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Trump Arrives In Florida Ahead Of Arraignment; Many GOP Lawmakers Defend Trump After Indictment; Indictment: Trump Documents Included Info On U.S. Nukes, Other Countries' Defense Capabilities. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired June 12, 2023 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[15:01:20]

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Hello. I'm Erin Burnett in New York.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: And I'm Jake Tapper in Washington.

Welcome to our CNN special coverage of the federal criminal indictment of Donald Trump. Let's show you some live pictures from Miami International Airport where the former president just landed just a day before he's arraigned on 37 - that's 37 criminal felony charges over his mishandling, allegedly, of classified documents.

BURNETT: And Jake soon, Trump is expected to meet with his defense team. He's actually going to be staying at his Doral resort tonight in Miami. His legal team, though, I should emphasize is not finalized because he is still searching for lawyers to represent him in Florida even though, of course, he has his arraignment tomorrow.

Right now, law enforcement officials are ramping up security around the federal courthouse in Miami ahead of that and they are preparing for the possibility of large protests by Trump supporters.

CNN's Evan Perez is outside that federal court in Miami and our own Carlos Suarez is near Trump's club in Doral, Florida, where as I mentioned, he'll be spending the night.

Evan, let me start with you first, though, because I know you've got new reporting on how the Special Counsel got everyone in this position, right, where the former president is coming down to Florida to face those challenges in Miami, instead of Washington, D.C.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Erin.

It is something that I think the Special Counsel team started planning for just in the last a few months, we're told by some sources. And the issue here is the venue. The fact is Mar-A-Lago is located in this traditional district in the Southern District of Florida.

And that's where the alleged crimes took place. And so that's one reason why prosecutors confronted that issue. It's something that the Trump team had raised that if the case were brought in Washington, that that would be something that they might be able to challenge.

And so certainly for prosecutors, they're facing now a couple of challenges as a result. This is a jurisdiction that is probably going to be a little bit friendlier of a jury pool for the former president, certainly friendlier than one in Washington, D.C. where a lot of the - or most of the testimony was taken by the grand jury there.

The second thing is one of the big pieces of evidence, which is those notes from Evan Corcoran, the Trump attorney. He provided testimony to the grand jury again in Washington. All of that was litigated by judges in Washington.

The question is, at what point will Trump's legal team tried to challenge that here down in the Southern District of Florida, which is a totally different set of courts. And will they have any luck in trying to exclude some of that very damaging testimony from Evan Corcoran.

Again, challenges that prosecutors knew going in, in the last few months they were going to be confronted by bringing the case down here in the Southern District of Florida. Erin?

BURNETT: All right. Evan, thank you.

And as promised, I want to go to Carlos Suarez. Again, he's at the Doral.

He's going to be spending these next - not even 24 hours there, Carlos, but not going to Mar-A-Lago, right? Not flying into Palm Beach, coming straight to Miami and staying at the Doral.

CARLOS SUAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's exactly right. So I'd say a crowd of about 100 Trump supporters have gathered outside of the entrance to the Trump Doral property here. Many of them are waving the American flags. They're holding up signs in support of the former president.

Now just a few minutes ago, a few of these supporters made it onto the street out here, but Doral police quickly pushed everyone back onto the sidewalk. I've got to tell you that both the Miami-Dade Police Department as well as the Doral Police Department were really anticipating this one event taking place outside of the former president's golf club here, his property here in the city of Doral.

[15:05:08]

The former president, as you all noted, has landed at Miami International Airport. That is about a 10 to 15 minute drive from where we are right now. It's expected that the former president will most likely just drive right past this group. He has nothing else on his schedule. He's expected to spend the night here at Trump Doral before making his way to Downtown Miami tomorrow for that appearance in federal court.

Some of the supporters out here that have been chanting a few things among them was one woman who said, "The more you prosecute him, the more we support him." Some of these supporters out here have said that they are going to be in Downtown Miami to show their support for the former president.

Now in the two o'clock hour, the city of Miami wrapped up a news conference where they really did not get into a whole lot of specifics about the security posture ahead of tomorrow's appearance. Right now, they said they are anticipating some crowds showing up tomorrow and that a lot of their plans will be dictated by just how many people show up. Guys?

BURNETT: All right. And, of course, the great unknown. Carlos, thank you. Jake?

