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Raw Milk Poisoning on the Rise in Florida; Interview With Rep. Seth Magaziner (D-RI); Interview With Rep. Raja Krishnamoorthi (D-IL); Trump Administration Strategizes Over Epstein Scandal. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired August 06, 2025 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Happening now: strategy session over dinner. Top Trump officials will discuss how to address the growing fallout over the Epstein case. The family of an Epstein victim is now speaking out about that meeting.

Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Pamela Brown. Wolf Blitzer is off today. And you're in THE SITUATION ROOM. Raja Krishnamoorthi

And we begin this hour with some new details on how some of the highest officials in the Trump administration are handling the political fallout surrounding Jeffrey Epstein. And now the family of an Epstein victim is speaking out.

Vice President J.D. Vance is expected to host a dinner tonight at his official residence with the White House chief of staff, attorney general, deputy attorney general and FBI director. The question for the table, whether to publish an audio recording and transcript of Deputy A.G. Todd Blanche's recent conversation with Epstein accomplice and sex trafficker Ghislaine Maxwell.

CNN is also reporting there are even preliminary internal discussions about Blanche holding a press conference or doing a high-profile interview with popular podcaster Joe Rogan about the Epstein case, this after the Republican-controlled House Oversight Committee issued a subpoena for the Justice Department to produce the Epstein files.

And new polling shows a majority of Americans believe that the White House is hiding information about Epstein.

So, joining us now to discuss, Democratic Congressman Raja Krishnamoorthi of Illinois. He is a member of the House Oversight Committee.

Congressman, nice to have you on. REP. RAJA KRISHNAMOORTHI (D-IL): Thank you.

BROWN: So we're hearing this morning from the family of Virginia Giuffre, perhaps the most well-known victim of Epstein, who died by suicide earlier this year, asking in a statement why none of the survivors were invited to this meeting at the vice president's residence. What's your response to that?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: I think that's a good question.

I think that right now a lot of people are just scratching their heads wondering why they won't release the deposition transcript or the interview transcript, why the interview even happened in the first place, why Ghislaine Maxwell was moved to a low-security or lower- security prison.

Was she given something or did she give up something in exchange for that? These are the questions that are swirling around this and people want answers. They want sunshine and transparency on what's going on with the Epstein files.

BROWN: Giuffre's family is also calling for the House Oversight subcommittee to invite survivors to testify. Are you open to that?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Oh, absolutely. I think that we need to shine a light on the harm that Ghislaine Maxwell and Epstein did.

The DOJ revealed that over 1,000 victims of these heinous crimes are suffering right now because of what's happening. And I think that that's in part why there's so much pressure on both Republicans and everybody to release these files ASAP.

BROWN: Has the Oversight Committee received a response from DOJ on the subpoena for the files?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: No, not to my knowledge. They have two weeks to basically produce these files.

I'm hopeful that the DOJ complies. But, at the same time, I don't know how they're going to comply. That being said, there's tremendous pressure. I mean, we're receiving a lot of outreach from constituents and otherwise calling for the release of these files. I suspect my Republican colleagues are as well.

BROWN: Just to talk about the Democrats on this, I mean, previously, under the Biden administration, there wasn't this sort of pressure to release the files. Why is it so important to you as a Democrat to ratchet up the pressure now?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: I think two reasons.

One, now we know that these -- there's just, for some reason, an unwillingness to release these files. And I think that we need to know what's in there to get to the bottom of what's really going on with the situation. And then, two, all legislative business has been brought to a standstill because of these Epstein files. The American people want us to do their business. That means, for

instance, funding the government, which is the top agenda item when we return to Washington. And now this Epstein files issue is standing in the way of that as well.

BROWN: Your committee also issued subpoenas for several high-profile officials on the Epstein matter, including Bill and Hillary Clinton and former FBI Directors James Comey and Robert Mueller. Have you received responses from any of them?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Not to my knowledge.

I think that, at this point, those subpoenas or those requests have just gone out within the last couple of days. So I expect we will be receiving responses in a timely fashion, hopefully soon.

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BROWN: So, we also know that the Justice Department has this audio recording and transcript of the interview Deputy Attorney General Todd Blanche conducted with Epstein accomplice, Ghislaine Maxwell. The administration is considering releasing those publicly. Do you support that?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Oh, absolutely. They should -- they should release the transcript. They should release the audio recording. We need to know exactly what the deputy attorney general asked of Ghislaine Maxwell, how she answered.

