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Razor-Thin Margins In Both Georgia Senate Races; Source: Pence Told Trump He Doesn't Have Power To Overturn Election; Largest Outstanding Vote: Early In-Person From DeKalb County. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired January 05, 2021 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
WOLF BLITZER, CNN LEAD POLITICAL ANCHOR, CNN HOST, THE SITUATION ROOM WITH BLITZER: --elections in Georgia. Right now, the Democrats have 48 seats in the U.S. Senate. The Republicans have 50. If the Democrats pick up two, these two seats, in Georgia, it will be 50/50.
The Democrats, though, will be in the majority, because the Vice President of the United States, the incoming Vice President Kamala Harris, will be the Vice President of the United States. She'll be President of the Senate. And, as a result, she'll be able to break the tie, so the Democrats will be in the majority.
Let's go to Amara Walker. She's in Atlanta, for us, right now, watching all of this. And Amara, you have a very, very special guest.
AMARA WALKER, CNN ANCHOR & CORRESPONDENT: I sure do. Gabriel Sterling, the Voting Systems Implementation Manager, for the Secretary of State, is joining me now.
And Gabriel, first of all, thank you for your time, because I know you're at least the second busiest man, in the state, right now.
But you were tweeting this morning, and you were speaking yesterday, literally begging Georgians to go out and vote. You tweeted that again this morning. And you also said, "Please go ahead and vote for the Republican candidates."
If one of the Republican candidates, or both, lose their seats, in the Senate, who would be to blame?
GABRIEL STERLING, GEORGIA VOTING SYSTEM IMPLEMENTATION MANAGER: Well, I'll speak for outside of my role, working for the state. This is the personal opinion that it will fall squarely on the shoulders of President Trump, and his actions, since November 3rd.
WALKER: And why do you say that?
STERLING: Well when you tell people your vote doesn't count, it's been stolen, and people start to believe that, and then you go to the two senators, and tell them to ask Secretary of State, to resign, and trigger a civil war, inside the Republican Party, when your job (ph) is to unite, all of that stems from his decision-making since the November 3rd election.
WALKER: And you say that this all started with his calls, the President's calls, for the Secretary of State, Raffensperger, to resign. And you believe that he singlehandedly divided the Party.
STERLING: Yes.
WALKER: So, we also talked about the fact that you spent a significant amount of time, probably more than you would have ever imagined, fact- checking the President. Tell me what this process has been like for you, and just how much time you actually did spend fact-checking the President and his wild conspiracy theories.
STERLING: Well the big problem you have is people don't understand elections. Elected officials understand elections. Even people who are in elections for a long time don't know all the pieces and parts. So, it's easy to exploits people's ignorance, on those fronts.
And it did turn into a giant game of Whac-A-Mole. If you ever played Whac-A-Mole, it's the same five or six Whac-A-Moles that are coming up, and we had to do the same thing.
I had to knock down State Farm four times, five times, six times, seven times, the fact that Dominion machines didn't do those things over and over again. So, it's continuing to come, and we kept on knocking it down, and he just keeps on persisting on making these false claims.
WALKER: And Wolf, Gabriel Sterling here, also telling me that we are potentially in for a long night, especially seeing the numbers coming in, the absentee ballots, from the deep-Blue counties of Fulton and DeKalb, and that is where the Republicans have taken the heaviest hits, and we're not going to see many more big buckets like that where the Democrats are going to get the votes.
Wolf, back to you.
BLITZER: Keep Gabriel Sterling with you, Amara. I want to get to some questions to him. John King has some questions for him as well.
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT, CNN ANCHOR, INSIDE POLITICS: Yes.
BLITZER: But I want to show what's going on right now. Take a look at this. We have another key race alert right now.
Look at this. 60 percent of the vote is in, and the Democrats' lead has dramatically narrowed so far. On the Raphael Warnock/Kelly Loeffler side, Warnock's lead is now down to 40,573, 50.8 percent, 50.7 percent, now to 49.3 percent, just went down to about 37,000 vote, his lead over Loeffler.
KING: Here.
BLITZER: On the - in the other contest, Jon Ossoff's lead is lower than 20,000 right now, over the Republican David Perdue. 19,414 vote lead for Ossoff. 60 percent of the vote is in.
Gabriel Sterling, let me just ask you, the turnout so far, do we know yet how the Election Day turnout, the people who voted today, in Georgia, how significant was that? Do we have a number?
STERLING: We do not yet because we have to wait for the counties to report it too.
So, I will say we got a lot of reports from the North Georgia area, where the President rallied yesterday. There were lines in Forsyth. There were lines in Cherokee, in these Republican strongholds. And before I came out here, they had not reported anything yet.
BLITZER: Yes.
STERLING: So, we're going to see a lot of changes. It's going to be a lot of clawing and nickel-and-diming, as we get through the night. There's a few more big buckets of the absentee in-person, the early vote, in some of the Blue counties out there.
But we expect the biggest hits to take will be the mail-in ballots, from the Fulton and DeKalb votes. Those came in really early this time, as opposed to last time. But we don't have a really good clear answer on turnout, until the counties report it themselves.
BLITZER: Yes. Well it's very impressive the way, the officials in throughout the state of Georgia are counting these votes right now, 61 percent of the estimated vote.
Gabriel Sterling is now in. John King has a question for you as well.
KING: As I ask you the question, Mr. Sterling, I'm asking you to standby one second, because you just mentioned Cherokee County. It's one of the places I've been waiting for, all night.
And one of the reasons the Democratic leads just dropped, they dropped a lot, I'm going to explain this in steps, they dropped below Jon Ossoff's lead, and at one point, dropped below 10,000, because Cherokee did come in.
[21:05:00]
And you see 68 percent for Senator Perdue, to 32 percent, if you round up for Jon Ossoff, and you see 68 percent for, if you round up for Kelly Loeffler, and 32 percent for Pastor Warnock. The Cherokee County came in, which is the reason, Wolf, the Democratic leads dropped precipitously.
And then we had votes come in from Chatham County, the first big dump of votes from Chatham County, tonight, which pushed the Democrats back up, because Pastor Warnock, getting 68 percent there, and Jon Ossoff getting 68 percent there as well. So, welcome to the seesaw.
