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Republicans Set to Try to Overturn Election Results; Georgia Run-Off Elections. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired January 05, 2021 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:01:12]

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: And welcome again to our special coverage of Election Day in America continued.

I'm Erin Burnett. And Anderson I are here with you this afternoon covering what is an historic 48 hours for this country. You have got control of the Senate, Joe Biden's agenda, the presidency all hanging in the balance, and today voters in Georgia casting their ballot -- ballots -- I'm sorry -- in that run-off election, with the stakes so high.

The four candidates running all know it. Just listen to their closing messages on the trail today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JON OSSOFF (D), GEORGIA SENATORIAL CANDIDATE: When we win both of these Senate races, we will pass $2,000 stimulus checks immediately for the American people.

I spoke with the president-elect about that personally yesterday.

RAPHAEL WARNOCK (D), GEORGIA SENATORIAL CANDIDATE: But ordinary people, struggling families, working families need somebody in Washington, D.C., who will be thinking about them.

SEN. DAVID PERDUE (R-GA): What's at stake here is, we want to hold the line against this radical socialist agenda. That's why the president came down, but also to protect what we have accomplished in the last four years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: All right, Kelly Loeffler has not spoken yet publicly today.

Anderson, of course, we're going to bring it to you as soon as she does.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: This vote comes as the president and Republican allies on Capitol Hill are trying to thwart the election results. A growing number of Republicans in the House and Senate say they plan to challenge Joe Biden's win tomorrow when Congress meets to tally the electoral votes. The last-ditch effort will ultimately fail, but it does come as Trump is turning up the heat on his vice president to overturn the election tomorrow.

BURNETT: All right, so all of this, we are covering.

So let's start in Georgia with Gary Tuchman. He is in Fulton County, Georgia.

And, Gary, I know you have been talking to voters, people who waited to come in until today and do the vote in person on Election Day. Tell us what you're seeing now.

GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erin, I will tell you that the U.S. Senate represents an entire nation, but it's the people of this state, these people who are about to vote, who will make the decision about who controls the U.S. Senate.

There are about 2,600 polling places in the state of Georgia. They have been open for eight hours now today. They have four more hours to go. And we're here at the Cathedral of Saint Philip. This is in the Buckhead neighborhood of Atlanta in Fulton County.

When the day started, this place was crowded. There were about 50 people out in the cold in the dark when the doors opened at 7:00 a.m. There have been no lines since then. But there's been a steady stream of people coming in to vote. But the story isn't the people who are voting today in Georgia.

That's because early voting was so heavy. There was 15 days of early voting in this county. And you could go to any polling place you want, for example, in this country, about 30 places to go for early voting. There are about 390,000 people in Fulton County who early-voted.

And to give you an idea, in the presidential election in this county, there were 524,000 votes cast. So, 75 percent of that presidential number was early-voting in this election, the Senate election. So it's an extraordinary number of people.

We can tell you the secretary of state, Brad Raffensperger, who's gotten some fame lately, says everything is going smoothly in the state so far. That conversation that he had with President Trump, obviously, a lot of people here are talking about it. The very first voter who came in today was the chairman of the Fulton County Commission.

And the president criticized Georgia, criticized Fulton County. And I asked the leader of Fulton County what he thought about it all.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROBB PITTS, CHAIRMAN, FULTON COUNTY, GEORGIA, BOARD OF COMMISSIONERS: It's a little irritating to wake up and to hear people at the highest positions in the country talking, saying negative things about Fulton County, when I know for a fact that it's not true, because, if it were true, I would be on top of it and would have put a stop to it.

It just did not happen in Fulton County.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TUCHMAN: Erin and Anderson, I want to tell you something very interesting about how much they want people to vote.

[15:05:00]

There's no more mandate for masks. Everyone we have seen has been wearing a mask. But if you come in and you don't want to wear a mask on principle, they will still let you vote.

They will also let you bring in dogs, cats, their pets if you want to. And one more thing. If you have COVID-19, if you're positive for COVID-19, and you really want to vote and you come in here, they will make provisions to allow you to vote, even if they say you're positive. They won't be kicking me out of here.

COOPER: All right.

TUCHMAN: Erin, Anderson, back to you.

COOPER: Gary, thanks very much.

I want to go live to Martin Savidge. He is in Savannah, Georgia.

When do you think we will know the results, Martin?

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, it's a good question.

Obviously -- excuse me -- the polls have to close at 7:00 p.m. But getting to the point that Gary was just making, the tremendous number of early votes that have occurred, that's going to be key here, because, under Georgia law, early votes, especially absentee ballots, can be processed before actually the end of the day today.

They cannot be counted until 7:00 p.m., but they can be processed. And that gives many election boards across the state a real leg up when it comes to numbers. For instance, I was just looking at Cobb County.

