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GOP Defends Trump, Attacks Federal Charges; Trump Heads to Florida Ahead of Arraignment. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired June 12, 2023 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:53]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to CNN's special coverage of the federal indictment of Donald Trump. I'm Jake Tapper.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: And I'm Erin Burnett.

And, right now, former President Trump, of course, Jake, is on his way to Miami, where he will make his federal court appearance in a little over 24 hours. It is an unprecedented moment. It's an historic moment. It's a test for the justice system in America.

The former president set to be arraigned on those 37 felony counts over handling classified documents. And sources tell CNN that Trump is expected to meet with his lawyers ahead of Tuesday's appearance. But it is unclear as of now who that -- what that means, because we don't know who the former president is actually going to be able to formally hire to represent him.

We do know that, right now, intense security preparations are under way in South Florida. And we have a news conference coming your way shortly. Officials will hold a conference to talk more about the security preparations to ramp up security, Jake, in the next hour.

TAPPER: Yes, we do know that the FBI is tracking potential threats, as violent rhetoric surges online, that some prominent right-wing figures are calling on Trump supporters to gather outside the courthouse.

We have seen some bizarre tweets from members of Congress who support Trump. But even as Trump and some of his top allies are claiming he's being targeted and unfairly treated by the Justice Department, his own former Attorney General Bill Barr does not see it that way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAM BARR, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: If even half of it is true, then he's toast. I mean, it's a -- it's a pretty -- it's a very detailed indictment. And it's very, very damning.

And this idea of presenting Trump as a victim here, a victim of a witch-hunt, is ridiculous.

(END VIDEO CLIP) TAPPER: CNN's Evan Perez and Paula Reid are outside the federal courthouse in Miami for us right now.

Evan, to you first. You have some new reporting on how special counsel Jack Smith ultimately decided to bring charges against Trump in Florida and not in Washington, D.C. Tell us more about that.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Jake.

It's a decision, certainly, that surprised a lot of people, but I'm told that behind the scenes some of the preparations to do just that, to bring the case here in the Southern District of Florida, began taking shape several months ago.

We know that one of the things Jack Smith's team had the benefit of was a Miami-based prosecutor. Her name is Karen Gilbert. She actually supervised the last case involving Mar-a-Lago. It's a Chinese national who had snuck her way into Mar-a-Lago. That was back in 2019, when Donald Trump was still president.

She helped oversee some of the steps before prosecutors carried out that search, that extraordinary search, that we saw of Mar-a-Lago last August. And so we know that, behind the scenes, Jake, the prosecution knew that the issue of venue was going to present itself. The fact is that Mar-a-Lago is down here.

The former president left Washington hours before Donald Trump -- before Joe Biden was sworn in as president. And so that meant that, most likely, the best place to bring this case and the most natural place to bring this case was here in Florida.

It poses a number of issues for prosecutors, which I'm sure you guys have already talked about. One of them is, of course, this is probably a friendlier jury pool for Donald Trump, compared to the one in Washington, D.C., where the grand jury has been hearing a lot of the evidence.

Secondly, we know that one of the big pieces of evidence, Jake, the issue of the recordings -- or, rather, the notes taken by Evan Corcoran, Donald Trump's own lawyer, which is going to be a big part of this case, all of that was litigated in the courts in Washington.

You can bet Donald Trump's lawyers are going to want to take another crack at that when they get to a judge here in the Southern District of Florida -- Jake.

BURNETT: All right, Evan, it's interesting.

TAPPER: Yes, Evan -- Erin.

(CROSSTALK)

BURNETT: Yes, Jake.

Paula, I'm curious here on the back of what Evan was talking about, about venue. I mean, there's also who's going to represent him, as Jake was indicating, right?

Two of Trump's attorneys resigning just hours after the indictment is unsealed. Now he's looking for new attorneys who will represent him in Florida. It doesn't appear to have just been easily snap your fingers and people are running to do it, right?

[13:05:02]

What more do you know?

PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: That's exactly right.

It is challenging for the former president to find people willing to represent him. This has been an issue for him for the past several years throughout various criminal investigations. We know, for example, in Washington, D.C., over time, he's reached out to many of the big firms.

And they have declined to represent him, based on a variety of factors, including concerns about getting paid, concerns about the impact on their reputation, and also worries about alienating other clients.

Now, at this point, he is represented by Todd Blanche. He's sort of taking over after the departure of pretty much all the other lawyers who have been representing him in this investigation, including John Rowley, Jim Trusty, and Tim Parlatore.

They're looking to bring on additional counsel, perhaps based here in Florida. Now, tomorrow, they do have at least one attorney, Lindsey Halligan, who has been on the team for quite some time. She is admitted to practice here in the Southern District of Florida. So, even if they aren't able to bring on any additional attorneys by tomorrow, they still likely will be able to get Todd Blanche sort of waived in, go through all the paperwork to do that, because she is admitted here.

