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Trump Threatens Higher Tariffs on E.U. and Apple; Harvard Sues Trump Administration Over Ban on Enrolling International Students; DOJ Investigating Deadly Shooting as Terrorism, Hate Crime. Aired 10- 10:30a ET

Aired May 23, 2025 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, breaking news, President Trump reignites the trade war. The president now says he's recommending a 50 percent tariff on goods coming in from the European Union and a 25 percent tariff on Apple, if the tech giant refuses to make iPhones here in the United States.

And Harvard fights back. The Ivy League school is now suing the Trump administration over barring the university from enrolling international students. We have the latest on this escalating battle.

Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer. Pamela Brown is off today. And you're in The Situation Room.

And we start with the breaking news. President Trump ups the ante in the trade war as the latest targets, European countries and Apple. The news this morning coming in the form of a Truth Social post, he's recommending a straight 50 percent tariff on the European Union starting on June 1st, due to a lack of progress with their trade talks.

The threats did not stop there. Just before that post, he also put Apple's CEO Tim Cook on notice, demanding that Apple make its iPhones in the United States or face a 25 percent tariff.

Right now, the Dow is down. Take a look at this. The Dow is down to 328 points right now already very, very early.

CNN's White House Reporter Alayna Treene is joining us from the White House. CNN's Melissa Bell is joining us live from Paris right now.

Alayna, let me start with you. The White House issued a specific warning this week that this would happen.

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: They did, and it's very clear, Wolf, that the president woke up this morning with tariffs on his mind. He's essentially wielding the threat of massive import taxes on countries and trading partners that he doesn't like, I should say, the economic activity and the way that they are negotiating. That is exactly what he said when he issued this threat and said that he was going to be imposing a 50 percent tariff on the E.U. starting on June 1st.

He wrote on social media this morning, quote, our discussions with them are going nowhere, therefore, I'm recommending a straight 50 percent tariff on the European Union starting on June 1st, 2025. There is no tariff if the product is built or manufactured in the United States.

Now, a few things, Wolf, to note about this, one, is the European Union has long been something that the president has been fixated on. He believes that they are one of the most unfair trading partners of the United States, though many people argue that that is actually not the case. And this 50 percent tariff is more than double the 20 percent reciprocal tariff that the president had initially imposed on the E.U.

We did hear from Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent this morning talking about that, especially that initial pause to allow for these negotiations to continue. I want you to take a listen to how he characterized those talks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: The 90-day pause on the April 2nd tariffs was based on countries or trade blocks coming to us and negotiating in good faith. And I believe the president believes that the E.U. proposals have not been of the same quality that we've seen from our other important trading partners.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: So, as you could hear from the treasury secretary there, he's arguing that he does not believe the quality of conversations with the E.U. as good as other countries.

Now, this does set up a potentially tense exchange later today when we know that the United States trade representative, Jamieson Greer, is expected to talk with his European counterpart, Europe's trade chief. So, hopefully, we'll get more details on that and how the European Union may be responding.

BLITZER: All right. Alayna, stand by. I want to go to Melissa Bell in Paris for us right now.

Melissa, how are leaders over there from the E.U. responding to this?

MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Oh, for now, there's no official response from the European Commission, Wolf. This has, of course, just come out and it will be a huge shock. Remember that the Europeans had sent a letter earlier this week with what they believed were fair proposals, room for negotiation. What we understand is that the American administration simply feels that they wanted unilateral concessions from the European Union rather than the sort of agreements, compromises that were being sought by the commission. [10:05:02]

So, there is a big disconnect between the progress that Europe felt it was making in its talks with the United States and what's emerged this morning, not just the sort of brutality of the hike itself, 50 percent, as you were just saying, much higher than the initial 20 percent. It's just a few days away, the 1st of June. And I think there'll be a great deal of consternation here in Europe about what they thought had been the progress made on these negotiations, and realizing the strength of feeling on the other side and the fact that, apparently, there is no room to talk. And I think that's where we're going to be looking to hear from the commission later on.

BLITZER: All right, standby. Alayna, let me go back to you over at the White House. So, the president is calling out Apple, threatening the company with a new 25 percent tariff. Do White House officials acknowledge at least privately that this is going to increase the cost of iPhones for American consumers?

TREENE: Behind closed doors, Wolf, yes, but definitely not in public. And I know myself and other reporters have publicly tried to press White House Press Secretary Karoline Levitt on this.