So there were 146,000 requests for absentee ballots, of which they have had 108,000 returned. That means they have already processed those. And they're quickly going to be able to add those into the tally.

In this county, Cobb County, you had 69,611 early votes cast. Some are absentee. Some were in person early voting. They too can have those votes standing by, can't enter them into the count yet, but once 7:00 p.m. comes, they can quickly introduce them into the system.

So, in theory, if you look at it, in this county, for instance, it is obvious that you're going to have more people that voted early than will actually vote today. So, the opportunity to move quickly with these tallies is definitely there, due to the overwhelming amount, total of over three million early votes that were cast.

We will have to wait and see. Clearly, everyone's going to be very cautious, because they know what's at stake. And they know that all eyes are on Georgia. But there is a good opportunity tonight we will get a very strong look at what the trends will definitely be.

In this county, for instance, the counting doesn't end until Friday, because there are certain ballots that will have until 5:00 p.m., including overseas ballots. But, by tonight, we may have a very good idea of where the Senate is going.

BURNETT: Yes, very, very interesting. And, as you say, overseas ballots, Martin, and I know in the presidential election that Savannah was a little late as well to report. So we will see if that is precedent of what we will see tonight.

Let's go to John King at the Magic Wall.

So, John, now you're looking, and we're all remembering, right, remember waiting for Savannah, waiting for Savannah, OK, the all- important suburbs, of course, some earlier to report than others when we look back in November.

So, when you put all this together, what do you see? What are the counties that are most crucial tonight to you?

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, let me start with the suburban question, because the suburbs decide close elections all across America. Georgia is no exception when it comes to that.

And the suburbs have been absolutely critical to recent Democratic wins, Joe Biden's win in November, Nancy Pelosi his election to speaker after the midterm elections two years ago. The suburban revolt against President Trump, does it continue today in Georgia, even though President Trump is not on the ballot? That is a critical question.

So let's go back to Georgia on Election Day and election days after. Joe Biden gets an 11,779-vote win in the state, first Democrat to win the state since Bill Clinton in 1992. So, it's competitive for Democrats. They can win, but they need to need to be near perfect.

And one of the places they need to be so, Erin, is in the suburbs. Look at Cobb County, right, to the northwest of Atlanta, suburban area, used to be traditionally Republican. President Trump gets 165,000 votes and change there against Joe Biden. Look what happened.

David Perdue got 169,000 votes, the Republican Senate candidate overperforming the president in that suburb. Why? Because the suburbs in Georgia still lean Republican most of the time, all things being equal. Let's move over to Fulton County.

Look here. This is Atlanta. You think of Fulton County, you think of Atlanta, but it's also the suburbs to the north and the suburbs to the southwest, the Atlanta suburbs absolutely critical, a lot of population growth there in recent years. Look at Senator Perdue back in November, 146,466 votes. You say only

28 percent. He got blown out. But math matters in close elections, 146,000 for Senator Perdue then. Let's look at the presidential race, 137,000 and change for President Trump. David Perdue got 9,000 more votes and change in Fulton County.

In a close election, that can make the difference. So, do these Republican Senate candidates get a normal Georgia turnout in the suburbs? Or does the animus against Trump in the suburbs carry over because of the national implications? That's a giant question today.

BURNETT: That is such a giant question, and, of course, Trump's behavior in all this, right, saying it's rigged and everything else that he has been doing over the past weeks.

So, when you take all of this together -- and, again, this goes back to Martin's point right about in Savannah, where you have got overseas ballots coming in, you have got military ballots, there's more time to count bows.

How long could it be before we know definitively who won these races?

KING: We have a Magic Wall. We could use a magic ball to answer that question.

We don't know. But you just heard Martin and then I heard Gary talking earlier today. Our reporters on the ground are doing a great job. The counties do believe, most of them, that they can do much of the counting tonight.

[15:10:07]

Turnout will not be at the level of a presidential race. It's still off the charts for a run-off election, but they do believe they will get there. But can they get there? Let me just send a note of caution on that, OK, because let's just go back to 2020 and the state of Georgia.

We have early votes. People voted in person. We have the absentee mail-in ballots. We have the people turning out today, just like we did in November, not as many, but still a sizable number of people.

So, Erin, let's remember what happened in the state of Georgia. This is 12:00, right? On November -- let's go -- let me go all the way back to the beginning here. Let me come back to the start here. OK?

And you come in here and you move it up. The first results come in, Joe Biden's ahead. By 8:00 on election night, Donald Trump has a narrow lead. And then we went through. This is midnight. As we move over to the next day, right, Trump's still in the lead; 24 hours later, Trump is still in the lead; 24 hours later, Trump's still in the lead.