TAPPER: Erin, thanks so much.

Our panel is back. Also joining CNN National Security Analyst Beth Sanner, Senior Legal Analyst, Elie Honig.

Let me talk to you first, go to you first. What are you expecting to see tomorrow and how about Trump's kind of like last minute scramble to get defense attorneys in Florida?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Yes. So first of all, what's going to happen to a president - we've never seen a former president sit in federal court at a defendant's table, but it also will be mundane and routine. This is what happens in federal courthouses all over the country.

Donald Trump will be processed. Normally you would be fingerprinted and mugshotted. I don't know whether they will do either of those things for Donald Trump. They gave a pass on those things in Manhattan.

He'll be advised of the charges. He'll enter his plea. Surely he will plead not guilty. The most important thing I'm watching, of course, is the schedule, how quickly is the judge going to move this case. Sometimes judges set trial dates at the first appearance. But usually in federal court, they don't. They'll say, here's the discovery deadlines, here's when you have to do motions and then they set the trial date after that.

TAPPER: All right. And Beth Sanner, let me ask you, we're going to see, in all likelihood, a big pro-Trump MAGA crowd outside the courthouse tomorrow. Has January 6 changed the way that law enforcement and security officials prepare for such an event as we're going to see tomorrow?

BETH SANNER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Absolutely. I know, Andrew can speak to this as well. But I think that people were unfortunately caught off guard, even though they should not have been on January 6. And now people are paying much more attention.

It's not that, that these streams of information aren't available. It's making sure that they get to the right people, that people are prepared. And I think as some people have pointed out on the show here today that the Miami Police force is a pretty well-run machine and I think they're going to be ready for this.

TAPPER: And let me ask you, former FBI Deputy Director, Andrew McCabe, you read through these allegations, you read analyses like this one I keep reading on the Washington Post said that if Trump had simply returned all the documents he had, he probably never would have been charged.

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: That's right.

TAPPER: The big question is, so why? Why did he keep these documents? Does the prosecution need to answer that?

MCCABE: They don't have to answer it. It's not an element of the offense, but it's very good if they can answer it, because it helps the jury essentially understand the narrative that the prosecutors are putting in place. Here, we don't have a clear answer to that. We have two episodes that are referred to in the indictment that do shed a little bit of light on the why, how he used the alleged ...

TAPPER: Let me interrupt you for one second just because I want to show Donald Trump doing his least favorite thing walking down stairs. He is leaving his plane. He is arriving in Miami, Miami International Airport, where he will be arraigned tomorrow. I'm sorry. Please continue.

MCCABE: Yes. So we saw him in the indictment of the allegations that he used the Iran document to refute comments by the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who use allegedly another document and map to impress a member of his political action committee.

I think what we know about Donald Trump is his approach to business, his approach to politics, his approach to interpersonal relations. It is a constant pursuit of advantage. He is fundamentally transactional in nature and he is always looking for the edge over his political rival, over his business rival, over the person he's conversing with.

And so my guess - and it's a speculation - is that he saw in this material information that might be useful to him at some point in the future. It's hard to say with specificity exactly what his plans might have been or if he had any at all.

TAPPER: Yes.

MCCABE: But it's ...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I've just asked - yes, it's a question for the prosecutors, but it's also a question about whether or not the defense is going to mention that at all. I mean, maybe they have a reason that they're trying - they will try to put forward to try to explain why he has it, not saying that that will be, in fact, the case but it will be interesting to see.

I asked one of his political allies just this morning, why did he take all this?

TAPPER: Yes, why. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And the answer was, I'm not asking him because I

don't want to end up in court.

[15:10:06]

TAPPER: Right. That's a good point.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: But then you also have people like Senate Republicans saying, well, he didn't give them to a foreign power. He wasn't actually spying. He didn't actually use them in transactions.

So the bar - first of all, I mean, as the lawyers know, it's irrelevant whether he actually did those things or not. But on the political side, the bar is just being put on the floor in terms of what the conduct of a former president ought to be.

TAPPER: (Inaudible) the presidential motorcade as it departs from the landing of the Trump plane. Dana, were you with me right before inauguration in 2017 when Tom Barrack told us how much how much President Trump hates walking down stairs?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

TAPPER: Was that you? Yes. I just want people to understand.

BASH: Well, because he grew up in apartment buildings.