And Mr. Sterling, you're very well - you're very familiar with this. You lived through this in the presidential race. I want to "A," thank you for your integrity in that process. I know
you and your colleagues have been under attack, constantly, from the President of the United States, and others, and they're simply making things up. So, thank you for your integrity.
Number two, you understand the stakes here. Not only is the President attacking your state, and your election system, and its integrity, but these two Senate races will determine which Party controls the United States Senate. They will determine, essentially, the tone and tenor of the early days of the Biden administration, after he is inaugurated.
Because of the stakes, I know this is a county-by-county decision, and you work for the state, but has there been any pressure, any requests, any nudging, to the counties, to "Please, stay with it through the night? Let's not let this drag on three days or four days. Can you keep people on hand, and keep counting?"
STERLING: Well let's be fair, John. These election workers have been worked into the ground, through this entire process. We had to do a hand re-tally. We did a recount. We did a regular election. We had a giant absentee ballot program they never had to do before.
So, we have asked them to work as quickly as they can. We're trying to get them to get all the absentee ballots they got in today, in the drop boxes, by 7 o'clock is our cutoff time, to have them all accounted for by 1 o'clock tomorrow.
Now, with the tightness of these races, that could make this go for a little while. But we anticipate a lot of our small counties, they were done. We had had counties that were closed down with every bit of their voting by 8:15 today.
It's really the large counties. They're going to be the ones who have to be really leaned on to a degree. But we're working with them, taking into account, how much work they have done. It's been really great work, under a lot of pressure and a lot of scrutiny.
Now, one of the things that you and your viewers need to be careful of, is when you say Cherokee County is in, every county has three different buckets of votes that are going to come in--
KING: Right.
STERLING: --at different times. We have absentee-by-mail, the early vote, and then the Election Day vote. And those can all come in pieces and parts, but usually big tranches of each one of their time, and they tend to vary as well.
KING: Right.
STERLING: Absentee-by-mail is very Democratic. The Election Day is very Republican.
KING: Well and I agree with your point completely.
We're up to 90 percent of the estimated vote, in Cherokee County. But you're absolutely right. We need to see what comes in behind it. We still have absolutely nothing from the Republican county, to its east, in Forsyth County.
Let me ask you a question as we do go through this. And I agree with you. And I understand and greatly appreciate, trust me, all of us do, the hard work of these election officials, at the local level, and at the state level. Given the stakes, we're just wondering how long it will take.
So, for the universe of that, let's assume we go into tomorrow, in some of these counties. Do you know, or when will you know, the total number of unreturned overseas ballots?
Georgians who live overseas, and Georgians, in the militaries, who might be stationed overseas, they have until Friday, 5 P.M., to return those ballots, if I have it right. When will you know the number that's potentially still out there, as we get into the math, assuming these races are close at the end, of whether they can be called?
STERLING: Well we know the basic number, right now, stands at around 17,000 that are still out there, to come in. And they have to be postmarked by today, and they can be accepted through Friday. Those are the only ballots that can be accepted after 7 o'clock today.
So, the biggest number there could be is 17,000. But our one guarantee is it will be lower than that at the end of the day.
BLITZER: Very interesting. And I want to echo, Gabriel Sterling, exactly what my colleague, and friend, John King said.
We are really appreciative of the enormously important work that you and your colleagues are doing, the Secretary of State, of Georgia, Brad Raffensperger as well. It has not been easy for you. It's not been easy for him, when you are so repeatedly and needlessly, ridiculously attacked by the President of the United States.
If he's watching us right now, what's your message to him?
STERLING: Mr. President, you already lost the state of Georgia. And the thing now is, no matter what you say, you can't undermine the people of Georgia's integrity to know their voting system works, and their vote is going to count, at the end of the day, one way or the other how this election comes out.
BLITZER: Gabriel Sterling, thank you so much for doing. We will stay, obviously, in very, very close touch with you. We really are appreciative of everything you and your colleagues are doing. This has not been easy as - obviously it's been very, very difficult.
Let's take a look at where things stand right now. 63 percent of the estimated vote is now in. 63 percent is now in. The Democrats' lead has narrowed. Raphael Warnock's lead is almost 40,000, over the Republican Kelly Loeffler. Jon Ossoff's lead has gone down to about 12,400, over the Republican David Perdue.
All right, so David Chalian, give us a sense, how much of this vote that we're now seeing 63 percent of the estimated vote is in. How much is it today versus early?
DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: That's right. We're seeing nearly two-thirds, 63 percent of the overall estimated vote is in. You see here, Warnock with 1.3 million, Loeffler with 1.3 million there as well. Of the vote that's in though, we're down to 80 percent of it, Wolf, being early vote.
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Remember, you came to me earlier. We were north of 90 percent. Now it's coming down, as Election Day vote is coming in. So now, our percentage is at 80 percent. We actually expect that to continue to go down.
We think, at the end of the day, our estimate, that 72 percent of the overall vote will have been banked early with early in-person, and absentee-by-mail, Democratic strongholds, if you will, in terms of method of vote.
But why Kelly Loeffler has been closing the gap is because Election Day vote has been coming in. It's the same in the Ossoff and Perdue race. What you see there, again, is 63 percent of the estimated vote is currently in and tallied. Jon Ossoff, 1.36 million. David Perdue, 1.35 million.
How much of it is early vote? Well of the vote that's in, 80 percent of it is early or absentee-by-mail vote, pre-Election Day vote. We think that number is going to come down to 72 percent.
That - so more and more Election Day vote, which overwhelmingly favors Republicans, like David Perdue, in this race, is coming in, and that brings down the percentage overall that is early vote. And that is what Republicans are banking on, big Election Day turnout.
As those votes get counted, you've seen these races tighten, to just a hair, right now. When it was 90 percent, it was like a 7-point race. As the early vote becomes a smaller share of the electorate, Election Day vote comes in, these Republicans make up ground, and these races have narrowed.
BLITZER: Exactly, as we anticipated would be the case, David.
John, it's really, really close right now. 64 percent of the vote is in, and Ossoff's lead is now only 9,000 votes.