Now we're on November 6. We are three full days after the election, and Donald Trump was still leading in Georgia, and then, bang, they keep counting those early votes, the mail-in ballots, the absentee ballots. Joe Biden takes the lead, and then it grows from there, until we get to the end.

I'm not saying that will play out again tonight. But we need to be careful. We need viewers to understand, when you see very early votes, if it's all early votes, Democrats may jump out to a big lead. If it's all Election Day votes, Republicans might jump out to a big lead.

BURNETT: Right.

KING: Patience. We're going to wander through it. We will get there.

BURNETT: Right, right, patience, and for people to understand it takes time. You start counting at 7:00. It doesn't matter when a vote is counted. A fair vote is a fair vote whenever it is counted.

KING: Exactly.

BURNETT: Thank you so much, John.

And so we are learning President Trump and Mike Pence are now coordinating with far right allies in Congress to try and overturn the election results tomorrow. Some prominent Republicans, though, have stepped up.

And just within the past hour, we have started to see a few more saying they are not on board. So we're live at the White House with some new details coming in this hour.

And Joe Biden feeling good about the election in Georgia. Why? What does he know?

Plus, the growing coronavirus catastrophe in California, where new infections are soaring, ambulances waiting hours. Is this the U.K. strain? And what does it mean for the rest of the country?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:16:33]

COOPER: President Trump pressuring Vice President Pence to overturn the election results during his ceremonial role presiding over the Senate certification of the Electoral College tomorrow, but a growing number of Republicans not backing the effort, and even a senior Trump adviser acknowledging it is all but certain to fail.

Kaitlan Collins is live in Washington near the White House.

So, Kaitlan, more and more congressional Republicans refusing to go along with the president's last-minute attempt.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

And, Anderson, the president is keeping a close eye on which senators, which Republican senators are saying they will object tomorrow. Of course, it's a smaller group than the House numbers that we're seeing who have come forward and said they will do so as well. We know that group is going to be potentially near 140, based on what sources have told CNN. And so the president is watching closely who is going to be defending him tomorrow.

So, while these Republicans who are coming forward, who are going to object know this isn't going to go anywhere, and the outcome is still going to be the same tomorrow regardless, what they're weighing is that doing that is going to be worth the political dividends that it pays in the end, because, of course, a lot of these people that you're seeing coming out have political ambitions.

And one of those that is in a very tough spot tomorrow, if you talk to his own advisers, is the vice president, who is now in this open position with the president, where he is pressuring him to make some move tomorrow to disrupt this, potentially delay the certification of the results that, if you speak to people, say Pence just doesn't have that power.

He has the most basic job of anyone on Capitol Hill tomorrow, which is just counting those votes. But the president is refusing to see that way, even -- see it that way, even though multiple people, Anderson, have explained this to the president. The vice president has explained it to him.

He's listening to those other voices who are saying that Pence has a power he does not have.

COOPER: Yes, Kaitlan Collins, thanks very much.

I want to go now to Nia-Malika Henderson, CNN senior political reporter, and Michael Smerconish, CNN political commentator and host of CNN's "SMERCONISH."

So, Nia, we're hearing President Trump, Vice President Pence, they had lunch today, sources telling us Trump has been -- quote -- "confused" as to why Pence can overturn the results of the election as he presides over the joint meeting of Congress tomorrow.

Pence has apparently explained his role as ceremonial. I don't know why the president be confused. He's a fully grown adult and capable of understanding basic concepts. What do you make of this? He's clearly listening to these fringe lawyers like Giuliani, who are sucking up to him and circling around him.

NIA-MALIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: You know, I think that's right, whether it's Giuliani, Michael Flynn, all of the conspiracy theorists who have been around him and things he's reading on the Web as well, all of the things we heard in that call with those Georgia officials.

That is what the president believes. He has ingested all of it. And, listen, in Mike Pence, he has seen someone who has been really, really loyal to him throughout these last four years. So, expectation is not only that somebody like Mike Pence has a kind of absolute authority, but will use that absolute authority to then do something for this president, who also believes he has absolute authority. This isn't surprising from this president. He doesn't really

understand American history, doesn't really understand the Constitution either. So, it isn't surprising at this late date he is still relying on that ignorance and sort of a fantasy view of the American presidency to try to hold onto power.

COOPER: Michael, this lunch that the president's having with Pence today comes after the president said -- talked about Pence in Georgia last night at the rally. And I just want to play that for our viewers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hope Mike Pence comes through for us, I have to tell you.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

TRUMP: I hope that our great vice president, our great vice president comes through for us. He's a great guy. Of course, if he doesn't come through, I won't like him quite as much.

[15:20:07]

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: He always says the quiet parts out loud. I mean, you got to kind of respect that about the president.