TAPPER: I don't know what the reason is.

BASH: I think - I ...

TAPPER: I don't want people - because I realized that comment probably came out of nowhere. He hates walking down stairs.

PHILLIP: Yes, he's very careful.

BASH: My - yes. I mean, my understanding and Daniel Dale can fact check me, is that he grew up in New York City in apartment buildings and he did used elevators.

TAPPER: And - right ...

BASH: ... yes.

TAPPER: ... to the elevator manor born.

Let me bring in CNN Contributor and former counsel for the Nixon White House, John Dean. John, Trump aide, Walt Nauta, was also indicted. He's with Donald Trump right now. What's the like for him? If he's watching CNN right now, unlikely, but if he's watching CNN, what would you tell him to do? Should he seek a plea deal or should he try to get a joint defense with Donald Trump?

JOHN DEAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I'd suggest he do a plea deal. He's facing 20 years. It's overwhelming evidence. It looks like beyond a reasonable doubt almost off the material. It's raised in the indictment and I don't know how he can win this. So he could strike a good deal and put this - help put it away for the government.

I would be - I don't know why he got himself involved this way. As a Navy man, he must have had some sensitivity to highly classified material, but yet he certainly did the President's wishes according to the allegations in the indictment.

TAPPER: Yes. And Jamie Gangel, what are you hearing from your Republican sources about how they're all taking this in as they watch the - this historic event, not in a good way for Donald Trump?

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, there are two kinds of Republican sources. There are people who are backing Trump, but the people who are not are appalled. They think that this is outrageous.

And just to go back to the why for a second, I remember a couple of months ago I spoke to Michael Cohen about this, who worked with Trump. And he said, well, it's for the bragging rights, some of it.

This is before we knew exactly what was in here. It is true there were things he liked to show off, like the Kim Jong-un letters or his - the sharpie hurricane map. But to me what was most interesting and revealing about the indictment is that he was personally going through these boxes.

If you look at the indictment, they have a text exchange between Trump employee to Walt Nauta: "I delivered some but I think he may need more. Knocked out two boxes. He's tracking the boxes." This shows a level of interest in what was in there.

Andy McCabe just mouthed the words intent, so I will take intent. But it - the level of how sensitive these classified documents appear to be and the fact that he was going through them and wouldn't give them back I think is going to say a lot in this case.

PHILLIP: And, of course, if you remember, he not only was going through them in Florida at Mar-A-Lago, but he took some of them with him up to Bedminster.

TAPPER: Up to Bedminster, yes.

PHILLIP: He had a very specific document that he wanted to show off and he had that with ...

TAPPER: The invasion of Iran.

PHILLIP: ... he had that with him. One other note about Trump, this is in a period of time when Trump was - but for all intents and purposes - pretending at Mar-A-Lago to still be the president of the United States. I mean, he has people around him constantly calling him "Mr. President," sending out email lists with the presidential seal on it.

There was a kind of imagination around Trump that he was still the president and had a right to all these documents and that they still belong to him when, of course, they did not. TAPPER: All right. Stand by everyone. Still to come, he's now the

first ex-president in the history of the United States to be indicted on federal charges. His own former attorney general says he's "toast if even half of what's alleged in the indictment is true." But many Republicans are still standing by him. We're going to head to Capitol Hill next where House Speaker Kevin McCarthy has just spoken to CNN. Stay with us.

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[15:18:52]

TAPPER: As Donald Trump prepares to head to court tomorrow, Republicans continue to grapple with how to respond to the former president's criminal indictment. Some of Trump's staunchest allies say they're standing behind him no matter what, ride or die.

CNN's Lauren Fox is live for us on Capitol Hill.

Lauren, what are you hearing from Republican lawmakers?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER: Yes, we spoke earlier today with House Speaker Kevin McCarthy, perhaps one of the closest allies to former president, Donald Trump. And he made it clear he is sticking with the former president, trying to strike a false equivalency by comparing this case to one that he argued should be made against the current president, Joe Biden.

Push back - pushing back against him, I argued, these are very, very clear charges against the former president. He said that he believes that the former president did nothing wrong. He also argued and gave a glimpse of what the House of Representatives may do in the future, saying that he did want to hear from Jack Smith, the special counsel in this case, saying that the American people would like to hear from Jack Smith. Here's what he said to us.