Now, look, this post that the president put up about Apple and its CEO, Tim Cook, he essentially said that he has long warned Cook, someone that the president speaks with frequently. I would note that he was actually here at the White House just a few days ago. Tim Cook met with Donald Trump on Tuesday here. He said that he is long warned him that he would put this 25 percent tariff on iPhones if they did not begin moving the manufacturing of those iPhones to the United States.

Now, one thing to note here is that most of the manufacturing for iPhones happens in China. They have begun to move some of the manufacturing to India, noting that it has more favorable relations with Donald Trump. But this is of course, something, as you mentioned, that is going to massively increase the price of iPhones. iPhones in the U.S. are currently $1,000. Experts say that if this goes to plan as Trump wants it, it could begin costing consumers $3,500 for iPhones. So, something, of course, that I don't think a lot of consumers or people in this country would want.

But this is something that the president has long been fixated on and has talked about since the beginning of his tariff war. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right. Alayna Treene and Melissa Bell, to both of you, thank you very much.

Other important news happening now, Harvard is hitting back at the Trump administration with a new lawsuit following the government's ban on international admissions to the university. The school now asking a judge to immediately block the move by the Department of Homeland Security.

Under the order, those students already enrolled must now transfer to another school or lose their legal status here in the United States, something one Chinese student describes as devastating. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FANGZHOU JIANG, HARVARD STUDENT FROM CHINA: So, basically, it's a mixture of like shock then to kind of just, you know, devastation, you know, like frustration and then uncertainty, anxiety. You know, it is a combination of all of those feelings, I would say, among students in the community right now.

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BLITZER: Department of Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem says the order comes after Harvard refused to turn over records of foreign students, and she warns other universities should take notice.

Let's bring in CNN Crime and Justice Correspondent Katelyn Polantz. She's here with me in The Situation Room. Katelyn, what more can you tell us about this lawsuit?

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, this may be the big one, the administration of Donald Trump versus one of the most significant cultural institutions in the United States, academic institution, Harvard University. This is a case where Harvard says what the administration has already done yesterday, by revoking its ability to have foreign students as part of its programs on campus, that it is an immediate and devastating effect to this university.

They say there are more than 7,000 students on their campus with visas, many of them expecting to come back to campus in the summer and fall semesters, starting now, essentially, starting in the next couple weeks, in the next couple months. And that the immediate effect is going to be on academic programs, research laboratories, clinics, and courses that Harvard has. They say there's going to be thrown into disarray. And if Harvard loses its ability to have international students, if they must either transfer out of the university or leave the United States, which they say what -- that's what the effect is right now, without international students, quote, Harvard is not Harvard.

So, this suit is very fast-moving. The administration is saying that they should be able to do this because allowing a university to enroll foreign students is a privilege, not a right. The administration is very unhappy with Harvard over its allowance of having protests on its campus, things like that.

The Department of Homeland Security does have a statement in response to the lawsuit so far. They say this lawsuit seems to kneecap the president's constitutional vested powers under Article 2. What that means?

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The president, he should be able to do what he wants here on visas, immigration, even related to this university. Harvard, in response, says this retaliatory action threatens serious harm to the Harvard community and our country, and undermines Harvard's academic and research mission. They're argument in court is that it's a constitutional encroachment of their ability to decide what their curriculum is and what they do as a university.

This has, just a few minutes ago, I just looked, already been assigned to a judge, Judge Allison Burroughs. She's an Obama appointee on the federal court in Massachusetts, and we are waiting to see exactly what happens next. There could be a lot here, a lot quickly.

BLITZER: As soon as you hear, let us know. This is obviously a very significant development.

And when we're talking about foreign students now being barred from attending Harvard University, according to the Trump administration, we're talking about foreign students from all over the world, not just from China or from India, but from friendly allied countries in Europe, or even Israel, for example. No more Israeli students would be allowed to go to Harvard, right?

POLANTZ: That's right. And the way that Harvard describes, it's literally everybody with an F1 or a J1 visa. So, the students that are coming in and studying there, they say it also doesn't just affect those people on campus, more than 7,000, Harvard says, but it also affects their families, their children, more than 300 people that they say are now in immediate jeopardy and have to make a choice. And we've already heard, as there was that student that you referred to earlier that was speaking, that they are very, very horrified about what is happening here.

BLITZER: Yes. They can't believe this is happening here in the United States of America.

All right, Katelyn Polantz, thank you very much for that update. As soon as you get word from the court, let us know the latest on that.

Right now, we're joined by the former president of Harvard University, he was the president for five years, Larry Summers. Larry, thanks so much for joining us.

