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Treasury Secretary Says, China's Tariff Escalation a Big Mistake; Supreme Court Considering Case of Mistakenly Deported Maryland Man; Source Says,, White House Envoy Steve Witkoff Will Lead Nuclear Talks With Iran. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired April 08, 2025 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Pamela Brown. Happening now, a big mistake. Tough words from President Trump's treasury secretary as the trade war between China and the U.S. intensifies.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Also talks with Iran. President Trump's Middle East envoy in a possible new nuclear deal with Iran. We have late breaking reporting from the White House.

We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer. You're in The Situation Room.

Happening now, only moments ago, the Trump administration leveling some tough talk at China.

BROWN: Right. Beijing is vowing to retaliate against President Trump's tariff, and the president has given Beijing until tomorrow to back down. This is what Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent said just a short time ago.

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SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: I think it was a big mistake, this Chinese escalation because they're playing with a pair of twos traditionally. If you look at the history, the trade negotiations, the -- we are the deficit country. So, what do we lose by the Chinese raising tariffs on us? We export one fifth to them of what they export to us. So, that is a losing hand for them.

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BLITZER: Also happening now, a big bounce on Wall Street, at least right now. The Dow is in positive territory after three days of painful losses of very rattled nerves.

Let's go live to CNN Correspondent Marc Stewart, who's joining us live from Beijing right now. Marc, China's government is accusing the U.S. of blackmail and economic bullying. Is there any sign Beijing will back down and withdraw its retaliatory tariffs. MARC STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good to see, Wolf. Look, despite what Washington may want, Beijing is making it very clear it's not budging. And, again, we are seeing this shift from diplomacy to defiance. In fact, if we look at some of the language that we have heard today from government officials among the phrases, the additional tariffs would be a mistake upon a mistake. And China has made it clear throughout the day that if the United States pushes things even further with these additional 50 percent tariffs, that China is going to fight back. It's going to protect itself.

As far as how that would look, we heard from a state media commentator who talked about the idea of additional tariffs on agriculture. That would impact soybean farmers, the American farming industry, even talking about restricting or banning American films.

The government is being very firm. It's not backing down. Listen to what one spokesperson had to say.

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LIN JIAN, CHINESE FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESPERSON: Pressure, threats and blackmail are not the right ways to engage with China.

If the U.S. disregards the interest of both countries and the international community insists on launching a tariff or trade war, China will fight to the end.

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STEWART: China would fight to the end. It's pretty strong language. As far as the possibility of China sitting down with the United States for trade talks right now, China doesn't feel the United States is being genuine to have such a serious conversation, Wolf.

BLITZER: All right. Marc Stewart in Beijing with the latest, thank you very, very much. Pamela?

BROWN: And before many of President Trump's tariffs take effect, we know that some of the things that will likely cost you more at the grocery store now. So, you might want to grab a pen and your shopping list as we go through this.

CNN's Vanessa Yurkevich is at a grocery store in New York to walk us through. Vanessa, how wide of an impact will Americans likely see?

VANESSA YURKEVICH, CNN BUSINESS AND POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, we're here at Morton Williams in New York City, and they say that they haven't seen that 10 percent universal tariff hit just yet. But when it does, it's going to hit perishable items, fruits and vegetables, for example. These bananas come from Costa Rica. These right over here come from Ecuador. These countries are now hit with a 10 percent tariff.

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I want to take you over to the seafood section really quickly because this is where some of these higher tariffs, these higher reciprocal tariffs are going to go into effect on Wednesday and hit seafood products. Let's look at the shrimp over here. Morton Williams gets their shrimp from Indonesia and Vietnam. We're talking about a 32 percent tariff from Indonesia, 46 percent from Vietnam. And the salmon over here, this is coming from Norway, and Norway is going to be hit with a 15 percent tariff. The U.S. imported about $1 billion worth of salmon last year.

I also want to take you over to the coffee section. This is where -- these are non-perishable items, so these are items that hold a little bit longer and companies may have been able to stockpile these items. However, we source here in the U.S. most of our beans from Central America, from Africa, Ethiopia, for example, is getting hit with a 10 percent tariff, as is Brazil. So, the store here is bracing for those higher tariffs.

I asked the owner, can he absorb them? The margins are so slim in the grocery store that he's not going to be able to absorb higher costs. He's going to have to pass them, unfortunately, down to the consumer.