KING: And so, watching the seesaw, over the last 15 minutes, 20 minutes, has been fascinating, in the sense that one county, Republican county like Cherokee County, for example, comes in with a big dump of votes. They're up to 90 percent now.
You see the lopsided Republican advantage in both of the races here, and the Democratic leads come down, all right?
Then you see - we saw some votes come in from Chatham County. Warnock is at 32,000. I just want to check right now. Warnock significantly right now, over-performing Jon Ossoff. We'll see if that continues, as we go through it, by 20,000-plus votes there - 25,000-plus votes there.
And you come to Savannah-Chatham, right now. Martin Savidge was telling us earlier, they expect it to speed up the reporting here, because this had been one of the slowest places to start. They're up to 40 percent, right now. You see Jon Ossoff at 68 percent, Pastor Warnock at 68 percent.
This is absolutely critical, as the rest of this vote comes in, from the Savannah area in Chatham County, it's absolutely critical for the Democrats to maintain a big advantage. And I'll explain to you why, in just a minute.
We still have absolutely nothing out of Forsyth County. Of the 159 counties, in the state of Georgia, this is 11th, in terms of population, so not giant, but it is significant, and it is solidly Republican.
If you go back to the 2020 presidential election, Mr. Sterling, who we just spoke to there, this is one of the counties, where there were long lines, lot of people in line, when the polls closed. The expectation is a lot of those people are Republicans.
If you look at what happened in 2020, and if you look at Georgia's history, we still have absolutely nothing from Forsyth County.
So, if you are the Democrats, and you're looking at a 7,000 vote lead there, and a 35,000 vote there, and you know there are a lot of Republican - a lot of Republican votes, to come from Forsyth County, and then a modest number of Republican votes to come from other places, like Coffee County here.
Let's go back to 2020, you look at the presidential race, 6,000 votes. 6,000 votes, right? Not a giant number when you think about statewide, but when you're talking the about the final hours, in the final counties, and Jon Ossoff has a lead of 7,000-plus, right, we don't expect turnout to match the presidential level.
But if the Republican candidates can pick up 3,000, 2,500, pickup, even if turnout is down, if your margins are like that, you pick up 2,000, 3,000 maybe more votes, then you're cutting into those margins from these Republican counties.
So, one of the things we're looking at now is where's the gray, right, where's the gray? Where do we have nothing? And then, we go around, to see, where do we still have 20 percent out or 15 percent out? But one of the big questions right now is "Where is the gray?"
And you have Appling County here, which like Coffee County, is an overwhelmingly Republican county. So again, not a lot of people, but that's just shy of 5,000 votes in the presidential race right there.
The question is when those votes come in tonight, how much ground do the Republicans make up, and can the Democrats offset it somewhere else?
BLITZER: All right, we got a key race alert right now. Take a look at this. 64 percent of the vote is in. David Perdue has now taken a very, very narrow lead over the Democrat Jon Ossoff.
His lead, 787 votes, 787 votes for David Perdue over Jon Ossoff, the Democrat, 50 percent, 50 percent, 1.3 million, 1.3 million, the difference, 787 votes. That lead by Ossoff was incredibly much higher, earlier, not that long ago. Perdue's lead has now gone up to 1,538 votes. 64 percent of the vote is in.
The other contest, Raphael Warnock, he still has a nearly 25,000 vote lead over the Republican Kelly Loeffler. So, we're watching all of this. That lead is now 17,900 right now.
[21:15:00]
John, I just want to go back to the Atlanta suburban counties, whether Gwinnett, DeKalb, Cobb, there's still a lot of votes out there, and these are heavily Democratic counties out there, so there's still plenty of opportunities for the Democrats.
KING: Plenty of opportunities for the Democrats. But also, as we watch the today vote come in, it's absolutely critical. The Democrats will win those counties. The question is do their margins shrink? And do Republicans, through the math, make up some vote?
So, let's start in the biggest one of all that is Fulton County, Atlanta and the suburbs to the north and the southwest.
You see there, Pastor Warnock at 75 percent. This is his home, the Atlanta area. He's the pastor of Ebenezer Baptist Church. You see right here. He's at 75 percent. They're up to 87 percent reporting. Just want to flip over here, Jon Ossoff running a little bit behind, in the home county of Pastor Warnock.
But the Democrats doing there, again, just for context, Joe Biden gets 73 percent, in Fulton County. So, you're looking - you're also looking at the raw numbers. The raw numbers matter.
But your first basic threshold is let's check the percentages. Are we getting our basic metric? And yes, the Democrats are getting their basic metric, exceeding it by a little bit, right now, with about 13 percent still to be counted.
So then you move over to DeKalb. Again, this is - this is a big weight. This is a very big weight because of the size. It is the fourth largest of the 159 counties. We still have 70 percent of the vote to come in.
Democrats will win DeKalb County, at the end. The question is can they keep the margins close to this? Can they run up those numbers, run up those numbers to offset, as I said, I'll show you in a minute, we're waiting for some Republican counties to come in. They are not as big as this. They are not as big as this.
So, when the rest of that votes come in, do the Democrats keep margins? 85 percent, 86 percent, if you round up for Jon Ossoff, 86 percent there, for Raphael Warnock. As this comes in, one of the places to watch, so keep DeKalb in your radar screen, Chatham over to the east, Gwinnett County, again, a lot of votes still to come in.
You're moving away now. As you move away, from the Atlanta Metro area, they tend to be more competitive.
But again, go back to 2020. Joe Biden got 58 percent here. This is not Fulton County, where you're going to get 70 percent-plus. This is not Clayton County, where you're going to get 80 percent-plus. Democrats want to come close to 60 percent here, right?
And so, where are we right now? Come to the Senate races. Right now, Jon Ossoff is above 60 percent, at 65 percent, at 66 percent, if you round up, the same for Pastor Warnock.
But remember, David Chalian just noted, we are getting, throughout most of the state, some of the today vote, the Election Day vote. That tells you, you're still at 34 percent. That tells you most of what we have, if not all of what we have, is early vote, which is disproportionately Democrat.
So, the Democrats will win Gwinnett County. You can bet on that. The question is, can they keep the margins like this, and can they run up the numbers, because they need that math, the raw number. They need that to offset what is going to happen, in some of these other places.