I know you call this move by the Trump administration against Harvard, and I'm quoting you now, the stuff of tyranny, and you say Harvard must start resisting. The university just announced it's suing to try to block this order from the Trump administration. How would you respond if you were still leading Harvard?

LAWRENCE SUMMERS, FORMER PRESIDENT, HARVARD UNIVERSITY: The university is doing just the right thing. This is extortion. It's a vendetta using all powers of the government because of a political argument with Harvard. It is violating the First Amendment. It is also violating all the laws we have regarding administrative procedures.

Look, Wolf, I've been on your show many times and I've often been critical of Harvard on aspects relating to identity politics, anti- Semitism, and much more. But that's not what this is about. This is about a vicious attack to pursue a personal agenda. And the consequences, whether it's students who are dissidents from tyranny, who are going to be sent home and possibly be imprisoned, whether it's labs that are fighting cancer and diabetes that are going to lose key people, whether it's 7,000 people, some small fraction of whom are going to go on to be prime ministers of countries who've been turned into enemies of the United States, whether it is the way in which America is seen when it expels people whose dream was to come to Harvard to study, this is madness.

You know, the president and his administration have made a big deal, and they've been right about Israel and anti-Semitism, sending every Israeli student out of Harvard is much more discriminatory against Israelis and is much more discriminatory against Jews than anything they have complained about.

I have thought I was done being surprised by how low the Trump administration would go, but I am surprised by what has happened. I am proud of Harvard's president, Alan Garber, for his leadership and for this lawsuit. If we are a country of law, and I deeply believe we still are, Harvard will prevail in this lawsuit. And I hope and trust it will prevail quickly.

Think about the families coming from all over the world for our graduation a week from now, people being stopped at airports, people who devoted their lives to making it possible for their kids to go to Harvard and to see them graduate, now being told that somehow this is all being stopped because of a vendetta against Harvard.

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I'm sorry, I just can't quite believe that this is happening in the United States.

BLITZER: It certainly is hard to believe. One international Harvard student, Larry, says he and other foreign students are now feeling, and I'm quoting now, pure panic. Now, you're the former president of Harvard University. What message do you have for them, for those students who are now being kicked out of the United States?

SUMMERS: Everyone at Harvard has your back. We are going to fight in every way we can, in the courts, with the support that can be provided financially to make this work for you.

The president of the United States is a very tough enemy, and so we can't promise what every result is going to be, but know that there are things where there's argument and division in the university. Opposition to this is not something where there is any division. And I think that I am still hopeful that justice and common sense will prevail.

BLITZER: China says this ban will only tarnish America's image and reputation around the world. And on Chinese social media, people wrote things like, quote, it's fun to watch them destroy their own strength. And recruiting international students is the main way to attract top talent.

What kind of long-term damage could this move have on the U.S.? SUMMERS: Look, we have always thought that a huge strength of the United States was what my late colleague, Joe Nye, called soft power, the power of our example. The fact that people from all over the world didn't want to go study in China, they wanted to go study in the United States. The people -- the fact that the books, the movies, the songs that we were -- the technologies, that we were the source of attraction to people from all over the world.

When we do our very best to undo that, when we emulate Chinese totalitarianism, where the government is censoring and stomping on universities, we are ceding one of our greatest advantages. I cannot imagine a greater strategic gift that we could be giving to China, that we could be giving to the enemies of freedom around the world than the kinds of steps that are being taken.

Yes, this is going to be damaging to Harvard. It's going to be incredibly damaging to Harvard if it is allowed to stand, but that is the least of it. It is much more profound how damaging this is to the standing and role and position of the United States.

We used to be a beacon to the world of nations. We are now becoming a negative example. I imagine there must be great joy in Beijing and Moscow seeing us implode with these kinds of policies.

BLITZER: While I have you, Larry, I want to quickly turn to Trump's trade war announcements today. You served of course as the U.S. treasury secretary under President Bill Clinton. And President Trump has just recommended slapping a 50 percent new tariff on all products coming into the United States from the European Union. Take a listen to what the current treasury secretary said about this. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BESSENT: I would hope that this would light a fire under the E.U., because, Bill, I've said before, E.U. has a collective action problem here. It's 27 countries, but they're being represented by this one group in Brussels. So, some of the feedback that I've been getting is that the underlying countries don't even know what the E.U. is negotiating on their behalf.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[10:20:00]

BLITZER: What's your reaction to that?

