something which is new in the U.K. decision-making process, whether it is big changes or change of government, maybe a process driving the U.K. to a new referendum, I don't know. But something has to demonstrate that there are good reasons to think that finally the U.K. will take a decision. I have to say, it's a pity that the mother of representative democracy proves that its own House of Commons is not able to choose any solution amongst eight, all rejected. It's amazing. It says a lot on the drama of the representative democracy now in the advanced economy.
QUEST: Could you imagine any European leader, such as for example Emmanuel Macron vetoing - refusing to grant a longer extension? Because at the end of the day, all that Theresa May is likely to say is we want longer to look at various options. So is it possible the French would veto?
TRICHET: No I don't think that it could be a question of one veto or two vetoes. I think they will discuss and try to work out an appropriate consensus because it's so important for everybody so again, I trust that a consensus will be based upon the U.K. demonstrating that they are taking ways to finally have a possibility of deciding, which is not the case today, and provided that the demonstration is presented. It seems to me that there would be a consensus for a longer delay. Let me also say Richard, that as far as I am concerned, I am desperate to see the U.K. staying, but it's a personal bias.
QUEST: Well, yes, and you're not alone in Britain. There are many people in Britain that would like the see Article 50 revoked and Donald Tusk has alluded to that. But you think there is a realization now that the U.K. is going to leave, albeit very messily.
TRICHET: I really trust that the likelyhood is, of course, the U.K. will leave and the great likelihood is the U.K. will leave with a deal and the deal will be accepted by all partners of the U.K. on the one hand and the 27 on the other hand. It was be the reasonable solution. It's not totally excluded frankly speaking when you see the demonstration in the streets of London and also the petition, which is voted by millions of people that the mood is changing in the U.K. So we should exclude absolutely nothing. It is a story in the making under our eyes.
(END VIDEO)
QUEST: Trade on Wall Street ended at the top of the hour, closing out at solid quarterly performance. The DOW traded 200 points up to (inadubile), 0.75 percent gain over the renewed optimism about the U.S. - China trade talks. Interestingly Boeing put on a bit of weight; 1.8 percent and (inaudible) and now Boeing of course because it does suggest that some solution has been arrived at in the MCAS problem and there you see the day. You know what sort of a day it is, our old friend Verizon - Verizon is down at the back end, down just 0.7. where (inaudible) is up 2.3 percent; Boeing up 1.8 percent as I told you. Strong, solid performance that wraps out the week and the DOW has risen four times out of five, which is helping calm waves over slowdown or even a recession. Now in the past few weeks, the fears in Wall Street have grown and grown. Julia Chatterley has more.
JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Call it the warning signs heard around the world. From the United States to Germany, New Zealand to Japan, bond investors are rushing to buy safe-haven treasuries sending bond yields tumbling. Some believe the recent inversion of the U.S. three-month and 10-year bond yields sends the starkest warning sign yet that the U.S. economy might be headed for a recession.
ERIK NIELSEN, GROUP CHIEF ECONOMIST, UNICREDIT: That means that the probability of a recession in the U.S. has increased a lot. We're only maybe one or two quarters away from the more significant slowdown in the U.S. as far as we can see.
CHATTERLEY: Signs of softness have been building in the U.S. for months. Economic growth has weakened over the past two quarters. Corporate profits are expected to post their first quarterly declines in three years and economic growth has been slowing sharply in both Europe and in China. But U.S. consumer confidence remains high. The jobs market is still robust and stocks are near 2019 highs. Some are not so convinced a recession is nearing.
ALICE LEVINE, CHIEF STRATEGIST, BNY MELLON: The economy will be weaker in the first quarter. I think that's no surprise. We actually expect there to be an uptick after that because we see - just see global growth bottoming out.
CHATTERLEY: The stock market bulls have a key ally in their corner if there's trouble ahead -- The U.S. Federal Reserve.
The Fed's recent policy pivot has taken the threat of a U.S. rate hike virtually off the table this year. Some even believe the next Fed move will be a rate cut if the economy weakens further.
MATT CHESLOCK, EQUITY TRADER VIRTU FINANCIAL: That kind of slowing is not good for what we are expecting. So if we go from maybe rate hikes to rate cuts that quickly, the market will go down.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's a hoax. It's a witch-hunt.
QUEST: (voice over) OK, we leave that for a moment. Let us go to President Trump, who is taking questions.