And why this even happened in the first place is very unusual. I think the fact that she is desperately seeking a pardon or some form of clemency, the fact that Donald Trump is not willing to rule it out is also why I have introduced a resolution that basically opposes any form of clemency for this hardened sex trafficker.

BROWN: Yes, tell us more about that because you offered this resolution urging the president and DOJ not to offer any form of clemency to Maxwell in exchange for her testimony.

The president has said he has the power to issue pardons, but he hasn't ruled it out. Do you have any buy-ins from Republicans to pass the resolution?

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Not to my knowledge. I think they're very scared of the president.

And I think that at this point we need to say with one voice that there can't be a pardon or any form of clemency for Ghislaine Maxwell. That would be the -- that would be basically a cover-up of what's happening right now. In general, the pardon power has been abused by this president. We need to have longer-term reforms with regard to that issue.

But in this particular case, it kind of is one of those situations where I believe the vast majority of Americans oppose any form of clemency for Maxwell. And we need to say that with one voice in Congress as well.

BROWN: Congressman Raja Krishnamoorthi, thank you so much.

KRISHNAMOORTHI: Thank you.

BROWN: All right, so I want to bring in CNN legal analyst and former federal prosecutor Elliot Williams.

Elliot, you worked at the Justice Department. What did you make of what the congressman said there? What happens next if the Justice Department and some of these individuals do not comply with subpoenas from House Oversight?

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: The problem with, if the Justice Department doesn't comply, Congress can refer them to prosecution to the Justice Department.

BROWN: Right.

WILLIAMS: So there's not much there.

Now, these other people are in a slightly different scenario because they're former government officials who have to talk to the Justice Department about the things that they would say, right? Eric Holder, former attorney general of the United States, is one of the people who's gotten a subpoena.

He would have to go to the Justice Department to work out with them the terms of his testimony. So there's a lot of talking that needs to happen behind the scenes before anybody responds to any letters or before anybody decides who's going to jail or getting further action taken against them by Congress.

BROWN: Right.

I want to ask you about this meeting at the vice president's residence tonight.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

BROWN: You have top DOJ officials, Pam Bondi, the deputy attorney general, Todd Blanche, the White House chief of staff, and, of course, J.D. Vance meeting to discuss the sensitivity around the Epstein case and the messaging around it.

How unusual was that?

WILLIAMS: It's remarkably unusual.

And, quite frankly, Pam, we should step back and throw cold water on the notion that there is the separation between the Justice...

BROWN: I was going to say, because that used to be this operating M.O.

WILLIAMS: Going back to Watergate, and people have a hard time believing that, well, because the president appoints the attorney general, therefore, the attorney general works for him. No. And from Republican and Democratic administrations, there's actually been a very clear separation when it comes to talking about the specifics of cases, as you would have here.

So, number one, it's remarkable. Number two, it's a damage control meeting where you have the White House chief of staff and the vice president and senior Justice Department officials. It's just odd on many levels. They're free to do it, but, again, it really flies in the face of conduct that both parties have engaged in for years.

BROWN: Why does it matter to have independence between DOJ and the White House, especially on a matter like this?

WILLIAMS: Because there -- this goes back to Watergate, this idea of the president having a say in criminal prosecution and investigation. That is the red line. It's not just the work of the government. It's not messaging or communications or policy or anything like that.

It's really, when it comes to a question of who's going to jail, who's getting prosecuted, who is getting out of jail, who is getting moved to prisons in different facilities, all of those questions really ought to be handled just by the Justice Department because we don't want a scenario where political leadership is telling our prosecutorial apparatus who should be free and who shouldn't.

BROWN: And this is a sensitive issue for Trump as well. So...

WILLIAMS: Yes. It is a sensitive issue for Trump as well because of the fact that he was prosecuted or at least charged with crimes by another presidential administration.

Now, again, it's a little different there only because there is no evidence that the White House in those cases was directing the prosecutions against Donald Trump. Yes, it was a Democratic administration, but, again, there's no evidence that Joe Biden was directing the Justice Department to prosecute his successor.

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BROWN: So I want to ask you about the idea of releasing the audio recording, as well as a transcript of this interview with Maxwell.

What about that? I mean, how -- if they did release it, how unusual would that be?

WILLIAMS: Again, it would be quite unusual. Now, again, it doesn't -- audio recordings don't have the same sensitivity of grand jury materials, which are sensitive and secure by law.

The Justice Department is free to release them. But, again, it's just another can of worms. There's a tremendous amount of public desire for these materials to come out. And it's hard to know that releasing anything short of a clear declaration from the government that says, this is everything we have and this stops here, you're going to still have the Joe Rogans and folks in the world clamoring for more information.