BROWN: Yes, that's been the big concern for the American consumer. These companies, like that grocery store, not being able to withstand the higher prices, passing them along.

Vanessa Yurkevich, thank you so much. Wolf?

BLITZER: Pamela, happening now the fate of a Maryland man mistakenly deported to El Salvador is in the hands of the United States Supreme Court. The court has temporarily paused a deadline to return the man to the United States, and it comes on the same day. The court handed the Trump administration a huge victory ruling that rapid deportations under the Alien Enemies Act can continue. Listen.

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KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: This decision proves that President Trump and our administration have always been right from the beginning. He will continue to utilize the Alien Enemies Act to remove foreign terrorists.

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CNN's Priscilla Alvarez joins us now. So, is this as big of a win for the White House as it's claiming, Priscilla?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, a flurry of activity in the courts yesterday, and in this case, there's a win for both sides, which is what makes this order interesting because the Supreme Court is allowing the Trump administration to use this sweeping wartime authority. The last time it was used, by the way, was during World War II to carry out deportations, but there's a but, and that is what the ACLU is applauding. They essentially, the administration, have to give adequate notice to the migrants who are going to fall under this measure that they are going to be deported using this authority and give them the time to challenge that in the courts. Because the thing about this authority that makes it so remarkable is that it wipes away the immigration process. Any sort of process that immigrants had to appeal, a deportation order does not exist. That's what makes it so attractive to the Trump administration because they can speed things up. And that's exactly what they did last month when they sent Venezuela nationals to El Salvador.

Now, they can still use the authority, but they do have to give that notice to the migrants who are going to be subject to it to challenge it and make their habeas complaints.

Now, the other part of this is that it does leave open the question of what happens to those nationals who were sent to El Salvador. It doesn't answer that question. Therefore, we'll see where that goes. But, certainly, this was an order that gives a bit of a win to both sides, but certainly significant for the administration, which has been wanting to use this authority.

BLITZER: The Alien Enemies Act of 1798.

ALVAREZ: Correct.

BLITZER: A long time ago. All right, Priscilla, thank you very, veru much.

BROWN: And we have some breaking news just into The Situation Room, a source is telling CNN that White House Envoy Steve Witkoff will lead the U.S. side and talks on a new nuclear deal with Iran.

So, let's go live now to CNN White House Reporter Alayna Treene. Alayna, the two sides are expected to meet Saturday, right?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: That's exactly right. They're actually expected to meet in Oman, which has agreed to host them. As you mentioned, we are now learning that Steve Witkoff, the president's Middle East envoy, is going to be representing the US side of these talks. We've also saw on X Iran's Foreign Minister Abbas Araghchi said that he would be traveling there as well, though he said that these would be indirect talks. Of course, yesterday we heard President Donald Trump say from the Oval Office that he expected these to be direct talks.

But, look, this is a huge deal that these two sides are meeting. The last time the U.S. met with Iran directly was back in 2015 when then John Kerry had -- Secretary of State John Kerry had met with then Iran's foreign minister to work out the terms of the Iran nuclear deal that, of course, we no longer have because of President Donald Trump.

But, look, what the president said yesterday in the oval, I think was also very significant. He said that he wants to make a deal. We've heard him say this before. But then he was asked, what would happen if you can't? And he said he thought it would be very dangerous for Iran.

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So, this is going to be a very high stakes meaning to see whether or not they can work out some sort of agreement, something that the United States wants. But we've heard Iran's supreme leader argue that they're not quite sure they're willing to want to come to the table on such a deal. Pamela?

BROWN: All right. It's interesting, Steve Witkoff seems to be at the center of all these key international negotiations.

Alayna Treene, thank you so much. Wolf?

BLITZER: Good point. A freedom of choice issue, Pamela, that's how the Health and Human Services secretary, Robert Kennedy Jr., is framing the debate over fluoride in your drinking water. And with Utah now becoming the first state to ban fluoride in public drinking water, Kennedy went to Salt Lake City to speak on the matter.

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ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY: And the era of fluoride, fluoridated toothpastes, and mouthwashes, it makes no sense to have fluoride in our water. In Europe, most of the nations have already banned fluoride and their cavities have not increased.

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BLITZER: For some clarity on this polarizing issue, we're joined now by CNN Medical Correspondent Meg Tirrell.

Meg, how else is Kennedy approaching this debate?