And we just got them. We were waiting for these earlier, Wolf. We had nothing from Forsyth County. We're up to 21 percent right now, 52 percent for Kelly Loeffler here. 52 percent for David Perdue there at 21 percent.
Again, the question is what is this vote, right? And we'll check in with our reporters to see, because if those numbers stay there, that bodes actually pretty well for the Democrats, because if you go back, to the presidential race, Donald Trump got 66 percent of the vote, in Forsyth County.
This is a place where there were still a lot of people in line, at 7 o'clock, when the polls were closing. The lines were an hour long or more throughout the day. This should be Republican country. This should be, if you will, the buffer, right?
You know what's going to happen, if you're a Republican, in Atlanta, in the closing suburbs. You need to offset it here, like the President did. He narrowly lost, but he did what he needed to do, in Forsyth County, or came close anyway, at 21 percent.
If that stays that, if that stays a 5-point race, then the Democrats are in good shape. But I suspect, as we go from the 21 percent, to higher that there are Democrats in Forsyth County, and they voted early and, that's what you're seeing right there.
BLITZER: What are we seeing in Chatham County and Savannah right now?
KING: Right.
BLITZER: That's a Democratic county. KING: It is a Democratic county. And we've been stuck - we were waiting a long time to get any vote. So, we're grateful to see 40 percent, but we're still at 40 percent, and we've been there, for a little bit.
Again, 68 percent for Jon Ossoff, to 32 percent, if you round up, come over here. The Democratic race, for the most part, there are some exceptions, and we'll look at them, if we get later into the night, probably, but they're tracking pretty much here.
Again, 40 percent, this is absolutely essential for the Democrats to run up the raw numbers here, because you're talking about the fifth largest county by population in the state. So, you've got a lot of votes there, as you come up.
And if you pop out, Pastor Warnock now at 13,000 vote - 14,000, if you round up, David Perdue's lead up to 11,000 votes. So we're in the seesaw now as these counties come in. And we're just going to have to wait, and get the rest of them.
But if you're the Democrats, you're going to watch here, you're watching what's still out around here. And if you're the Republicans, this gray has to come in for you, and it has to come in big. If you're the Republicans, those numbers need to get better, in Forsyth County, and when the rest of Cherokee County, you're up to 95 percent now.
So, this is one of the places, where you knew, if you were a Republican, this was going to help you. The question is you've gotten most of your help now. So, if you're going to need votes, you have to find them elsewhere.
BLITZER: Yes. It's really, really close.
KING: Right.
BLITZER: Take a look at the numbers. All right now, look at this, 66 percent of the vote is in. Two-thirds of the vote has now been counted in Georgia. Look at how close it is. Raphael Warnock's lead is 12,395 over Republican Kelly Loeffler. He's got 50.2 percent to 49.8 percent.
[21:20:00]
The other contest, the Republican David Perdue, a mirror image of the Raphael Warnock/Kelly Loeffler contest, Perdue has a lead of more than 14,000 votes, over the Democrat Jon Ossoff, right now, 50.2 percent to 49.8 percent.
Remember, two-thirds of the estimated vote is now in. It is incredibly, John, incredibly close, both of these contests with plenty of votes outstanding.
KING: Yes.
BLITZER: Mirror images right now, but these contests are really close.
KING: Right. And so, as we walk through this, one of the things we will do is, why is David Perdue running stronger than Kelly Loeffler, or why is Jon Ossoff running weaker than Raphael Warnock? And we'll go through that, as we go through the night.
And right now, you're trying to figure out who wins, who's going to win, and will those leads shift? So, you're looking, and again, if you're the Democrats, this is what's happening in both of the campaign war rooms, or four campaign war rooms, actually, is, is you're looking around what's out there.
So, if you're the Democrats, you're looking at Columbus, and the suburbs around it, and you only have about half - half of the vote in, so you think, "OK, we're getting 74 percent. We're getting 74 percent."
How do we do in the election in 2020? Joe Biden got 61 percent. So, that number could come down, as the later vote comes in, right? So, if you're the Democrats, you watch that. You hope to keep you numbers up.
But when you start counting more of the today votes, that's likely to come down, which is, you know, which potentially is not good news for the Democrats. So, you're looking at what's still out and what could happen.
Again, we just mentioned this, but I'll come back to it, Chatham County, and the rest of the vote here is absolutely critical. Democrats need to keep a big margin. Most likely won't stay that big, but they need to keep a very big margin here, as the rest of these votes come in.
And you just come across here, and look, again, we're waiting, absolutely nothing here. The Republicans are going to get an advantage here, could even be a couple thousand votes, could be a few thousand votes, in a county here.
They're going to get an advantage here. Again, could be a couple thousand votes. So, you're thinking about where are the leads now, or if you're Perdue, you have a lead. Can you build your lead? Some of that's going to come from right here.
So, Wolf, one of the questions is what comes in from Chatham, Savannah, and then what's the rest of this? This is the bulk of the vote. Suburbs in America always decide close elections, in Georgia and everywhere else. So, what are we waiting for here? What happens?
First you go to Clayton, south of Atlanta, up to 75 percent. When the rest of that vote comes in, Democrats need it to stay up above 80 percent, as close to 90 percent as they can be because they need math to offset what is happening elsewhere.
You move here to DeKalb, again, we got - we got a little higher now. We're up to 35 percent, Democrats still above 80 percent.
You see the lopsided 97.000 to 19,000? When you think about the margins, right, if you're Jon Ossoff, you need this to continue because you're running behind statewide, right now, so you need to make it up. And this is where you can make it up, as the rest of this vote comes in.
But if David Perdue is more competitive, in these suburbs, especially as you move away, that becomes the issue. So, we're going to have a seesaw.
And you come back over to Fulton County, David Perdue running at 26 percent, if you round up. If you go back to November, he ran, that's the presidential race, let me come here, he ran at 28 percent. So, this is our test.
David Perdue, right now, is in the lead by 14,000 votes statewide, if you look at it. One of the reason - one of the things we did see, in November, is he over-performed President Trump in the suburbs. Will that happen tonight as the rest of these votes come in?