So I just don't think that it satisfies the huge public need and interest in this.

BROWN: I want to follow up really quickly with Joe Rogan in a second.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

BROWN: But even if they release the audio and the transcripts, for example, the transcript, they're likely to be redactions because the victims need to be protected. So will this issue ever go away?

WILLIAMS: It's redactions not just of victims, but also of people who are implicated.

BROWN: People who are implicated.

WILLIAMS: And I think those are the kinds of things that people want to know about. And so...

BROWN: Right. And so that's like -- will that just add fuel to the fire as one of the -- right.

WILLIAMS: It's just going to have fuel to the fire, short of saying, no, this is the end. This is going on.

BROWN: Well, they already -- DOJ said that, which is interesting.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

BROWN: And they -- clearly didn't go away. Now the same officials that said, no, this is the end, they're the ones meeting with J.D. Vance.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

BROWN: But really quickly, I mean, this idea, according to our reporting, there's been some consideration for Todd Blanche from DOJ to go on Joe Rogan's show. Joe Rogan has been very critical of the Trump administration handling of this.

WILLIAMS: It's very, very dangerous for Todd Blanche, and for a number of reasons. You have been a journalist for a long time. It's hard to talk to reporters or people who are critical.

Todd Blanche just does not have experience in doing that. So, number one, he's facing a sort of critical audience or a critical interviewer. Number two, he's got to answer questions about, did you direct Ghislaine Maxwell to be moved from one prison to another?

BROWN: And Trump says he -- claims he didn't really think about it. Go ahead.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

What did you discuss with her? He can't say no to answering those questions. These are pointed questions that Joe Rogan, with a huge audience, can ask Todd Blanche directly. And it could end up being a disaster for him.

Now, that's up to him to decide. That's up to the deputy attorney general. But that is so remarkably odd and such a risk to the Justice Department that I have a hard time seeing how it's in their interest to do it. But these are crazy times. Here we are.

BROWN: Never say never. All right, Elliot Williams, thank you so much.

WILLIAMS: No problem.

BROWN: And still ahead right here in THE SITUATION ROOM, we're going to talk with Democratic Congressman Seth Magaziner, one of several lawmakers getting an earful from voters during their time away from Capitol Hill.

And a call to action. Scientists say a Marine heat wave slamming the Great Barrier Reef could mean devastation for countries around the world.

You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

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BROWN: Welcome back to THE SITUATION ROOM.

Members of Congress are out of Washington, but not getting any reprieve from the pressures of politics.

Rhode Island Democrats Congressman Seth Magaziner and Senator Jack Reed are the latest to get a piece of their constituents' minds, with voters at town halls pressing them on just about everything.

Congressman Magaziner joins us now. He serves on the Homeland Security Committee.

Thank you so much for coming on the show.

So, one complaint that you heard was that Democrats are not doing enough to push back against President Trump's immigration policies. I mean, there's this new polling that was just out that finds Trump's approval rating on immigration fell nine points since April, with his net approval on that issue dropping 20 points.

So why can't Democrats seem to capitalize this, or at least in the perception of your constituents?

REP. SETH MAGAZINER (D-RI): Well, first of all, what we're seeing across the country right now is that the American people are frustrated. They are upset that this Republican tax bill is taking away people's health care to pay for tax cuts for billionaires. They are worried about ICE agents, masked men tackling people in the

street, deporting people without due process, including people who are here legally, including U.S. citizen children with cancer. And so it's understandable that people are frustrated, are scared.

And what we're seeing is that our Republican colleagues across the country have stopped holding town halls because they don't want to hear from their voters. On the Democratic side, we are holding town halls because we want to hear from them.

And to answer your question, as a member of the Homeland Security Committee, I have been focused on elevating the stories of innocent people who have been impacted by the cruel abuses of the administration under the guise of immigration enforcement, telling the stories of children, including U.S. citizens with cancer who have been deported without the consent of their parents.

Telling the stories of people like Andry Hernandez Romero, a makeup artist from Venezuela, who didn't even enter the country illegally, who presented himself at a port of entry, and was sent to a torture prison in El Salvador for four months.

So, listen, the reality is that Republicans are in the majority. They have full control of government right now. They own what's going on. What we can do as Democrats is make sure that the public is aware of what is happening, is aware that it is wrong, telling the stories of the people who have been impacted, so that we can continue to shift public opinion to our side and put pressure on the administration and ultimately win back control of Congress in the midterms, so that we can put some real guardrails and due process back in place.