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: If he's planning on using multiple authorities as HHS secretary and working across with other agencies as well. One of the things he says he is going to do is direct the CDC to stop recommending fluoride be added to water systems. The CDC, of course, has called fluorinated water, one of the most successful public health interventions of the last century because of its ability to reduce tooth decay.

He also says the HHS is going to reconvene a preventive services task force to look at the issue. And EPA Administrator Lee Zeldin at the same event said that they were going to quickly reexamine and look into new science on fluoride as well.

Now, he was really pointing to one particular report that came out last summer from the National Toxicology Program which found moderate confidence that at levels around 1.5 milligrams per liter in fluoridated water, that could be associated with lower I.Q. in children. And this is really the issue that people are most focused on around this now.

But, guys, it's so important to note that the level recommended for U.S. water systems is less than half that, 0.7 milligrams per liter in water. And at those levels, the same report said that more studies would be needed to fully understand any effect at lower exposure levels.

We should also note this has traditionally been a local decision. And in Salt Lake County in Utah, they actually voted to include fluoride in their water for the benefits and provides particularly to low income residents. Guys?

BLITZER: All right. Meg Tirrell, thank you very much. Pamela?

BROWN: Very comprehensive though.

All right, from 68 teams down to one, the Florida Gators pull off the win against the Houston Cougars in heart-stopping fashion to win the men's NCAA national championship. Down by 12, the Gators come back to take the lead, beating the Cougars by only two points as the clock ran out.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Florida found a way from 12 down to the school's third national championship in men's basketball.

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BLITZER: From San Antonio to Gainesville, the Gator Nation is celebrating this morning, big time. Watch.

Let's go live right now to CNN Sports Anchor Coy Wire, who's in San Antonio for us. Coy, it really came down to the very, very end, the final seconds for the Gators.

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Yes. Houston led for almost the entire game. Florida held a lead for just 63 seconds. Their 39-year-old head coach, Todd Golden, became the youngest head coach in 42 years to win a national title. I caught up with coach as he walked off the court as a national champ for the first time. Listen.

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WIRE: Coach, what does this win mean for you and Gator Nation?

TODD GOLDEN, FLORIDA MEN'S BASKETBALL HEAD COACH: Obviously, we're thrilled, man. It's a heck of a moment, an incredible opportunity to be here. And the fact that we finished it up, it means everything in the world.

Come here.

WIRE: Oh, you got your family here. This is an incredible moment. You're the youngest coach since 1983 to get a title. How has this journey been to you?

GOLDEN: It's been great. You know, I've been fortunate to work with great people along the way and have great players. And in three short years, we got the University of Florida's basketball program back where it belongs, which is winning national championships.

WIRE: You win it in the final sack. Tell us about the mental makeup of your team that enables you to pull off this title. GOLDEN: They've displayed it all year. In adverse conditions and situations, they found a way to step up, hanging on your guts and push through and finish, and against one of the best teams in America, we did it again tonight. Our senior leaders have been a lead all year, and our younger front court players make sure they reach that level that's expected on every night. They led us to 36 wins. They led us to 36 wins.

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Thank you. They led to 36 wins. And now we're going national champions.

WIRE: And now you told me after a win, you were maybe going to bust out the robot mosh pit with your team.

GOLDEN: Yes, I don't know. I don't know, man. I don't got it yet. I got to wait until the team gets in here.

BLITZER: Congrats coach.

GOLDEN: Thank you.

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WIRE: He might need to work on that robot a little bit. Something tells me the students back in Gainesville are still dancing this morning. The Florida Gators are national champions for the first time in 18 years, and I'm going to send back to you with just the bundle of joy that is a super fan and Gator alone, Sara Sidner, living her best life here in San Antonio. There she is. There she goes. Where she goes, no one knows. It's a happy day for Ms. Sidner.

BLIITZER: Happy day for a lot of Gators out there.

BROWN: What is that hat?

BLITZER: Did you notice the coach was wearing the net?

BROWN: Yes, of course. What an interview you did there Coy. And congrats to Sara Sidner and all the other Gators fans out there. Thanks so much.

BLITZER: I think it's fair to say it was an excellent, great game.

BROWN: It really was, very close.

All right, we have a lot more news to get to here on the show today. Still ahead, with additional tariffs looming against China, we're going to look at the ripple effect of President Trump's tariffs on the global economy and how it can impact you directly.

You're in The Situation Room.