TRUMP: ...coming out with respect to the other side but I have a lot of confidence in the attorney general.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President, are you going to be talking to President Putin about Venezuela?
TRUMP: We will probably be talking at some point. We are looking at Venezuela. Venezuela right now is a big fat mess. The electricity's gone. Power's gone. Fuel is gone. Gasoline for cars is gone. They have a lot of electric cars, that's all gone, because they have no -- they have nothing. What a job. When we talk about socialism, take a look at Venezuela. So I'll be talking to a lot of people, perhaps President Putin, perhaps President Xi of China. My people right now are in China. We are negotiating the trade deal. We'll see what happens; we're doing very well.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did that round of talks go?
TRUMP: I think it's going very well. I mean the trade deal is going very well. We'll see what happens but it's going very well. They're in China right now, the highest level of our people meeting with their people then they'll be coming back here for another round. It's a very comprehensive, to use the word that some people like, some people don't like; I think it's OK, but it is a very comprehensive, very detailed enlisting of problems that we've had with China over the years and it's going to have to be a great deal. If it's not a great deal, we can't do it. We can't do it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you plan to name a new defense secretary soon?
TRUMP: I'm very happy with Pat Shanahan. I think he's done a really great job. We knocked out the caliphate. We have now, if you look at Syria, what happened in a very, very short period of time, far shorter than people said was even possible, we're working together very well on the wall and on the border. I'm very upset with Mexico. I think Mexico is doing a lot of talking.
They have the strongest immigration laws anywhere, anywhere in the world, they probably have the strongest and we have the worst. We have the weakest, the most pathetic, the most laughed at immigration laws anywhere in the world. They're the democrats' laws and I got stuck with them, and I hope Congress is going change them rapidly. They have a lot of opposition from democrats, not because the democrats don't think they would be right in changing them, just because they don't want to make anybody look good. They want no victories. They don't care with the country suffers; they don't want any victories.
We have two brand new caravans coming up if you can believe it; two big ones. And they're coming up and Mexico could stop them very easily. Mexico has a trade surplus with the United States for many years of $100 billion a year at least. This is for many years. Mexico has taken a big portion of our car business. Mexico is doing very well because of the United States and frankly they have to stop the illegal immigration.
We have run out of room. We have this ridiculous catch and release program where you catch them and then you're supposed to release them and you release them into our country and we've been very, very tough and the border patrol has been incredible. I have to tell you. The people in the border patrol, the job they do is unbelievable. ICE, the same thing and law enforcement.
But Mexico is going to have to do something. Otherwise I'm closing the border. I'll just close the border and with the deficit like we have with Mexico and have had for many years, closing the border will be a profit-making operation. When you close the border also you will stop a lot of the drugs from coming in because we take in tremendous drugs from Mexico as you know as well as I do.
So you close up the border and you watch the drugs go way down too, but I will close the border if Mexico doesn't get - get with it. If Mexico doesn't stop it. They come in from Guatemala. They come in from El Salvador. They come in from Honduras. They come in from all over and they come in from Mexico and we're working very hard to stop it. We're building the wall but until the wall is completed and that is really moving along well. In fact we're going to have a news conference very shortly, over the next couple of weeks, at the wall as it's being completed and going up at sections of the wall.
It's moving along rapidly but still, we have a current crisis. We have a crisis. I know that you can go back 30 years and you can go back 40 years but I can't imagine it being any worse than it is right now.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sir, You've had two children die in December in U.S. custody -- migrant children. Do you believe given the rising numbers of migrant families and children at the border, your administration is equipped to handle that in a way that - and tries to ensure children are not die something. TRUMP: Well, I think it's been very well stated that we have done a
fantastic job. One of the children, the father gave the child no water for a long period of time. He actually admitted. The other one was being brought to the hospital on an emergency basis. It is a very tough situation and that trek up is a long, hard trek. And you see what's happening to women. You see what's happening to children. It's a horrible situation and Mexico could stop it right at their southern border.
They have a southern border and they have a border that could be very well structured. It's very easy for them to stop people from coming up and they don't choose to do it. Well, we're not going to give them hundreds of billions of dollars and tell them that they're not going to use their strong immigration laws to help the United States. So there's a very good likelihood that I'll be closing the border next week and that will be just fine with me.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President can you tell us why you will return those North Korean-related sanctions?