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BROWN: But what was your takeaway? Clearly, there's frustration from your constituents who were there about Trump administration policies. What was your takeaway in terms of what more you as a Democrat and other Democrats need to do to meet this moment?

MAGAZINER: Yes, so, again, there's three arenas where we are fighting and where we need to fight, legislatively, where, again, our options are limited in the minority, but any chance we get, we are forcing Republicans to take votes that make them own what the administration is doing.

In the court, in the judicial system, where over 200 lawsuits have been filed by Democratic attorneys general, and where we as Democratic members of Congress are signing on to amicus briefs in support. But the third and most important arena where this struggle is unfolding, again, is in the court of public opinion.

At the end of the day, public opinion matters, because Donald Trump and the Republicans do not want to lose the midterms. They know that, if Democrats take control of Congress, not only will we put real guardrails in place and say things like no more ICE arrests at schools or places of worship, no more anonymous ICE agents that don't have personal identifiers, no more masks.

We will also be able to investigate and issue subpoenas and have real accountability to expose what the administration is doing and hold them accountable. But that only works if we continue to elevate the stories of the people who have been impacted, we continue to motivate the public to stay engaged and get involved.

Donald Trump and the Republicans, they want voters to stay home, and they want to rig the system by doing things like redistricting in Texas, because they know that the public is shifting against them, not only on immigration, but on tariffs, on costs, on all of these issues.

BROWN: So let me just follow up on what you say, because last night when asked by voters about Democrats' ability to win back power in the 2026 midterms, you said you won't be successful if we're -- quote -- "We're just presenting ourselves as the anti-Trump party."

So, just specifically, do you feel like you and your colleagues are doing enough right now to take your House next year? You the that legislative and the legal front and then the public square, the public opinion. Are you doing enough? Are you satisfied with what Democrats are doing in that sphere?

MAGAZINER: Yes, so we all need to dig deep and do as much as we possibly can.

And you're right. Part of it is calling out the extremism of the Trump administration, but an equally important part is, we need to put together a proactive agenda that we can bring to the American people to show how we will lower their costs, improve their health care, reform our immigration system, our broken immigration system.

And town halls like we did last night in Rhode Island are part of that process. I fully expect that House Democrats will unveil a proactive, positive policy agenda for the American people in the coming months. But importantly, and this is crucial, it can't be a top-down process to develop that platform.

It has to be bottom-up. And that's why it starts with town halls like we had last night, where we can get feedback from the American people on the pressures that they are feeling, the policies that they would like to see implemented. And then, in the coming months, we will take that feedback back to Washington and develop and release a proactive, positive policy agenda for the Democratic Party.

Because part of it is calling out Trump's extremism, but an equally important part is making sure that we are listening to people and developing a proactive policy agenda that will make people's lives better.

BROWN: Congressman Seth Magaziner, thank you so much.

MAGAZINER: Thank you for having me.

BROWN: Up next: Infections from raw milk in Florida are prompting a new alert from health officials, this as Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is embracing raw milk.

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BROWN: Well, new this morning, Florida officials have issued a warning on raw milk.

And this comes as nearly two dozen Floridians developed food poisoning after drinking tainted raw milk, with several of them being hospitalized.

Let's go live now to CNN health reporter Jacqueline Howard.

Jacqueline, raw milk is actually a product that has been championed by U.S. Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. What more can you tell us about what happened here?

JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: Pamela, what I can tell you, this is an ongoing investigation in Florida.

But what we know so far about this outbreak of illnesses that have been tied to raw milk, so far, there have been at least 21 cases of people getting sick, including seven hospitalizations. And we do know, sadly, among those who've gotten sick, they include six children under the age of 10.

And these illnesses specifically are being caused by campylobacter and E. coli. These are bacterial infections that can cause diarrhea, vomiting, stomach cramps, and even severe complications. And this can happen because, since raw milk has not been heated through the pasteurization process to kill bacteria, consuming raw milk can lead to the exposure to harmful bacteria like E. coli, like what we're seeing in Florida.

And that's why many states actually have laws around selling raw milk, even in Florida. In that state, raw milk can only be sold for non- human consumption, so either as pet food or animal food. But we do see in cases some people do like to consume it, and that comes with the risk of outbreaks like what we're seeing right now in Florida, Pamela.

BROWN: It certainly does.

I want to turn to some other health news. HHS announced that it is slashing $500 million in already approved contracts for the mRNA vaccine. What do you know about that?