And, right now, it's unclear who in the state of Florida is going to be willing to join this team. I know I have spoken with the sources I have worked with and other cases down here. There have been some people who have raised their hand and said, in fact, they would like to work on this case.

But I'm told none of them have been hired at this point. We have also learned from other -- from our other reporters here that some people have turned them down already. So, clearly, they're still in the process of searching.

And, Erin, it's unclear if he will have his full legal team up and ready to go tomorrow. It seems unlikely. But, either way, he has the people in place that he needs to at least get through the arraignment.

BURNETT: That's just amazing.

All right. Well, let's bring in our panel. And let me just start with you, John Miller, our chief law enforcement expert, on what Paula just was saying to Jake and me.

So, it could -- look, she said there's -- I want to be clear. She said there's some people who may be interested. So we don't want to act like nobody wants to do it, but it shouldn't be this way in a normal case. It shouldn't be this hard to find people. You shouldn't have concerns about the client paying you.

Shouldn't be so worried that you're going to offend your other clients that you don't want to take the case. I mean, it's pretty incredible to hear this.

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, I think the lawyer they're bringing down from New York was a top lawyer at Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft who actually had to resign the firm, a white-shoe law firm down on Wall Street, to take on the Trump case.

So there are certain firms that just don't want to be dragged into this. Donald Trump is famous for not paying his lawyers or for stalling those payments. But he's also got this $100 million PAC fund, which has made it easier to pay him -- pay them with money he couldn't use for other things.

So we have seen that merry-go-round go around, with Parlatore leaving, and then Trusty, and then another and then another. A lot of this friction has to do with the structure of how the criminal defense works...

BURNETT: Yes.

MILLER: ... which is what they have described as everybody has to go through Boris Epshteyn, who happens to be a lawyer, but not a practicing attorney. And there's been a lot of tension about having that buffer between them and the client.

BURNETT: And certainly mentioned Tim Parlatore. He was very clear that's the reason he left.

Karen, how much of this comes down to, though, lawyers who were going to read through this indictment and come to the same conclusion that Bill Barr came to and Jonathan Turley came to, right, people -- Jonathan Turley, who has defended the former president on many other things, whether it be Alvin Bragg or other things, who are saying, this is bad?

KAREN FRIEDMAN AGNIFILO, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Like, every criminal defendant, anyone charged with a crime, has a right to an attorney. And criminal defense attorneys are used to representing people who are guilty or who are accused of very serious things.

So I don't think that's really the issue here.

BURNETT: OK. FRIEDMAN AGNIFILO: I think the issue here, in addition to what John was saying, is, look, Evan Corcoran, one of his lawyers is now turning out to be one of the main witnesses in the case.

And what he was saying was, at one point, Trump was saying, oh, wouldn't it be great if they don't find documents and made a plucking motion, as if to say, take the documents out.

BURNETT: Yes.

FRIEDMAN AGNIFILO: And then they won't find them.

He's asking his lawyers to commit crimes for him and with him, which is why all of those communications which are normally privileged are no longer shielded by the attorney-client privilege.

BURNETT: Right, because, where there's a crime alleged, you lose the privilege.

FRIEDMAN AGNIFILO: Yes, it's -- yes, it's called the crime-fraud exception.

And so really, as a lawyer, you're going to be asked to do things and -- that are unethical and potentially illegal. And I don't know a lot of lawyers who are willing -- willing to do that.

BURNETT: Right, which is interesting. They have a belief in the system. You take on a client, even if you believe them to be guilty, because you believe in the system.

But you wouldn't do something illicit where, if the president is going to come to you, the former president, and ask you to lie or cheat. That's an issue. And that is what is laid out in the indictment.

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Right.

And, I mean, we have also heard other examples. One of his attorneys, Alina Habba, at one point was fired over -- fined over $900,000. There's liability that comes with representing Donald Trump. It's the same reason he's struggled to hire really credible staff even on the campaign and the reelection side of things, because you expose yourself to things like Walt Nauta is now seeing, where you yourself could be guilty of committing a crime under his purview.

[13:10:00]

But taking a step back, what I think I'm so struck by in this is, is, this indictment, I think, is worse than Donald Trump's greatest detractors could have dreamt up, 37 counts, the level of specificity, the details, the imagery, the pictures.

And we -- I remember all of us discussing at one point, it's going to ultimately come down to the kind of intelligence that this had. And, of course, we will never know the fine details of it. But we're talking nuclear secrets, Five Eyes intelligence, the most sensitive intelligence, sitting at a country club in a bathroom with the chandelier.

This is a pretty clear-cut case, in the eyes of just the American public. I don't know how he's going to find a strong defense.