And then, when you look at the other race, come here, come here, sorry, you got to go - come up here, and come here, this one, 590 votes now.
BLITZER: Take a look at this. Raphael Warnock's lead is now only - look at this - only 590 votes over the Republican Kelly Loeffler. He has 1,447,321 votes. She has 1,446,731 votes. Look at how close it is. 590-vote lead for Raphael Warnock.
We'll take a quick break. Much more of our coverage coming up.
[21:25:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: We got a key race alert. Take a look at this.
While we were in the break, Kelly Loeffler, the Republican Senate - Senator, she took the lead over Raphael Warnock, 5,716 vote lead over Raphael Warnock. It's very, very close. This could easily go either way. 68 percent of the estimated vote is in.
David Perdue, the Republican, he still has a lead over the Democrat Jon Ossoff, 31,703 vote lead, 50.5 percent to 49.5 percent. Remember, 68 percent of the vote is in. But there's still plenty of votes left out there. It still could go either way.
Let's take a look at why this is so important, what's going on right now. These two Senate contests will determine the balance of power in the United States Senate.
Right now, the Republicans lead 50. 50 senators on the Republican side, the Democrats have 48. If the Democrats win both, not one, but both of these, it will be 50/50. The Vice President of the United States will be able to break a tie. The Democrats will be in the majority.
But there's still a long way to go. We're watching all of these votes unfold.
Jake over to you. JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST, THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER: A very tight race. It could go either way.
One of the headwinds that you hear, when you talk to Georgia Republicans, is that for the last nine weeks, or 10 weeks, they have had to deal with the fact that President Trump has been fanning the flames of conspiracy theories, because he is unable to accept the fact that he lost the presidential race.
And on that topic, let me bring in Jim Acosta, from the White House, who has some new reporting about that meeting between Vice President Pence and President Trump about Pence presiding over the Senate tomorrow, when Joe Biden officially is awarded and counted the electoral votes.
Jim?
JIM ACOSTA, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Jake. What we're hearing is that this was a tense meeting between the President and the Vice President.
I'm told by a source familiar with this meeting that when the Vice President told the President that he does not have the authority to block certification of President-elect Joe Biden's victory that the President told the Vice President that it could be politically damaging for the Vice President to fail to block this certification tomorrow.
The word I'm told is damaging, that the President relayed to the Vice President, should the Vice President decide to go ahead and allow this process to go forward tomorrow. All indications are at this point that is what the Vice President is going to do.
[21:30:00]
Apparently, the Vice President responded to that by saying - that warning from the President by saying that he doesn't have the authority to do this, and that there may be some outliers out there, who are saying that the Vice President has the authority to do this.
But the Vice President, I'm told, has been told by the White House Counsel's Office that he doesn't have the authority to block certification of Joe Biden's victory. And so, this played out to be quite an intense meeting.
Now, this doesn't mean that Mike Pence is going to go up to Capitol Hill tomorrow, and sort of robotically preside over these proceedings.
I talked to a senior Trump campaign adviser, earlier today, who said Mike Pence is not going to be a wallflower that he is going to go up there, he is going to indicate that he understands the President's concerns.
According to this adviser, Mike Pence shares the President's concerns. But at this point, constitutionally, people around the Vice President, even people inside the Trump campaign believe, there is not much Mike Pence can do at this point.
And so, what we're going to see tomorrow, Jake, is essentially the process playing out, the Vice President, I think, showing some support to the President, some understanding of the President that yes, he's disappointed too that they lost this election.
But Mike Pence is not going to throw himself, on the railroad tracks, tomorrow, from all indications, and he made that clear to the President, earlier today, Jake.
TAPPER: All right, Jim Acosta, thank you so much.
So, what we're being told there, by Jim, is that the Vice President is going to continue with this futile mission of trying to convince President Trump that he is loyal. But he can't undo the election.
The truth of the matter is, as we've discussed before, President Trump demands utter and complete supplication. When he said that he could shoot people on Fifth Avenue, and they wouldn't go against him, he meant that as a compliment.
DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: He did mean it as a compliment.
And look, what Jim was just talking about, all of this drama that's going on, behind the scenes, at the highest level, of the Executive branch, ahead of tomorrow, is so connected to what we're seeing in Georgia, because we don't know what's going to happen. It is very tight.
But, as of right now, we are all talking to Republicans, who are worried about the turnout not being as high, as they anticipated, and saying out loud, "Boy, I wonder"--
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes.
BASH: --"if it could possibly be" - insert sarcasm here - because the President of the United States has spent the past five weeks, talking about the fact that the election was rigged, never mind that phone call yesterday. We don't know what's going to happen, but it is all connected.
PHILLIP: Yes, and I - it makes me think about what Jim just reported, which is one of the things President Trump has said to Pence is that "It's going to hurt you politically, if you don't back me up on this."
Well, what's happening potentially, in Georgia tonight, kind of puts a question mark, on whether the President can actually follow through on some of these threats that he's been making, for the last several months, to disloyal Republicans, saying, "Well if you don't back me up on this, I'm going to have people primary you. My voters are going to come out and punish you."
If tonight, in Georgia, Republican voters don't show up, it's going to be partly because of the President's false claims about voter fraud, as Gabriel Sterling said, but also because he's not on the ballot. And for Republicans looking forward, there are some real questions about what happens to Republican turnout when Donald Trump is not on the ballot. Do those people actually show up?
And can President Trump actually carry out these threats, when he's no longer in office. In 2022 and 2024, can he really muster up the support to carry out retribution against people who don't toe the line?
I don't know that Mike Pence cares about that. I think he's still very concerned about being loyal to President Trump. But a lot of other Republicans, in Washington and elsewhere, should be thinking about that tonight.
TAPPER: Yes, the Vice President really needs to realize what's going on here. He's not getting the blessings of President Trump for 2024. That's just how it is.
Wolf?
BLITZER: All right, Jake.
Take a look at this, another key race alert right now. And, all of a sudden, the Democrat Raphael Warnock has taken the lead over the Republican Kelly Loeffler by almost 20,000 votes, 19,160 votes. He was behind. Now he's ahead, 50.3 percent to 49.70 percent.