SUMMERS: These are crazy policies. These are going to -- the tariff policies, as now accounted, are going to cost the average American $3,600. They're going to push up inflation in the same way that we pushed up inflation in 2021. And I suspect it'll have political consequences like those that it had after the Biden policies contributed to inflation. This is not a time when we need to be making enemies and adversaries with capriciously chosen policies announced on Twitter. I'll tell you something else, Wolf, the film clip you played from the treasury secretary, not the one you just played, but the one you played ten minutes ago, had a very interesting phrase. He said, the president believes, and then he said some nonsense about bad European policies. In my experience, when a cabinet secretary says, the president believes, it means that that cabinet secretary knows better and wants to be loyal, but also true to themselves. So, there are plenty of people in the Trump administration who know better than to be making policy this way.

In the past, in the recent past, Secretary Bessent has gone to the White House, and when they were causing lots of damage in markets, gotten the president to back off some of the tariff policies. I suspect before long he'll have another mission like that.

BLITZER: Larry Summers, thanks so much for joining us.

SUMMERS: Thank you.

BLITZER: And still ahead, the man accused of killing two Israeli embassy staffers is now facing federal murder charges. We're learning much more about the suspect and his possible motive.

And later, the fifth round of U.S.-Iran nuclear talks now underway in Rome, but Iran is already pouring cold water on the negotiations.

Stay with us. You're in The Situation Room.

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BLITZER: Here in Washington, the man accused of killing two Israeli embassy staffers now faces federal murder charges, and he could face the death penalty for allegedly gunning down the young couple just outside the Capitol Jewish Museum Wednesday night. Authorities are investigating the online history of 31-year-old Elias Rodriguez and are specifically looking into a so-called manifesto that is circulating online.

CNN Correspondent Brian Todd is here with us in The Situation Room. What are you learning, Brian, about the investigation this morning?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, the investigation moving along at a very rapid pace, investigators combing through lots of potential evidence, and especially his online internet activity.

The suspect identified as Elias Rodriguez, 31 years old from Chicago, officials searching his internet activity, Wolf, and a so-called manifesto that is circulating online. Police are investigating a lengthy letter posted on X shortly after the shootings on Wednesday night, a letter apparently signed by Rodriguez. It advocates violent retaliation over the war in Gaza.

This letter was posted on X at around 10:00 P.M. Eastern Time Wednesday. It's not clear who posted it or if it was a pre-scheduled post set before the incident.

Now, according to a CNN review of interviews and writings linked to him, he has a history of political activism and denouncing corporate power. That's what we know about the suspect at this hour. But, again, they're combing through lots of information and hopefully we'll be getting some additional information from law enforcement shortly.

We should tell you about the charges he's facing. Here they are, two counts of first-degree murder, one count of murder of foreign officials, one count of -- at least one count of causing the death of a person through the use of a firearm, that, Wolf, is the count, which carries the possibility of the death penalty, and another count of discharge of a firearm during a crime of violence.

There is the possibility of them seeking the death penalty. Federal officials not ready to go there yet, not ready to say whether they are going to seek that death penalty for at least that one charge. Also you could be seeing hate crimes charges filed against this man.

BLITZER: Yes, very serious charges, and potentially facing the death penalty, as you point out.

What can you tell us about this lovely young couple who were killed?

TODD: Wolf, everybody who knows them just says that they were just a wonderful young couple. They have individually great things to say about each of them, that they had their whole lives ahead of them and they had much brighter days ahead of them. They are identified as Sarah Milgrim, 26 years old. She's from Kansas. And Yaron Lischinsky, 30 years old, he has a German passport. He was born in Germany. These are two people who, according to Israeli officials, met while they worked here at the Israeli embassy in Washington.

Yaron Lischinsky had recently bought a ring, according to an Israeli official, that he was going to propose to Sarah Milgrim in Jerusalem. They were going to go there next week to have her meet his family. So, that was just -- you know, they had everything going for them, they had everything coming up, just so much to look forward to, gone in an instant. And the details of how the shooting went down are horrific, basically how he walked across the street, walked past them, then turned and fired and just kept firing.

BLITZER: In one of the government documents, they say she was trying to move a little bit.

TODD: That's right.

BLITZER: And she was on her stomach and he shot her in the back.

TODD: That's right. She was trying to crawl away. This is according to court documents charging him. She was trying to crawl away and he fired at her again. And there were witnesses who saw all of this. There were two young women who also work at the Israeli embassy who were right there with him. They were uninjured.

[10:30:00] BLITZER: All right. Brian Todd, heartbreaking story indeed. Thanks very much for that update.

The Wednesday shooting, by the way, just outside the Capitol Jewish Museum here in Washington comes amid an alarm.