BURNETT: And what about the eyes of the American public? What about the Republican voters, right, in terms of how serious -- the classified document charges are serious.

Only 38 percent of Republicans think they're serious; 80 percent of Republicans say that they would vote for Trump even if he was convicted in a primary. These are pretty stunning, because, I mean, I think we can all just acknowledge that, if this indictment came out, and you have these pictures and all of these actions about Joe Biden, those Republicans would feel differently.

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Well...

BURNETT: OK? I mean, we all -- I could just put that out there.

So, does anything change it for them, Scott?

JENNINGS: You know, not yet, and it hasn't yet, and there may be more legal issues to come for him. And so I guess we will have to see if the weight of it ever changes their mind. I'm dubious that it will.

I mean, we live in a shirts-and-skins kind of world.

BURNETT: Right.

JENNINGS: And if somebody on your team is being accused of something, your immediate reaction to it is to discount it.

I do think some of this speaks to the level of distrust in the institution of the Department of Justice and the FBI. Republicans have just completely pulled away from the idea that they are a credible organization that deserves to be listened to, which is, to me -- the failure of trust in institutions, the crumbling of that is one of the most troubling things about it all, however this case, turns out, whether he gets convicted whether he gets elected president, never goes to trial.

I don't know. But at some point, we're all Americans. We're all in this together. We all live under the same government. But it only really works if we all basically believe that the institutions are treating us all the same. And that's what you hear Republicans say, is that we don't feel like we're being treated the same.

BURNETT: And -- Mondaire?

MONDAIRE JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: And that erosion of trust in our institutions hasn't occurred in a vacuum.

I mean, there was literally a committee within the House Judiciary Committee called the Weaponization of Government Committee, not for legitimate purposes, but rather to use misinformation and disinformation to sow distrust of the FBI, of the Department of Justice.

This is this erosion of faith in our institutions has come directly at the hands of prominent Republicans, including, chief among them, Donald Trump.

Just taking a step back, as someone who has represented difficult clients in the past...

(LAUGHTER)

BURNETT: Difficult, I like the word.

(LAUGHTER)

JONES: Like, it is extraordinary that very few people want to actually represent the former president of the United States of America.

And Karen took the words right out of my mouth. It's not that -- it's not just that people think that he's probably guilty. I mean, people represent guilty clients and people they know to be guilty or feel to be guilty all the time.

BURNETT: As Karen was saying, yes

JONES: It's that you are likely to get into trouble yourself by even associating with him or being in his presence.

I mean, it is exceedingly difficult to pierce the attorney-client privilege. I mean, there has to be strong evidence. I mean, that is exceedingly difficult to do.

BURNETT: Yes.

JONES: But this is someone, Donald Trump, who cannot help himself but have conversations that are in furtherance of crimes.

BURNETT: Yes. All right, all stay with me, please, as Jake and I continue.

Soon, Miami officials will hold a news conference on the security measures for the federal courthouse and surrounding areas. We're going to bring that to you live.

Meantime, some of Donald Trump supporters are ramping up the violent rhetoric, invoking the world war, and, in the case of defeated Arizona gubernatorial candidate Kari Lake, warning that millions of Trump supporters millions, millions, millions are -- quote -- "card-carrying members of the NRA."

Plus, who is Walt Nauta? You heard we just mention him. How the Navy veteran went from a loyal Trump aide to his co-defendant -- all of this as our special coverage continues.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:18:04]

TAPPER: Just minutes from now, Miami officials will hold a press conference to discuss security measures ahead of Trump's court appearance tomorrow.

CNN has now learned of mounting security concerns from law enforcement over a large number of Trump supporters expected to gather outside the federal courthouse tomorrow. Law enforcement officials in South Florida are already ramping up security outside the Miami courthouse. Police canine dogs were spotted sniffing around the courthouse today. Barricades are also going up around the building.

CNN's Carlos Suarez joins us now.

Carlos, what are we expecting to hear from officials? And what more are you learning about these concerns?

CARLOS SUAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jake, the Miami Police Department really has not provided any information on exactly what their security presence is going to be outside of the federal courthouse in downtown Miami.

As you noted, there is going to be a news conference come 2:00 where the chief of police, as well as the mayor of Miami, Francis Suarez, they're expected to answer some questions on exactly just the number of officers they're going to -- they're going to have outside of the federal courthouse building.

And I'm being told they may be announcing some street closures in and around the downtown Miami area. Now, law enforcement sources have told CNN that a group of FBI agents have been assigned to a domestic terrorism squad to identify any possible threats to the federal courthouse in downtown Miami, and that they're also keeping a close eye on the Proud Boys.

Apparently, the group, some of the members have been communicating with each other on traveling to South Florida here. And so the FBI, as well as law enforcement agents are keeping a close eye on exactly what some of those communications might be.