TRUMP: I have a very good relationship with Kim Jong-un. He's somebody that I get along with very well. We -- we understand each other. They are suffering greatly in North Korea. They're having a hard time in North Korea, and I just didn't think additional sanctions at this time were necessary. It doesn't mean I don't put them on later, but I didn't think additional sanctions at this time were necessary.
They are suffering greatly. They're having a very hard time In North Korea, and I think because of the relationship -- relationship being a good thing, not a bad thing. I think it's very important that you maintain that relationship at least as long as you can. But we get along very well. We have a very good understanding, so I didn't think that those sanctions were necessary at this time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... make any sense...
TRUMP: No I have not.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Were you upset that your Treasury Department put the sanctions in place, that they were on those paths(ph)?
TRUMP: Not at all because they were intended to go. People thought they would go at that time. They had the right to do that. I just decided that I would not let it happen. In a certain way it's like the Special Olympics. For many years it has not been approved and then at some point it gets negotiated out in Congress. Well, I went down and said we're going to have funding for the Special Olympics. So that's why I approved that.
So a little bit of a similar situation with different parties to put it mildly. So I just want to again, I want to thank the job you've done. I'll tell you what Linda(ph) has been so great and when somebody does that good of a job, I'd rather do it this way than just say bye bye. And so I'm doing it this way and I'll tell you Linda McMahon is a very special person and now she's going to be working with me very hard so that we keep this miracle that we've built. You saw what happened last night in Michigan. We had - if they would really report it, many, many thousands of people outside of the arena. The arena was packed. That arena was absolutely packed last night and there was tremendous love in that arena and you look at what's happening with Michigan and Ohio....
QUEST: (voice over) So President Trump, three notes on what the president said. Describing Venezuela as a big fat mess. He said he's optimistic about the trade deal with China. His top people are there. On Mexico he said, "I'm very upset with Mexico. I'll close the border. I will close the border if Mexico doesn't get with it and stop the illegal immigrants coming across." And there's the president wrapping it up.
We continue tonight. It's born to get a measure of what people think of what's happening outside the Westminster political bubble so we'll head to the country to leave and remain areas.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: Outside parliament, a sense of anger and betrayal. Protesters have taken to the street in protest. Hours before Britian was supposed to depart the European Union for good, thousands of people who voted to leave gathered to voice their demands. It was a simple one - make Brexit happen. The numbers gathered here would draw facts by the millions of people who turned out last Saturday in support of remaining. As the political prowess(ph) continues in parliament, demonstrators from all across Britain voice their frustrations. Matthew Chance has been speaking with several of them throughout the day.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm trifle disappointed.
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CORESPONDENT: Why is that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because I think it's a scandal. We voted to have a referendum.
CHANCE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the outcome is that leave means leave.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There's hope until 11:00 tonight and then we've got to work out what we are going do then.
CHANCE: What do you think should happen?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think that lot need to be kicked out, to be honest.
CHANCE: It's up to a general election?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A general election.
(END VIDEO)
QUEST: It's been a dramatic week of protests in the British capital. Last week demonstrators called to put it to the people, another vote. A million marchers turn out for that one while surveys say the numbers, that's exaggerated slightly there. But here are the pictures of the two turnouts side by side tonight. As (inaudible) earlier, I don't think it's fully reflective because (inaudible) much longer and it was a much longer march but you've got the idea. Parliament Square today certainly was thronged. John Longworth was part of the pro- Brexit march in Sunderland in Northern England to London. He's also the former director general of the British chambers of Commerce. When he joined me, he said people are furious about how Brexit has turned out and he explained why he is taking a different stance from the current chambers.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
JOHN LONGWORTH, CO-CHAIR. LEAVE MEANS LEAVE: The fact is across the country outside this Westminster bubble, people are hugely angry, furious, passionate. They're hooting their horns, coming out supporting that march. There is a massive amount of frustration.
QUEST: Can I ask you, one question I've always wanted to ask you is, how does somebody who is head of the -- former head of the British Chamber of Commerce, when the current chamber, many of the members are vehement remainers, absolute strong remainers, how do you not see the damage that would be caused in the short-term by a no deal Brexit?
LONGWORTH: Had the trade bodies such as that decided in the first place not to put pressure on the government, so the government is simply saying we're leaving on the 29th of March. Here you are, the E.U. if you want a trade deal, we'll give you one.