(LAUGHTER)

COOPER: He clearly would turn on Pence on a dime. There's no doubt about it.

Pence, I mean, is in an interesting position. I guess, if he wants a career on talk radio or OAN or one of these pro-Trump networks, if he wants a career in the MAGA world, he faces a dilemma of what to do tomorrow, even though, frankly, there's nothing he really can do.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I think Vice President Pence is rather unique, Anderson, in that he's the one individual who comes to mind who has remained in the inner circle for all four years and has never incurred the public wrath of the president.

And with regard to tomorrow, you remember Philippe Petit, I'm sure, the guy who in the '70s walked between the Twin Towers on a tightrope.

COOPER: Yes, of course. Great documentary about him.

SMERCONISH: That's what I'm picturing for Pence.

A fabulous movie. I loved it.

But that's what I picture for Vice President Pence tomorrow, because he's walking at that tightrope. And he doesn't want to anger Trump, because he wants to stay in the good fold, like the rest of them, because he's concerned about the base.

By the same token, I do think of him as a traditionalist who doesn't want to defile the Constitution and his prescribed ministerial role. So, how does he achieve both of those tomorrow? Going to be fascinating to watch.

COOPER: Nia, at least 13 Republican senators are going to vote against certifying Biden's victory tomorrow, or say they will, in what's become this final loyalty test, I guess, to Trump.

Do you expect all of them to actually follow through on that?

HENDERSON: You know, it seems like they will. They have chosen, in some ways, particularly somebody like Ted Cruz, Josh Hawley, they have chosen their path, and that is the path to being Trump fanboys, right?

And you have other people, like Liz Cheney, people like Tim Scott, who've chosen a very different route. They have ambitions too to be the Republican nominee to be the president, but they have chosen a kind of traditional Republicanism, and to really forge their own path, to have their own brand that's separate from this president.

And we know -- again, we talk about the president's loyalty. You can show all sorts of loyalty to him, but the idea that you showing loyalty to him will mean that he's loyal to you forever just isn't the case.

And he's certainly not going to cede his base to anyone not named Trump.

COOPER: I mean, Michael, clearly, for Ted Cruz, Hawley, a couple others, it's -- this is a move to try to set themselves up to get MAGA voters in 2024.

They're also kind of dependent on actually their being responsible senators who will vote the opposite way, because, if they actually got their way, this would be devastating for American democracy. This would be essentially a form of a coup.

SMERCONISH: I hate to be so cynical, but I think it's largely about self-preservation. Who's going to run the risk of a primary in '22 who wants to run for president in '24?

And all of this deference to the president keeps him as the titular head of the Republican Party beyond the 20th.

COOPER: Right, and they're keeping a man titular head of the Republican Party who is going to undercut them any chance he can for his own benefit.

HENDERSON: Exactly.

(LAUGHTER)

COOPER: I don't know why they're -- I mean, it's like Stockholm syndrome. They're, like, continue -- they want -- it's like they don't want a rescue. They want to stay with their captive. It's bizarre.

Michael, Nia-Malika, thank you.

HENDERSON: Thanks, Anderson.

COOPER: Coming up next: Joe Biden says he feels very optimistic about today's run-off elections in Georgia, while Karl Rove, in a private call with donors, says the Republicans will win.

And Dr. Anthony Fauci addressing the slow rollout of vaccines across the country. Will that change in the coming weeks?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:28:45]

BURNETT: President-elect Joe Biden just saying he is optimistic that Democrats Jon Ossoff and Reverend Raphael Warnock will win both of today's Senate run-offs in Georgia.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT-ELECT: Feeling really optimistic about today.

We got to restore a sense of decency and honor and commitment to one another. We got to unite this country. And that's why I'm so excited about the prospects of Jon and the reverend winning this thing.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

BURNETT: All right, let's get to two men who know Georgia well, the best of anyone, Democratic Mayor of Savannah, Georgia, Van Johnson, and conservative radio host Erick Erickson, host of "Atlanta's Evening News With Erick Erickson."

So, thanks to both.

Mayor Johnson, let me start with you.

You heard the president-elect say he's optimistic, excited about the prospects. But there was just a call a few moments ago with GOP election expert Karl Rove with donors, and he says they expect that one million voter turnout today in person. If it happens, he thinks the GOP has victory in hand.

Who do you think has the edge?

VAN JOHNSON (D), MAYOR OF SAVANNAH, GEORGIA: Well, I think it is very clear that the excitement is here, the engagement is here, the motivation is here, the drive is here.

Georgians recognize the very historic place they play at this time in history. And I believe that we will have two new senators by the time this process is over.

BURNETT: Erick, it would be a pretty incredible thing to happen.