75 percent of the estimated vote is now in, impressive how they're counting the vote in Georgia right now.
And Jon Ossoff, the Democrat is closing in on Perdue. He was more significantly ahead, just a little while ago. The Republican David Perdue, he's still ahead, by 5,600 votes, over Jon Ossoff, 50.1 percent to 49.9 percent.
It's close, very close. Both of these Senate runoffs are very, very close right now, with 75 percent of the estimated vote is in. We're watching all of this oh so closely.
Right now, let's go over to John King at the Magic Wall.
These votes, where are they coming in from, right now, to make it as close as it is? All of a sudden, Warnock has a lead of almost 20,000 votes. He was behind just a few minutes ago.
[21:35:00]
KING: The answer to your question is right here, Gwinnett County, suburban Atlanta to the northeast of Atlanta. That was the big report that just came in that "A," put Raphael Warnock from trailing to ahead, and narrowed the other race as well.
David Perdue still on top, but Jon Ossoff closing as well, and you see right here, this is why, A large suburban area, again, to the northeast of Atlanta. 187,000 to 109,000, 84 percent of the voting right now, a big jump in the reporting, in Gwinnett County, 63 percent to 37 percent, if you round up.
If you look at the other race, 63 percent to 37 percent, staying consistent there, David Perdue is outperforming Kelly Loeffler in some other areas, which is why, at the moment, he's still ahead by 5,000 votes, when you come out, and look statewide, 5,600 votes, when you look at it right there, but, now, Raphael Warnock pulling ahead, this race closing as well.
So, the question, Wolf, when you get to this point, 75 percent, statewide, we've been through this. We were through this back in November. And we go through this every close competitive election night, is what's still out there?
And this is where, if you're looking at the map, and you're Republican, as Dana was just making this point, you're getting a little bit nervous. You're getting a little bit nervous. Did we turn out enough voters on Election Day, when we knew we had to?
One place we're looking, Forsyth County, now up to 90 percent. Remember, if we go back an hour, or 90 minutes ago, I kept saying Forsyth County, Cherokee County, can the Republicans come back? These were two of the counties they view it as key for their turnout. They're up to 90 percent now.
Yes, they're winning. 68 percent, in this race, 67 percent, in this race, they're doing what they need to do in Forsyth County, but they're up to 90 percent. They're doing what they needed to do in Cherokee County, but they're up to 95 percent.
BLITZER: Because of Forsyth County, by the way, take a look at this--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --Loeffler is now ahead--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --by 12,000 votes--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --over the Democrat Raphael Warnock.
KING: Right.
BLITZER: She has 50.2 percent to 49.8 percent. 76 percent of the estimated vote is in. Perdue's lead has expanded as a result, the Republican David Perdue. He's up by more than 37,000 votes over the Democrat Jon Ossoff right now. So, these leads, they're swinging--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --back and forth, as a whole bunch come in, but there's still plenty - there's still plenty of Democratic votes outstanding right now that still haven't been counted, especially in those counties around Atlanta. KING: Right. And that's the seesaw, and that is the wonder of the Magic Wall. And we've been through this. And this is why it makes it so interesting, and it makes my job fascinating? I don't want to use the term "Fun." I know people at home have a vested interest in this. But it's fascinating.
As you speak, votes come in. As you speak, votes come in from a place you've been waiting for. Giant vote dump here comes in for the Republicans, Kelly Loeffler, 67 percent, Senator Perdue, 67 percent, 68 percent, if you round up.
The question is, is it enough, right? So, that just swung the race again, a giant report out of Forsyth County. But 89 percent of the estimated vote is in right now. So, you see 12,000 vote lead for Senator Loeffler, 37,000, more significant lead for Senator Perdue. Is it enough?
So, let's focus on the bigger lead. If you're the Democrats, can you get that back? Well the answer is yes, but you're starting to get to the point - where especially for that one, you're starting - number one, the gray areas are mostly Republican. They're not big. But it's 1,000 votes here, 1,200 votes there.
So, what do the Democrats need? Let's start here. It's not the biggest piece, but right here, Chatham County is at 40 percent. When the rest of this vote comes in, Democrats need to keep the margins like that.
A lot of votes there, you see 31 percent to 14 percent. If you can keep math like that, as you go through the rest of them, it's possible to make up thousands of votes, right there, in just one county.
So then, you come over here, Fulton County, 86 percent, that's a lot of the vote, but it still means you've got 14 percent to go, in the largest population center, in the state, in a place where the Democrats are running it up, 75 percent for Raphael Warnock, 74 percent for Jon Ossoff.
So, there are a lot of Democratic votes here still to be counted, even though you're up to 86 percent, because it's the number one population center, more votes here than anywhere else in the state.
And so, then you move around, you come over here to Cobb County, a little bit more competitive, 62 percent to 37 percent, 63 percent to 37 percent, but you're only at half the vote.
Here's the challenge. Here's the challenge. These are the suburbs. You're starting to move away from urban Atlanta.
Can the Democrats keep this margin? Or can the Republicans make up votes here, or as the Democrats get more votes, is it enough to catch up? What will the margins be when we go from 51 percent to 60 percent, 70 percent, and 80 percent?
As David's been saying, throughout the night, David Chalian, this, if you're at 51 percent, is a lot of early votes in this county. The question is, as you get the today votes, can Democrats add, and by how much, do they add, to cut in, to the Republican advantage at the moment?
Come over to Gwinnett County, this is what swung it, before Forsyth County came in, when we had the last big swing, back toward the Democrats, it was here in Gwinnett County, you've got 84 percent counted there.
But still, look at the difference, just shy of 80,000 votes in this race. Similar, 75,000 votes there, when you look at that. When the rest of this comes in, Democrats can expect to add, the question is do they add enough to make up for it?
And I just want to pop around a little bit. This, if you're looking around here, DeKalb is still your biggest pool outstanding. You're at 37 percent.
Democrats running it above, 83 percent if you round up there, 83 percent there, so you're looking at DeKalb, and you're thinking there are thousands, thousands, and thousands of votes still to come there.
[21:40:00]
So, Loeffler ahead, by 17,500, Perdue ahead by 43,000 right now, that one is spreading out a little bit. Why is it spreading out? We're getting more of the Republican votes in the rural parts, when they keep counting. This is tension time in all of the headquarters.