There would have been absolute certainty and a lot of the problems that business have would (inaudible), all those trade associations put together represent less than 20 percent of businesses and I can tell you this. The British Chambers itself, the only survey they've ever done since the beginning of the referendum campaign was six weeks before the referendum and they did a stratified sample. The only businesses that voted in that survey to remain were businesses that only trade with Europe. The rest of them, those that trade with the rest of the world and domestically, said that they wanted to leave by a majority; that's 90 percent of the economy.
(END VIDEO)
QUEST: Bianca is with me now. At this point on a Friday MPs have normally gone back to their writings and constituencies around Britain.
NOBILO: Yes.
QUEST: At least that's what they're supposed to be doing for the weekend. I suspect many of them are. But what are they saying, what are they tweeting and texting to you?
NOBILO: Actually I text an array of members of parliament.
QUEST: All parties, I hope.
NOBILIO: Of course, balance. What on earth happens now. Just those words. I waited for the reaction and I got a spectrum right from conservatives who are very pessimistic about the future saying well great now next week there's going to be a series of votes. We're going to get trapped to the Custom's Union. Then May is not going to be able to support that so she'll have to resign then Corbyn will be invited to formal government and then he won't make it so then we're going to have to have a general election he was saying.
QUEST: Catastrophizing it's known as.
NOBILO: He said it was a disaster. That they spoke to others that gave me very systematic series of events that could take place, eight or nine possible outcomes for next week. I mean...
QUEST: No, surely not.
NOBILO: ... times we live in.
QUEST: Surely not.
NOBILO: Everything from a general election to the small chance of a no deal, it's an indicative vote.
QUEST: But is it likely on the Chinese menu next week that an election is on there or...
NOBILO: That would be - Corby would be the one to participate that in all likelihood so he would call another vote of "no confidence" in the government, a formal notion which interesting that he didn't do today. It could have been an opportunity for him to do so but he didn't so that would come from the leader of the opposition next week. And the reason why people are saying a general election looks more likely is because parliament clearly, manifestly hasn't been able to resolve this. And it's not necessarily true that an election would be that helpful because according to polling the conservation of parties won't look that different. The thing that would tip the scale would be the leader because Corbyn has come out in favor of a softer Brexit, a customs Union or a second referendum or both.
QUEST: Are they still behind in the polls?
NOBILO: He is still behind in the polls. But he may be replaced by another leader who took a harder stance, that's probably what would move the dial, your dial, the Brexit-barometer.
QUEST: Right, well that's where you'll have a bit of a break at the weekend.
NOBILO: That would be nice.
QUEST: I mean have a life of some sort.
NOBILO: Yes, well here's...
QUEST: You could be reading the Sunday papers and watching the Sunday programs and working out what's going to happen on Monday.
NOBILO: Exactly. That's what all the MPs will be doing as well.
QUEST: We are covering the story so far here but I need to tell you up in other parts of Britian, Nina Dos Santos is in the Northeast Sumerset region. Anna Stewart is doing service in Northern England. Right, Anna, to you first. Take it away. What have you learned this week?
ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we have learned so much. We have been on a tour of Brexit, we have been to all different leave areas in the north and Northeast. We have had some similar messages about the fact that people that voted to leave that I've met at least have not changed their mind. If anything it's hardened their stance. They now want to leave without a deal. They want to leave now. They do not want to wait for any kind of parliamentary consensus and so when I asked them today, what did you think about the fact that the prime minister's deal got voted down a third time. They weren't surprised and frankly they welcomed it. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Brexit is never going happen because the economy remains (inaudible). And if she had - she should have changed that had deal a long time ago.
STEWART: So what would you like to happen now?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We leave with no deal and see what happens.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If we have another referendum that's the end of democracy in this country.
STEWART: What do you think about the prime minister's deal being defeated for a third time?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's a disgrace. As a country voted to get out and the MPs are authorized to get on with that and doing it.
(END VIDEO)
STEWART: Now, this frustration with politicians potentially not listening to people that voted to leave, not delivering on Brexit, that is a common theme we've heard throughout the week in lead areas and I believe, Nina, you've been hearing that as well where you are but this place is very much a labor heartland and there was one man that really surprised me today I guess because he says he has voted for labor every single election. He's in his '70s but this time around in the next election, he will not vote Labour again. In fact, he says he will never vote Labour again. He will actually vote for the U.K. Independence Party because he's entirely lost faith with mainstream politics. Is that what you're hearing because I know you are in a conservative heartland? I think (inaudible) smug. Nina? NINA DOS SANTOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, it's a conservative heartland, this part of the country with smatterings of the more (inaudible) liberal democrat parties but interesting enough, I also have an anecdote about labour voters there as well.