[15:20:02]

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REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): The idea of equal justice is not playing out here.

FOX: But ...

MCCARTHY: And so that's a real concern to all Americans. So as policymaker elected officials, we want to make sure it's equal justice for all and we want to look at it as weaponization.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was that a good look for the former president to have boxes in a bathroom?

MCCARTHY: I don't know. Is it a good picture to have boxes in a garage that opens up all the time, a bathroom door locks.

(END VIDEO CLIP) FOX: And there's a stark difference between what we're hearing from

Republican leadership in the House of Representatives, Jake. And what we are hearing from leadership over in the US Senate, which is silence.

In fact, one of our colleagues, Nicky Robertson, just tried to ask Mitch McConnell a question about this. He did not answer her question. He normally doesn't talk in the hallways, but it's also important to know he has not released a public statement nor has John Thune, the Republican Whip.

So just such a split screen that you are seeing between House leaders and Senate Republican leaders, Jake?

TAPPER: Interesting. Lauren Fox, thank you so much. Erin?

BURNETT: Yes, interesting. Now that silence still from Thune and McConnell.

So let's bring in our panel and I should note Alyssa Farah Griffin is with us. Of course, let me just start with you.

So Trump's indictment is creating a divide, obviously, in the GOP among Republican hopefuls, not - I mean, there's a divide, there's a whole lot on one side. It's a little lopsided. You have a divide. Okay. But some are truly defending him, take a listen.

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VIVEK RAMASWAMY, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Reading that indictment and looking at the selective omissions of both facts and law, Dana, I'm even more convinced that a pardon is the right answer here.

GOV. ASA HUTCHINSON (R) ARKANSAS: We shouldn't be promising and holding out the fig leaf of a pardon, because that undermines our jury system. We don't need a commander in chief that disregards the nation's secrets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: It's actually an interesting point that he raises there, whether you're going to do it or not, don't dangle it out because it's permission to misbehave.

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: That's a - it was a good point by Asa Hutchinson who I give credit for being one of the consistent voices of this is an indictment that's backed by evidence that was done credibly. But the challenge that Republican candidates and many on the Hill have kind of boxed themselves into is they want to make the argument this is a result of a politicized Justice Department.

Now Republicans, especially in the House have played a big role in politicizing the Justice Department. But even if you accept that for one minute, you can't deny the second factor in this, which is this pose a grave risk to national security. BURNETT: Yes.

GRIFFIN: So for a Mike Pence, a Nikki Haley attempt, Scott, people have handled national security's secrets. You can have any sort of thoughts about the DOJ. You can't ignore the blatant facts laid out here. That's what's going to get more challenging as this plays out.

BURNETT: Well, I mean, there's certain - again, not to get into re- litigating or discussing other cases, right, but there is a certain level of well, Joey did it so can I. It doesn't make right.

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, a ...

BURNETT: And that's what we're missing from the GOP right now.

JENNINGS: And inherent in the argument that if someone else did it, so can I. You're admitting that the person you want to let go did it as well. I mean, you're saying they also did it ...

BURNETT: Right.

JENNINGS: ... which doesn't make a ton of sense. Listen to Ramaswamy there, his views on national security, I mean, he's wanting to turn Ukraine over to Russia to get the war over with. And so I don't put a lot of credence into what he says.

One technical issue, though, for these candidates that I picked up in a CBS News poll over the weekend, there was a question about to primary voters, what do you want to hear Donald Trump talk about, plans for the country, 96 percent said yes; the investigations into you, only 39 percent; 2020 election only 32 percent.

So you can see there is a hunger in the Republican primary electorate for people to talk about what will you actually do. Trump's two favorite topics are investigations and the 2020 election. If I were another candidate, I would be looking at that number and saying, is there any room to run on talking about Trump's investigations or should I focus on my own plans for the country?

BURNETT: Interesting. Well, interesting, also what Sara Murray was reporting, Mondaire, which was that in his rally this weekend, which he attended with Walt Nauta, who of course is - in - a co-conspirator, of course, in the indictment.

MONDAIRE JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: (Inaudible), yes.

BURNETT: Forty minutes, more than half of the time was spent just talking about legal troubles.

JONES: Yes, well look, it's ...

BURNETT: And by the way, that's a long time for anybody to sit there and listen to anybody talk about anything.

