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Rep. Jason Crow (D-CO), Is Interviewed About Trump Expected To Visit Israel On Monday; NY Atty. General Letitia James Indicted After Pressure From Trump; Sources: U.S. Atty. Didn't Coordinate With Bondi On NY AG Indictment. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired October 10, 2025 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Does President Trump deserve for this remarkable agreement?

REP. JASON CROW (D-CO): Well, this does need to end the -- the terrible, terrible tragedy we've seen the last couple of years. It's been awful. Over 60,000 civilians have been killed or are starving right now. This must end. October 7th was a terrible disaster. So, the proof is going to be in -- in how this is executed.

You know, I am cautiously optimistic that this is going to get done. We need to return the hostages. We need to end the fighting. We need to get food and aid into -- into Gaza so the Palestinian people stop starving. And we need a solution that allows both parties, Israel and the Palestinians, to have peace, safety, security, and self- determination. And until they both have dignity and the right to exist in security, this will never end.

So, that's what needs to happen. You know, I don't trust Donald Trump. There's no reason to trust Donald Trump. But I will, of course, work with any administration that wants to achieve those things.

BROWN: You may not trust Donald Trump, but what has been achieved here so far is something that was not achieved by President Biden with the potential end of the war and all of the hostages being turned over. So, do you give President Trump credit for that?

CROW: Well, you know what I don't like? I don't like the fact that nearly 70,000 women and children and civilians have been killed in the last couple of years, right? Do you think that's a success, Pamela? Do you think that that's OK?

BROWN: Well, I'm certainly not saying that.

CROW: Hamas is evil. And --

BROWN: And that was under both administrations, right.

CROW: Yes. Well, let's not -- yes, exactly. And -- and the Biden administration bears responsibility, too. And that's why I pushed back on the Biden administration to rein in the -- the Netanyahu government and to make sure that they change the manner in which they were conducting this war, which, in my view, as a three-time combat veteran, an army ranger, and paratrooper, I thought was the wrong way to achieve security and the wrong way to go after Hamas, which, by the way, does need to be destroyed. Hamas is a terrible organization. It shouldn't exist. It's a terrorist organization. But there's a right way to do it and a wrong way to do it.

So, I'm not willing to just gloss over the history here and say, what a great success after tens of thousands of women and children have been killed. That was a terrible travesty, right? And I think there needs to be accountability for that, what that looks like. We need to have that discussion. But yes, I do want peace, and I want the fighting to stop, and I want the hostages to be returned.

BROWN: And do you think -- do you think Benjamin Netanyahu is a war criminal?

CROW: I think we need to have that discussion. I think we need to look at what happened, what didn't happen. I think we need to look back over the last couple of years. And I do think that we need to pursue accountability, because I'm -- I'm somebody that believes in justice, and I believe in accountability for things that have happened in the past. We just can't gloss over history, and that discussion is an important one.

BROWN: So what does that look like -- what does that look like a trial for Benjamin Netanyahu? What does that look like to you?

CROW: We're putting the cart way before the horse, Pamela. We need peace. We need to carry out this deal. The fighting needs to stop, and then there needs to be a discussion about accountability.

BROWN: To be clear, I'm not putting the cart before the horse. I'm just asking. You're saying there needs to be accountability. I'm asking what that -- what that looks like exactly. Congressman Jason Crow, thank you so much for your time. Have a great weekend.

CROW: Thank you, Pamela.

BROWN: The next hour of The Situation Room starts right now.

It's Friday. Happening now, breaking news. Israel says a ceasefire is now in effect for Gaza after two years of brutal and deadly fighting. We were just talking about that, and already Palestinians are lining up by the thousands to return to parts of northern Gaza that have seen months of bombardment. Israel's prime minister spoke about the ceasefire just a little while ago.

And this morning, we're also learning new details about President Trump's plans to visit Israel in the coming days.

Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm Pamela Brown. Wolf Blitzer is on assignment, and you're in The Situation Room.

We begin this hour with a federal grand jury in Virginia indicting another one of President Trump's political opponents, this time New York Attorney General Letitia James. James, who won a lawsuit against Trump nearly two years ago, was indicted after the President urged the Justice Department to take action against her. The charges come just weeks after the indictment of former FBI Director James Comey, making James the latest target in the president's pursuit of political retribution.