When I went to the conservative club underneath Jacob Rees-Mogg own constituency office just around the corner here in Northeast Somerset, I run into two staunch Labour voters who said, look, we've come here as a bit of a joke to have a beer on his dime if you like. They were extremely agreed to the fact that Jacob Rees-Mogg after staunchly pushing the prime minister to have a hard Brexit, remember that he of course is the chair of that Euro-skeptic flank, the European research group arm of the conservative party that's had so much say over Theresa May's Brexit policy thus far.
He has espoused hard enough clean Brexit but now at the 11th hour and it seems as though the Conservative Party may actually miss out on the opportunity of delivering Brexit for the British people Anna. He has decided today to vote for Theresa May's deal and that caused a lot of consternation on the streets of (inaudible) which is where his constituency is. Take a listen to some of the points of view.
(BEGIN VIDEO)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am just sick to death of the whole thing now because we had our vote three years ago. The majority voted to leave and what are the MPs doing? They're doing everything they can to stop it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well they've messed it all up, haven't they? It should have been a done dusted(ph) job and they've messed it all up. I think now we should just walk away.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe it's a mess but I still believe the voters all unanimously decided we ought to leave today and I think we ought to go ahead and do it.
DOS SANTOS: And you personally decided to leave?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, yes I voted to leave and if I could vote again, I would still vote to leave.
(END VIDEO)
DOS SANTOS: So whether you're talking about leavers in this small part of Summerset or the big bastions of remain like in the city of Bath (ph) where I was yesterday Anna. Obviously you get a lot of people who say, well look at this point, I just want Brexit to be done and dusted. The reminers say we'd like another vote. They're very hopeful that they could campaign for a second referendum. That would be the preferential option. Maybe even revoking Article 50. But the one thing that seems to reunite people up and down the country on either side of the Brexit divide is that basically they're getting bored with it don't you think?
STEWART: Yes, absolutely fed up. We've had that from every single - every single remainer, all Brexit so that we've met in every single leave area we've been to this week. That has been a common theme. I would say one lady I spoke to here in Downcaster(ph), I put this idea that you mentioned a second referendum or cancelling Brexit to her and she said that she would personally organize a rally on the streets. She would take a march on because she feels that would be such a disgrace to politics. I mean Richard, this must feel very different and wide apart from where you are in Westminster.
QUEST: It is but I say to you both, have a good weekend. In fact, have a drink on me, both of you. Anna, you were boasting about the pints being just two pounds a pint. Well, you can afford to have two. That's it for you Nina, have a good weekend.
STEWART: It's just behind me Richard. It's right there.
QUEST: It sounds like you're already having a couple and a few more. We'll be back in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
QUEST: In other news now, and the latest on the Ethiopian airlines crash. A new "Wall Street Journal" report suggests that the anti- stalling system, NCAS, was automatically activated before the 737 Max nosedived and crashed. As the first information based on data retrieved from the black boxes of the plane. For more, Robyn Kriel is in (Inaudible).
ROBYN KRIEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Richard, that information reportedly coming from a high-level FAA briefing. Really a double- edged sword for Boeing. On one hand it's good that the problem has been identified and they can work to fix it, which means additional training for pilots perhaps and software upgrades. But on the other hand, the question everyone is asking is how was this able to happen a second time?
Lion Air crashing in October the reason being faulty MCAS system and then today this reported news coming first from the "Wall Street Journal" that that could have been the reason behind the Ethiopian airline's crash 302 killing 157 people; 8 Americans, people from Britain, people from France, dozens of Kenyans and Ethiopians as well. Ethiopian airlines, though, perhaps would feel vindicated by this information although they have not spoken to us. They've been in a high-level meeting with government all day; that's what we've been told.