Jake, overall, the security posture outside of the courthouse is one that you would expect when we're talking about a federal building, considering that it's, one, a brand-new federal courthouse. There's an old one across the street. The U.S. attorney's office is also there. And then you have got the federal detention center.

[13:20:02]

That said, though, going into Tuesday, there is an understanding that they're going to have to increase their overall security posture -- Jake.

TAPPER: Yes.

And, Carlos, we're hearing bellicose rhetoric coming from the president, members of -- some members of Congress, some of his allies. How is that rhetoric, that online bluster, how is it impacting the law enforcement reaction?

SUAREZ: Well, the law enforcement agents across South Florida are taking all of that into account.

In conversations I had with folks within the Miami-Dade Police Department, they told me that they were aware of some of these social media posts. They were keeping a close eye on the rhetoric that was being used not only on social media, but by some of these elected officials.

Over the weekend, the former Republican candidate for governor in Arizona Kari Lake, she made some comments about the indictment that have brought a great deal of criticism her way for some of the language that she used. Here's a portion of what she said over the weekend.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KARI LAKE (R), FORMER ARIZONA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: We're at war, people. If you want to get to President Trump, you're going to have to go through me and you're going to have to go through 75 million Americans just like me.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

LAKE: And I'm going to tell you, yes, most of us are card-carrying members of the NRA.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SUAREZ: And so, Jake, the Miami-Dade Police Department tells me they are in communications with the Department of Homeland Security, and they're keeping a close eye on two events that they have pretty much confirmed are taking place.

One is happening right now outside of the Trump Doral property here, where some supporters have gathered. They're holding up signs and waving the U.S. flag, as well as some posters supporting the former president. And we're told that they're also keeping a close eye on some protests that will most likely take place tomorrow outside of the federal courthouse in downtown Miami.

TAPPER: All right, Carlos Suarez in Doral, Florida, thank you so much.

Some of those Trump allies, many of them, are sticking by him, despite their many calls, as you might remember, for a certain Democrat to be locked up for her alleged mishandling of sensitive in -- sensitive government documents.

That story is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:27:00]

TAPPER: Welcome back to our special live coverage.

An hour from now, we expect to see former President Trump touch down in Miami, where he will be arraigned in federal court tomorrow, the former president facing 37 federal criminal charges related to his mishandling, alleged mishandling, of classified documents after he left office.

Sources telling CNN that, once Trump's -- Trump arrives back in Florida, he's going to head to his Doral property, where he will meet with lawyers and discuss a Florida-based legal team -- Erin.

BURNETT: Yes, trying to get that Florida-based legal team in place, Jake.

Even as the former president gets set for that second court appearance as a criminal defendant, it is clear that some of his staunchest allies are going to continue to stand by him. You know, we all saw that interview yesterday, Jake, with the South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham, saying the indictment is -- quote -- "not going to change my support for Donald Trump."

And Arizona Congressman Andy Biggs tweeted -- quote -- "We have now reached a war phase, eye for an eye." Obviously, I'm not even calling to call that an implicit threat of violence.

CNN's Lauren Fox is live on Capitol Hill for us.

So, Lauren, what more are you hearing from lawmakers today?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, just a few moments ago, Erin, I had an opportunity to talk with House Speaker Kevin McCarthy, who vehemently defended former President Donald Trump, making it clear that he had no concerns about this indictment and said he argued his biggest concern is the fact he thinks that justice is being treated unfairly against former President Donald Trump, arguing that he did nothing differently than what he has seen from others, including the current President Joe Biden.

Pushed on the fact that, obviously, this unsealed indictment paints a very different picture, a very different group of facts against the former president, McCarthy just said over and over again that he thinks that Donald Trump did nothing wrong. Here he was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): The idea of equal justice is not playing out here. And so that's a real concern to all Americans.

So, as a policymaker, elected officials, we want to make sure it's equal justice for all. And we want to look that's it been weaponization.

QUESTION: Was that a good luck for the former president to have boxes in a bathroom? MCCARTHY: I don't know. Is it a good picture to have boxes in a

garage that opens up all the time? A bathroom door locks.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOX: We also pushed McCarthy on the fact that many in his own conference, including Andy Biggs, which you pointed to earlier, are calling for violence.

He declined to push back on that. He just said that there is concern that equal justice is not being carried out. We also pushed him on whether or not the House is going to take steps to defend the former president. He said that he would like to hear from Jack Smith, the special counsel. So we will be awaiting more word on whether or not that's going to happen -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Lauren, thank you so much.

You know, we have multiple perspectives on the impact Trump's federal indictment is having on the political front.

Joining us now to discuss, CNN anchor and chief national correspondent John King, CNN special correspondent Jamie Gangel, CNN anchor of "INSIDE POLITICS SUNDAY" Abby Phillip, CNN senior legal analyst Elie Honig.