BLITZER: The Democrats are waiting for those big counties--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --in and around Atlanta because there's still plenty of votes outstanding. We'll see what happens.
Let's take another quick break. Much more of our coverage, this is ELECTION NIGHT IN AMERICA CONTINUED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: All right, we got a key race alert right now. The Republicans are ahead right now with 78 percent of the estimated vote in. The Republican Kelly Loeffler, she has a 32,000 vote lead over Raphael Warnock, the Democrat, 50.5 percent to 49.5 percent. 78 percent of the vote is in.
The other Senate contest, the Republican David Perdue has a bigger lead, 58,000. Now, it's gone up to 62,000, almost 63,000 votes over the Democrat, Jon Ossoff, 50.9 percent to 49.1 percent. 78 percent of the estimated vote is now in.
[21:45:00]
The balance of power is so critically important in the U.S. Senate, right now. The Democrats need to win both of these seats to get a 50/50 tie in the U.S. Senate. The Vice President - the new Vice President of the United States will be President of the Senate. The Democrats would then have the majority, if it's 50/50. Right now, these two pickup seats, these two seats are so critically
important to the Republicans and the Democrats. Let's go over to John King, over at the Magic Wall right now.
John, still plenty, it's very close, but still plenty of outstanding votes, especially in and around Atlanta, the biggest populated area of the state.
KING: There are outstanding votes in reliably Democratic areas.
I will say though, Wolf, if having been through a lot of campaigns, over the years, when you're starting to see - when you get around close to 80 percent, you're seeing a lead, in that case, of 37,000 votes, when you round it up a little bit, 61,000 votes, 62,000 votes, if you round it up, 53,000, it just moved.
See? Welcome to live television on Election night. More votes come in, well that's what happens. So, that's why we watch it. So that one went down to 53,000. That one is at 28,000. So, we're going to watch this play out.
Yes, there are places, Democratic areas, where there are a lot of votes, most of them around Atlanta. I'm just going to start over here, because I just want to keep checking.
We have been stuck at 40 percent, in Chatham County, which is where Savannah is, and the suburbs around it, reliably Democratic, very important to Joe Biden's victory, back in November. So, when will that change, and what will it tell us, right?
So, this is very important for the Democrats. And we get more votes here, you see the math right there, it's just shy, you know, you get 17,000 votes right there. So can you match that? As you keep going, can you get your votes into it? That's one place you're going to look in both of the races. That was just one of them there.
Then you come over here, the most votes are here in Fulton County, but you're up to 86 percent of the estimated vote. That can fluctuate a little bit. But you see - you see what it means, that 86 percent, right, 289,000 to 95,000, giant margin. That's enormous.
So, when the rest of that vote comes in, can the Democrats pick up thousands? They need to pick up thousands. They need to pick up 10,000 or more in the votes. That's what you're waiting for to see.
And then you're looking around the Atlanta Metro area, Cobb County, at 51 percent. It's less Democratic than Fulton County, but it's a place where Democrats will make up some math.
And you come over here. This has been the mystery throughout the night. This has been stuck here, for a long time, at 37 percent, in DeKalb County.
Nick Valencia, our Correspondent, earlier, said they were working, and they hope to report more votes. Watch. Watch to see. And if you see the board change quickly and suddenly, it's probably a source of it here.
Then you move over here to Gwinnett. That was the big dump 20 minutes or so ago that moved things for the Democrats. It was then countered by a big Republican county. But we're waiting for the rest of the votes here.
And again, you see, this is the second largest county. So, when you get vote, even - even though you're up to 84 percent, there's still a lot of votes here to be counted. But when you come out here as well, you just look, you're looking at these smaller counties here.
The gray means we have no votes yet. This is a smaller county, only 0.3 percent of the population, 56th out of the 159. But we have no votes yet. This is going to come in Red. Republicans are going to add to their vote totals here, and they're leading at the moment.
This one here is going to come in Red. And Republicans are leading right now. And they're going to add to their total.
So, the question for Democrats, if you're looking at this map, these two, down here, Coffee County here, is going to come in Red, Republicans. It's a smaller county, but Republicans can pick up another 1,000, 1,500, maybe 2,000 votes there, as well as here in Appling County. It will come in Red. The question is how big will the margins be?
And so, if you're the Democrats, and you know that, you're looking, your part of the state is filled in, right? You want to look at the counties that Joe Biden won, back in the election. These are the counties that Joe Biden won.
And now, you look at them now, they've all - they all have votes in right now, except right here, do we have no votes in here, here we go. One small county here, to go back to 2020, and see, it's a very tiny number of votes. So, it's not going to be a significant change when you look at that county right there.
So, let's stay in 2021, and let's come back out, and let's pop out of this to look at the statewide votes. 62,000, if you're the Democrats, and you need to make that up, can you do it?
Yes, still mathematically possible, but you need to start running it, and you need to start here in Chatham County, and then you need a very impressive, when we start to see, when we see the next significant, I just want to check up here, you're up to 95 percent in Richmond. That's Augusta.
Atlanta Metro is your foundation. You're looking for other building blocks. You'd come over here. You're up to 80 percent. So, there's a possibility you get some here, but again, look at the math. It's not the giant math that you see right around Atlanta.
So, you know the Republicans are going to pick up the gray here, and the gray here. The question for the Democrats, and again, in that race, especially 63,000 votes there, 35,000 - 36,000 votes there, if you round up a little bit, Democrats haves to find them, Wolf, and most of them have to come from here.
And so, you see, you're up to 60 percent. Newton County is much more competitive. You might get a few here. But you're not going to get a lot.
You come into Rockdale County, you're up to 95 percent, so you're almost done, can't count on more than a few here.
You come down here to Henry County, you're at 83 percent. It's a smaller County. But Democrats could get a little bit of math here.
Clayton, which is giant for the Democrats, is up to 86 percent though.
[21:50:00]
The question is this could be a place where you pick up some votes. This was critical to Joe Biden, as they - this - go back to election week in America, in November, as we went two days, three days out, and they started counting the mail-in and the early ballots here. Clayton was critical. And then you move up again.