Let's go live now to CNN's Kara Scannell in New York. Kara, walk us through these charges that have been brought against James.

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, good morning, Pamela. These two charges that James is facing involves a charge of bank fraud and one of making false statements to a financial institution. They all relate to a mortgage she took out in 2020. And what prosecutors allege is that James took out a mortgage on this house as a second home that had prohibitions about renting it out.

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And what they allege James did is that she rented out the property. And because she did that, she benefited from that, because they're alleging that the interest rates on an investment property would have been higher than what -- what she did -- did get under a second home. And that totaled just under $19,000. So that is the focus of these charges.

It's one loan. And the alleged amount of ill-gotten gains is just less than $19,000. Now, James has vowed to fight this. She has claimed that she's innocent. And she says that this is political weaponization. Here's more of what she said after these charges were announced.

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LETITIA JAMES, NEW YORK ATTORNEY GENERAL: This is nothing more than a continuation of the President's desperate weaponization of our justice system. He is forcing federal law enforcement agencies to do his bidding, all because I did my job as a New York state attorney general. These charges are baseless. And the President's public statements make clear that his only goal is political retribution at any cost.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCANNELL: Now, Pam, the history between Letitia James and Donald Trump goes back years. She campaigned for attorney general, saying that she was going to investigate his real estate property. She did bring a civil fraud lawsuit against him and his adult sons, alleging that they obtained favorable interest rates on loans because Donald Trump inflated his net worth by inflating the values of his properties. This investigation into James has been going on since April.

And at that time, we know that, over the course of this period, that the prosecutors interviewed more than a dozen witnesses. There was a belief by some of the line prosecutors they did not have enough to bring the case. That U.S. attorney had resigned under pressure from Trump, who wanted this charge brought against James. And Trump's own hand-picked attorney general for -- or U.S. attorney for the Eastern District of Virginia, Lindsey Halligan, she presented this case before the grand jury herself. James will be in court on October 24th. Pam?

BROWN: All right, Kara Scannell in New York, thanks so much.

Let's discuss more now with former federal prosecutor, Alyse Adamson. Alyse, let me just cut straight to it. Do you think the DOJ has a case here?

ALYSE ADAMSON, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Well, Pam, I mean, that's an interesting question. I think what we can say right now is we know there's at least probable cause that there's a case here because James has been indicted. That is when prosecutors present the case to a grand jury, and the grand jury determines that there is at least probable cause to proceed.

But whether or not on the merits the Department of Justice can ultimately prove this case beyond a reasonable doubt is yet to be seen. And I think what's also significant, Pam, is that there is reporting, as Kara Scannell just mentioned, that line attorneys did not believe that the evidence was sufficient to get a conviction in this case.

And the Department of Justice has something called the Justice Manual, which is internal guidance for prosecutors, which states that if prosecutors do not believe the evidence is sufficient to sustain a conviction, they should not bring a case. So again, yet to be seen, but interesting reporting that others did not believe that this was a meritorious case.

BROWN: Like the DOJ's case against James Comey, this one was also brought by Lindsey Halligan. She's a former personal lawyer to Trump who has no prior experience as an attorney, as a prosecutor in a situation like this. She was the only prosecutor whose name appeared on the James indictment. What does that tell you?

ADAMSON: Yes, again, Pam, I think the question with this case is, is this law enforcement or is this payback? Because the timing here is critically important. We had that what we now know was supposed to be a private message from the President to A.G. Bondi back on September 20th, urging Bondi to bring charges against James.

Then we know that the former U.S. attorney, Erik Siebert from Eastern District, did not believe in these charges and ultimately resigned or was fired because he was not going to indict Comey, probably also James. And so I -- I think that what it indicates when you only see Lindsey Halligan's name is that other prosecutors did not believe in the case.

And this is what I was just saying, Pam, that prosecutors need to believe that they can prove a case beyond reasonable doubt before they present it to a grand jury. So I think this is just consistent with the reporting, Pam, that the line does not believe in this case and that there is an argument that this is politically motivated.