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BLITZER: Happening now, we're keeping a very close eye on the markets this morning as investors look for signs President Trump might be willing to negotiate over his tariffs and potentially deescalate his trade war.

Take a look at this, the Dow Jones Industrials now up almost 1,400 points. That's a huge gain, at least so far, but it's still early in the day.

Joining us now, the former president of the Export-Import Bank of the United States, Fred Hochberg. Fred, thanks so much for joining us.

What impact are these Trump tariffs going to have on the global economy if President Trump leaves them in place?

FRED HOCHBERG, FORMER PRESIDENT, EXPORT-IMPORT BANK OF THE UNITED STATES: Wolf, thanks for having me on the show. It ruins or wrecks the stability that the United States has been known for. In a very chaotic world, we have been a stable force both through our currency, our rule of law, and the fact that we're the largest economy in the world. And that's all in jeopardy.

BLITZER: I was going to say, President Trump is apparently hoping his tariffs will force other countries to come to the table to renegotiate various trading agreements, largely on a one-by-one basis. What do you make of that approach?

HOCHBERG: Well, it's very labor intensive, number one, and it's very personal as opposed to regardless of where a product is produced having the same tariffs. So, if you get -- for example, I actually have a bunch of bananas here. Bananas are a key import. We don't grow any here. So, is the tariff going to be different depending on what countries sends bananas to America? And, by the way, it's the most popular fruit in America and that cost is going to go up.

BLITZER: Banana is the most popular food in America? Is that what you're saying?

HOCHBERG: I think it's like 26 pounds per capita people have for breakfast. You didn't have your banana this morning, I think.

BLITZER: Not yet, but I'll have some later. It's a -- I love bananas.

The president claims his tariffs will bring back American manufacturing jobs and encourage people to buy American products. What do you say? Is there truth to that?

HOCHBERG: Well, here, if we're going to negotiate one by one, the tariffs right now, starting 20, you know, a week later, how am I going to build a factory here that takes four or five years to build when the tariffs may go up, may go down, may disappear? Mr. Trump is going to be out of office in 2029. The next president may not continue any of these tariffs. So, that's not a very stable environment. If you're going to make a large investment, you need to look out five, ten years, and that's very hard to do, particularly after last week. BLITZER: Are there other ways, Fred, to encourage American manufacturing without sweeping tariffs?

HOCHBERG: You know, we had a program under, I'm sorry to say, President Obama called Select USA, where we encouraged companies to build factories and to manufacture here. And we've been pretty successful. Nikki Haley was successful in South Carolina. We have a lot of foreign automakers that are making and manufacturing their cars and trucks in the United States to serve our market. And, in fact, if you want a BMW SUV, it's going to be exported from the U.S. to Germany. So, we do a lot of manufacturing here and we have to recognize that. And that's a good plus. And we've been pretty successful at it.

BLITZER: But even if the car is made in the United States, a lot of the spare parts are being imported from overseas, right?

HOCHBERG: Correct and they're now subject to a duty which will raise the cost of those vehicles and raise the cost for average Americans.

BLITZER: What does all this mean for American soft power around the world, Fred? And you've been doing this, studying this a long time.

HOCHBERG: I'm very concerned about that. You know, one of our great soft power, one of our great exports has been entertainment, films, movie, higher education, college education, college degrees. We are putting that in jeopardy. We are now deporting students that have a green card, maybe married to an American citizen because of something they may have said or protested.

We want to encourage more students to come to America. It brings in a lot of revenue. And on top of which we inculcate with them, we give them American values, American way of life. And that's very positive for us around the world to have basically all these students who graduated from American universities in some way as ambassadors back to their countries. And I think we're putting a lot of that in jeopardy as well, which is a form of our soft power.

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BLITZER: Good point, indeed. Fred Hochberg the former President, the Export-Import Bank of America, I appreciate you joining us.

HOCHBERG: Thanks, Wolf.

BLITZER: And up next, Pamela.

BROWN: I was just doing a fact check on the bananas. It is true. Tops a list of fresh fruit sold in the U.S. And get this, Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes.

BROWN: The average American, according to Forbes, consumes 27 pounds of bananas annually. That's a lot, right?

BLITZER: That's a lot of bananas. I usually have one or two a day. I love bananas. I love blueberries too.

BROWN: I love them too.

All right, up next, quote, don't yield to a bully. That's advice from former Trump White House Communications Director Anthony Scaramucci to world leaders in the midst of the growing trade war. We're going to speak to him next.

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