JONES: In to your point, Scott, I mean, if he just needs to get about 40 percent in a crowded field, then maybe his strategy is too loose to play to those 32 or 39 or 38 percent of people who want to hear about his grievances rather than a positive vision for what this country will be because eventually, you'd like to think that as he continues to get indicted as he is likely to get convicted of at least some of the crimes that he's been charged with or will be charged with, that that will cause him to lose some support within the Republican Party, even if we're not seeing evidence of that in this moment.

BURNETT: And it's also interesting, Laura - what Lauren was reporting, senators Thune and McConnell so far silent, okay. It's not the same thing as coming out and saying this is wrong and looks bad and I'm not okay with these things having happened if they happened. But it is very different than Kevin McCarthy making light of something that he shouldn't have made light of ...

LAURA COATES, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: to be honest and saying, oh, well, the garage doors don't lock and bathroom doors do or what - that silliness?

[15:25:11]

COATES: I think you're seeing a disconnect in the sense of one maybe is waiting and seeing what the impact will be. And the other saying, look, I'm already vulnerable. It took me 15 rounds even get this hammer. I better bring it's not in favor of Donald Trump.

BURNETT: Yes.

COATES: But in the long run of all of this, what I'm looking for, I think, as everyone is thinking about this is the consistency. There's Matthew's (ph) Air National Guardsman, right, who disclosed information on Discord. Likely he said for bragging rights, there's no evidence that was going through them and foreign national or anyone else.

And I remember so many people coming down on him with good reason, because there was a violation of the law that had been alleged.

BURNETT: Yes.

COATES: And so when we have silence with respect to somebody who was the commander in chief with the - with similar allegations, maybe for similar maybe benign reasons - if I'm being very generous - I do wonder about why people are being quiet in Congress. Because again, everyone's making a big deal about the fact that this is not espionage that James Bond sent, because they hate that word, espionage, which means spying.

But legislators are the ones who have these laws ...

BURNETT: Right.

COATES: ... on the books and would like them to be enforced by members of the executive branch. And Trump was the head of that branch, so I'm just curious as to why.

BURNETT: And it's interesting, John, you were talking about possible motive. We were talking about Trump does like to brag about things. And again, Laura is making the point, we don't know what the real motive was. We do know that they've asked for information about Trump's relations business deals with other - with some of the countries that the documents may have been involved with. So we don't know that was just for bragging rights. But an interesting theory you have about why he would want this stuff to be lying around, not accidentally, purposefully.

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: I mean, Donald Trump is all about collecting things about props, about showing all that he has, but he was also the guy who wasn't reelected as president. He's trying to run again and there's a theory that he created the alternate oval office for his shadow presidency in Mar-A- Lago and that part of that was showing the cachet of - I don't just have all the other things I collected from the White House, but there's classified documents, I still have access, I'll be back, that it was part of part prep for his second act.

And then there's the question of what of it went beyond props.

BURNETT: Right.

MILLER: What of this classified information could have had another purpose, either in a business deal to an ally to a supporter to be used against an enemy?

BURNETT: Right, all of that.

And Karen, one question, as we said the indictment gives you enough to show what you've got, but not everything. So right at the beginning, right, they give to very specific instances of dissemination. Is it possible that they have more on that very crucial and specific thing and they just decided to include two in the indictment?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Well, if you if you recall, there are hundreds - he possessed hundreds of classified documents. And Jack Smith, when they did the search warrant, recovered over a hundred more, but yet you only see 31 of these documents in there, so ...

BURNETT: Right.

AGNIFILO: So Jack Smith had to pick and choose probably a balance between what are the strongest counts, but also what are the ones that you can reveal. You probably had to negotiate with the intelligence community about what documents can we use because they're so secret that we can't have them show up in a court of law.

So there might be other instances involving those super secret documents for all we know. I mean, it's just speculation, but we only know a very limited number of the documents that he possessed. Yes, they were incredibly secret and sensitive and involved our national defense as well as foreign countries, but there are a lot of other documents as well that aren't in there, so, yes.

BURNETT: I think it just emphasize the point, right, that we - this is this is important, but it is not all inclusive. And thanks so much to all of you.

As security concerns surround Trump's first appearance in federal court, Miami's police Chief is speaking out saying they are ready and ready for it to be done. Details next.

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