BROWN: Some might say, look, look what happened with Comey too, you know, with a grand jury indictment. What do you say to that? ADAMSON: Well, again, what I would just remind folks is that the -- the -- the standard of proof, the burden of proof for the government to get an indictment is much lower than to prove a case in a criminal trial -- trial. It is just probable cause to believe that this crime has been committed. It is very one-sided story as well. It's just prosecutors submitting evidence to people sitting there.

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We also know from the Comey indictment that not all the grand jurors voted to indict him on those two charges, and they ultimately couldn't get a third charge through that grand jury. So I think what it says, Pam, is that there is some evidence, but it doesn't really speak to the strength of the evidence. And again, the timeline, the timeline where we know that there is a pressure campaign to bring these charges, I think is going to help Comey and James in their ultimate claims of a selective or vindictive prosecution. And we can expect to see those motions filed very soon, I would believe.

BROWN: All right, Alyse Adamson, thank you so much.

Still ahead right here in The Situation Room, President Trump plans to head to Israel Monday, the same day Hamas is set to release 48 living and dead hostages.

Plus, federal workers are getting smaller paychecks today, and it could be the last one they get until the government reopens. We're going to ask two federal employees about navigating the shutdown's impact on their lives. You're in The Situation Room.

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[11:15:54]

BROWN: Happening now. New video shows Israel's military pulling out from parts of Gaza as the ceasefire takes hold. Some forces will remain, and about 200 U.S. troops will deploy to the Middle East to provide oversight of the U.S. brokered plan. Here you see thousands of Palestinians streaming toward Gaza City this morning after being displaced by two years of war. Sixty-seven thousand other Palestinians have been killed in this war, according to Gaza health officials.

These are the 48 hostages set to be returned to Israel within the next few days. At least 20 of them are still believed to be alive. Among the remains, an IDF soldier who was killed in 2014. Israeli police confirmed that President Trump, who played a critical role in the ceasefire, plans to visit Israel on Monday.

CNN Chief International Correspondent Clarissa Ward joins us now from Tel Aviv. Hi, Clarissa. Tell me what you're seeing and hearing there today.

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: So, Pamela, we are now just over six hours into the ceasefire window. And I would say here in Israel, you can feel a lightness that I haven't felt here in two years of covering this story. People starting to really dream that within that 72-hour window, they will see those hostages return back to Israel. As you mentioned, 20 of them believed to be alive.

Two of those 20 are thought to be in pretty bad health. But nonetheless, I would say an era of anticipation, of excitement, even of jubilation at this possible homecoming. On the Gaza side of the border, we have been looking at these biblical scenes, Pamela, of thousands and thousands of Palestinians picking their way through the rubble, trying to get back to what remains of their homes.

And while you're not seeing necessarily the same, I would say, sort of jubilation, you are hearing these accounts of just this extraordinary sense of disbelief, of relief. This is a people that has been so battered for two years. And now this new chapter really brings a host of different challenges, the challenge of rebuilding, the challenge of mourning, the scale of the loss, of the devastation, and the challenge, of course, crucially, of this horrific humanitarian crisis.

The Lancet medical journal just on Wednesday releasing reports saying that 55,000 Palestinian children in Gaza are believed to be suffering from acute malnutrition. Now, the IDF body that coordinates the dispersal of aid inside the Gaza Strip has said that 600 trucks are now going through into Gaza every single day.

That is part of this surge in aid, which is an integral part of this plan. But more and more will be needed as the next phase begins. But for now, Pamela, as I said, on both sides of this border, a sense of disbelief as people try to get their arms around the momentous nature of this moment, Pamela.

BROWN: Momentous, indeed. The ceasefire, as you noted, has started the clock. Hamas has now less than 72 hours to return those hostages to Israel. What will you be looking for over these next few days as everything is still very tenuous?

WARD: It's still very tenuous. And what's becoming clear, Pamela, with everybody who I have been speaking to in the UAE, in Qatar, here in Israel, in Gaza, is that there are a lot of moving parts. And a lot of this plan is being developed as it is being carried out. I spoke to one U.S. defense official who said, you know, honestly, we're kind of building the plane while we are flying it here.

I think one key thing to look at will be this international stabilization force, as it's being called by some, including those 200 CENTCOM U.S. troops, who will be working together to essentially facilitate security and create the mechanisms that will allow the implementation of these next phases in this Trump 20-point plan.