But at least then they've taken some heat recently from people saying that perhaps their pilots weren't well trained enough, perhaps it was faulty equipment but now if this indeed turns out to be true, then it would not be pilot error, it would in fact the onus would fall on this MCAS system. CNN was taken in that exact simulator that those two pilots trained on for the Boeing 737 Max 800 and they're - we asked about the - about the MCAS system and whether it was in the quick reference handbook and we were told that it was not. So that means in case of a catastrophic failure like this one that the pilots would have had no way to troubleshoot in any way and indeed they only had six minutes from when the plane took off and the nose would have been pulling down by the faulty system. They would have had no way of fighting the plane to keep it up. Richard, back to you.
QUEST: Robyn, thank you. A dedicated group of Brexiteers swarmed London on Friday. They're frustrated and fed up with parliament on the day that the U.K. was supposed to leave the European Union. Nick Glass caught up with the crowd that made its way onwards.
NICK GLASS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So on the day Britain was originally meant to leave Europe, in they swept, a swelling river of red, white, and blue into the capital, along the Thames to parliament. The Brexiteers marching with their feet, an orderly, noisy procession driven by a collective fury that their vote to leave had yet been implemented.
NIGEL FARAGE, FORMER U.K. INDEPENDENCE PARTY LEADER: We are the real people of this country, and we know, we know that referendum was the first of many great victories. We will get our country back. We will get our independence back. We will get our pride and self-respect back. We are going to win!
(Crowd cheers)
GLASS: (voice over) It all began in the wind and rain along England's Northeast coast almost two weeks ago. A long symbolic march, some 200 miles from Sunderland to London. Nigel Farage set a brisk pace in flat cap and blue trainers, but then for most of the trek they were without him, it, heading south under Blue skies in spring sunshine.
How's it been?
TAZ JENNINGS, :LEAVE MEANS LEAVE" MARCHER: Ups and downs, sore feet. A lot of guys have had blisters.
MARTIN JUDGE, "LEAVE MEANS LEAVE" MARCHER: The first few days, if honest, it was tough because as you remember yourself the gales were blowing down and the feet - the feet did take it but it was getting stronger and stronger and it's been an actually a wonderful experience.
GLASS: Why have you come?
"MAJOR TONY", "LEAVE MEANS LEAVE" MARCHER: I'm marching for democracy. I think it's very important. I spent 30 years in the armed forces fighting for democracy, And now I feel as though I'm being betrayed literally by our politicians in Westminster.
GLASS: Until the final day there were only ever about 100 marches along public roads, they couldn't have managed with many more. A caravan of union jacks receding into the distance.
KEITH DUFFIN, "LEAVE MEANS LEAVE" MARCHER: I'm ex-Navy and I have not experienced camaraderie like this since I left the Navy.
SYLVIA DUFFIN, "LEAVE MEANS LEAVE" MARCHER: Welcome. Thank you.
GLASS: Keith and his wife, Sylvia, both in their 70's weren't up for walking but followed the march in their motor home, tooting their horn much of the way. She came up with the slogan for the back of their vehicle.
SYLVIA DUFFIN: "Parliament, the Voice of Treason."
GLASS: And that's what you think?
SYLVIA DUFFIN: That is what I think.
KEITH DUFFIN: I am absolutely sick to death of the politicians. They get up, on the (inaudible). They say what they think you want to hear and go ahead and do whatever they want do.
GLASS: All along the route, the song stayed pretty much the same.
(GROUP SINGING)
GLASS: Nick Glass, CNN, with the "Leave Means Leave" march.
QUEST: It should have been just two hours from now when the U.K. was leaving the European Union.
Tonight's final profitable Moment. Anyone who remembers the referendum now and I would broadcast all night, And then the invoking of Article 50, one almost felt the date March 29, 2019, would never come and when it did the U.K. probably would not leave. There was always a fear or a thought or a suggestion that something would go wrong somewhere along the way. That indeed is what has happened.
The U.K. hasn't left or won't leave in two hours' time and arguably, come April the 12th in two weeks tonight, it won't leave then either. There will be a fudge or a deal, there will be something put to one side and there will be an extension required. It doesn't really matter what it is. But the point is, should the U.K. leave? That's not for me to say. That's for the voters to say. But the reality is, that if U.K. voters did vote to leave and tonight they haven't and in two weeks it's entirely possible that the U.K. won't leave either which leaves people perhaps legitimately asking what on earth has this been about if at the end of the day, the uncertainty reigns onwards and evermore.
And that's "Quest Means Business" for tonight and I'm Richard Quest in London. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. Have a very good weekend.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