The biggest question for me is when the DeKalb number goes up, are there enough votes to significantly narrow it? This is where the Democrats are going to be watching to see if they have hope. They need to see a down payment from right there.
BLITZER: I want to go to Nick Valencia. He's in DeKalb County for us right now.
What are you picking up over there, Nick?
NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Some new information coming in to us just now here at CNN, from Gabe Sterling, with the Secretary of State's office, Wolf, who tells us, that the largest number of in- person early votes, the largest number is here in DeKalb County, which of course, is a Democratic stronghold.
We have been telling you updates all night here. This is a county that Raphael Warnock and Jon Ossoff desperately need, in order to secure a victory here.
There's been lots of activity inside, a collective effort going on, inside, from officials, in there, to try to get this done. They know all eyes are really on big four, the big four counties here in the state, but specifically, right now, DeKalb County.
Wolf?
BLITZER: All right, thanks very much, Nick.
37 percent of the vote in DeKalb County, John--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --is in. So, there's still plenty of outstanding votes. This is a pretty Democratic county.
KING: It is. And it's now absolutely critical. Again, when you pull out statewide, and you look at the leads, just shy of - well just ahead of 29,000 there, for Senator Loeffler, and a much bigger lead, 56,000, for Senator Perdue.
If you're the Democrats, you know where these have to come here. And it's interesting when Nick says they're still behind there, working.
What it tells me is that they have decided, you come out here, they're at 37 percent right now. Are we going to get one giant reporting of votes that gets us up to 87 percent or higher, or are we going to get them in chunks?
The fact that they have reported nothing for quite some time tells me they're trying to come in with a big, giant report. We'll see if that's the case when it happens.
But if and when it happens, this now, because it's the largest - this is the largest potential pool of Democratic votes, out there, because they're only at 37 percent, in a place as Nick well notes, has been absolutely critical.
You see Jon Ossoff at 83 percent, in the votes we have so far, Raphael Warnock at 83 percent, in the votes we have so far. And you go back to 2020, 83 percent for Joe Biden. The Democrats need to keep it there. But Joe Biden, that's the 100 percent number.
And again, think about this. Joe Biden won the state by 11,000 and change. Look at that margin. Look at that margin. Almost - it is 250,000 votes, just shy of that in DeKalb County.
So, the Democrats need this, and they need it desperately, especially when you look at these numbers, and you're starting to think where can we pull votes?
Again, if you're little - less gray, some Republican votes have come in. Coffee County came in. It's up to 33 percent. As I noted, this one's going to come in like that.
Now again, it's not a giant pool of votes. But it's 2,000 votes. That's 2,000 votes at 33 percent. It's a 2,000 vote margin. If it stays that way, the 66 and 100, it's 6,000 votes, right, if you keep that margin all the way up to the top.
So, assume the Republicans are going to add to their vote totals there. That one just started to come in. Appling County is very similar. It's a little smaller. You're going to get some votes here. Again, could be a thousand add for the Republicans, could be higher than that.
You are looking at the map. The only other Republican county you're waiting on completely is up here. It's a smaller county, but 56 of 159, it's not tiny. There'll be votes for Republicans there.
This all is very much comes down to Chatham County, over here, again, stuck at 40 percent for a long time. It'd be interesting to see Martin Savidge, a couple of hours ago, said they were going to try to do best they can to get most of it in tonight.
So, I expect that we will soon, or relatively soon, see a large vote report, from Chatham County, and then we'll come over here, to DeKalb County, get a large vote report here. Those are the two big places right now. If you are Democrats, you need numbers. You need very, very big numbers.
BLITZER: Yes, DeKalb County, Chatham County, where Savannah is--
KING: Right.
BLITZER: --those are where the Democrats are looking right now if they're going to make up these margins. There's still plenty of outstanding votes, in those two counties alone, for the Democrats.
KING: Yes. There is enough. There is enough. We don't know the total turnout. That has been one of the frustrations, right? We don't know the total turnout. We do know more than 3 million - so let me come back to that actually, and let's look at where we are right now.
So, you're at 2 million, 3.3 million, and you round up there. We know that 3.1 million people, little more than 3 million people voted early. So the question is we don't know the total Election Day turnout.
So, how close to 4 million does that get? That's the question we don't know. But we do know - we do know what's outstanding, right?
So, again, you keep coming around this suburban collar, Gwinnett, up to 89 percent, Fulton at 86 percent, Cobb County, decent chunk of votes, still available to you there, Douglas County is just about full in, you're coming back across Fulton, come down to Henry.
So, for me, yes, there are some votes to be had in Clayton. But here, Rockdale, come up here, to Gwinnett, and this is right there, DeKalb County, and Chatham County, if you're the Democrats, they're the biggest pools out there, and you are waiting. You are waiting. This is nail-biting time.
BLITZER: Yes. We saw Joe Biden come back.
KING: Right.
BLITZER: Based on those counties alone.
KING: Exactly right.
BLITZER: He won by about - a little bit more than 11,000 votes. We'll see if the Democrats can do the same thing right now.
KING: Right.
BLITZER: Very, very close. Our special coverage will continue.
[21:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BLITZER: It's ELECTION NIGHT IN AMERICA CONTINUED.
Take a look at how close it is. A very, very close contest, 79 percent of the estimated vote is in.
The Republican, Kelly Loeffler, she has a 38,000, almost 39,000 vote lead over Raphael Warnock, still plenty of votes outstanding, the Republican David Perdue has a bigger lead, over the Democrat Jon Ossoff, 70,000 vote lead, 51 percent to 49 percent.
These are critically, critically important races right now. The balance of power in the U.S. Senate is going to be determined, if the Democrats win both, not just one, but both of these two Senate contests in Georgia.
It will be 50/50. They will be the majority, because the incoming Vice President is President of the Senate, will be able to break a tie. So, that's why this is so important right now.
We're all waiting, John King, for these Blue counties, these Democratic counties around Atlanta to come in. There is still plenty, plenty of outstanding votes.
KING: There are plenty of outstanding votes. We don't know the exact number, Wolf. But we do know we still have a lot of votes to come in. And yes, we'll look at rural counties as well.