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And I should say that, at this stage, I think a lot of the details are still being worked out. But the momentum is there. The goodwill is there. The commitment is there. And all sides that I've been talking to saying, listen, we just have to keep putting one foot in front of the other to ensure that we don't lose that crucial momentum and that we don't see a return to the misery and the fighting that we have seen over these past two years, Pamela.

BROWN: So much misery all around. Clarissa Ward, thank you so much.

And up later, how the Trump administration is already making plans to fight back after a federal judge blocked its National Guard deployment in Chicago.

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BROWN: We are following breaking news. Rescue teams are responding to an explosion. Look at this. This occurred at a company that actually specializes in making military explosives. The facility is about an hour west of Nashville. CNN's Ryan Young joins us. What are you learning, Ryan?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we're monitoring this right now. In fact, I've just got off the phone with an EMS person in that area. They are telling me right now. They're not even able to fully respond to the area because of all the secondary explosions right now. They have more than 10 fire trucks on scene, more than four ambulances.

We've also been told that no one has been transported from the site right now. But, Pamela, when you look at this devastation from this explosion, the cars ripped to pieces. Things still on fire. You understand how impactful this explosion was, the serious nature in it. Right now, more emergency crews are responding to the area. This place is accurate, interjected systems.

We're told about an hour outside of Nashville. But you understand after talking to the EMS workers, they are concerned about these secondary explosions that are in the area. That just blocked the area. That's right before 8 o'clock central time, 9 o'clock local. So right now, we continue to follow this as this ongoing situation evolves. Pam?

BROWN: All right, Ryan. Thanks so much.

And we have some other breaking news coming in. We have new CNN reporting on the federal felony indictment against New York Attorney General Letitia James. Two sources are telling us that Attorney General Pam Bondi was caught off guard by the indictment. Let's go live now to CNN senior White House correspondent, Kristen Holmes. What are you learning from your sources, Kristen?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and this comes after CNN had already reported that the attorney general and the deputy attorney general had been hesitant to bring charges against James because of the information that they had heard from Erik Siebert, who was at that time the U.S. attorney in the Eastern District of Virginia since he left that post.

Halligan, of course, appointed by President Trump to be that handpicked U.S. attorney in that district. And we are told Halligan did not coordinate with the Department of Justice on this. That is why these officials, including the attorney general herself, were caught off guard.

Now, it had seemed to be relayed at some point to these top officials that Halligan would be pursuing the case. But no actual details were exchanged between Halligan or the Department of Justice main branch on when it was going to happen.

So when this announcement came, when Halligan actually secured this indictment against James, it was news to the top DOJ officials. Of course, as we know, Halligan had brought the case against former FBI Director James Comey. We also know that she had really been tasked with bringing these cases against his political rivals.

So the fact that she didn't coordinate is very stunning. This is usually something with a case this big, particularly when there's a close affiliation with the White House and what we've heard from President Trump. The fact that they didn't coordinate is really something, Pamela.

BROWN: Yes. And I wonder if there -- if there's any indication from the sources you talked to if it had anything to do with that Truth Social post where President Trump called on Pam Bondi to prosecute Letitia James, Adam Schiff and James Comey.

HOLME: Yes. And obviously, as we've been reporting today, that was intended to be a private message to the attorney general. But I do also want to remind you of something that my colleague Evan Perez and I reported after James Comey had been indicted, which was that Lindsey Halligan and the team there on the ground did not have support or help from the Department of Justice for that case either, that they were -- that Halligan had been briefed. She had never even presented in front of a grand jury before.

And instead, she was briefed and prepared by agents and officials, attorneys at the FBI, not the Department of Justice, before she actually went before the grand jury. This time, I am told that she was not prepared. She didn't work in terms of by the FBI. She didn't work with the FBI or the Department of Justice before presenting that case and then securing that indictment.

BROWN: Wow. Quite, quite the reporting there. Kristen Holmes live for us from the White House. Thanks so much.

[11:29:35]

Just ahead here in The Situation Room, we're going to talk to a pair of furloughed federal workers about coping with all this uncertainty and confusion of a government shutdown that doesn't appear to be ending anytime soon.

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