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Palestinian Activist Mahmoud Khalil Fights Trump Deportation; Trump Administration Given Green Light to Send Oregon National Guard into Portland; V.P. Vance Arrives in Israel as Ceasefire Faced Its First Major Test. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired October 21, 2025 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now, deployment decision. An appeals court rules that President Trump can send National Guard troops to Portland against the state's wishes. So, how soon could we see boots on the ground?

And Roblox under fire, Florida's Attorney General says, this popular gaming platform is a, quote, breeding ground for predators. What's being done right now to keep your children safe.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: A nominee in jeopardy, serious jeopardy. Lawmakers from both sides of the aisle are raising the red flag over the president's pick to lead the special counsel's office, the racist texts he's accused of making that included references to MLK and Nazis.

An East Wing extreme makeover, demolition begins at the White House to make way for the president's 90,000-square foot ballroom.

Welcome to our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer with Pamela Brown, and you're in The Situation Room.

And we begin this hour with the breaking news. A court hearing is underway in Philadelphia for Mahmoud Khalil, a Palestinian activist who's fighting his deportation from the United States. ICE agents arrested Khalil in March as part of the Trump administration's crackdown on pro-Palestinian activists. He was prominent over at Columbia University in New York in protests against the war in Gaza.

Today, his attorneys are arguing that efforts to deport Khalil, a legal U.S permanent resident, violate his right to free speech and are unconstitutional. But the Trump administration is citing a rarely used law to make its case.

CNN Correspondent Priscilla Alvarez is here with us in The Situation Room. Priscilla, you've reported extensively on this case of Mahmoud Khalil. How important is today's hearing?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, this is a hearing that so far has been focused on whether or not he can be detained again by the federal government. He has already spent over a hundred days in detention and was released from detention over the summer following a court ruling. So, he is currently released, but the administration has been appealing that and pushing for his detention and his removal.

Now, so far, the hearing has been going on for an hour and it has been very much focused on, again, whether the court that said that he could be released had blocked the administration from detaining and removing him, whether they had jurisdiction.

So, it's been very in the weeds so far in terms of who was able to make the decision of his removal, because, again, these cases have been happening in New Jersey, where, of course, he had been detained, but they -- but he had been detained for a period of time in Louisiana. So, you can see how this can get quite complex in terms of who has the say.

What's been interesting to hear from this panel of judges is whether or not they see this as a second bite of the apple, and that is actually a direct quote from one of the judges. And that is to say there is an immigration court system that is where someone can contest their removal, their detention. So, they're sort of wavering in terms of, well, don't they already have a venue to be making these claims? It doesn't make sense for us to continue in federal court and now this appeals court.

And that really speaks, Wolf and Pamela, to just the twists and turns of this case. This was a huge case, and it's still an important one because it goes to the cornerstone of what this administration has wanted to do, which is revoke visas and legal residency from those who they see as a national security risk using this obscure law.

So, this is still a very important case and it is now one that is playing out in the immigration court system, it's playing out in the federal court system. And so today, we'll learn more as to whether this appeals court believes that they can make a decision and whether the lower court can make the decision that he not be detained or removed.

So, this is still very much going on and it's still alive, and we'll see what happens. I'm not sure that we'll get a decision today. Appeals courts usually take some time. It's a panel of judges. But, certainly, it speaks to just the intricacies of this case and how complex it is for a person who the administration is still very keen on and focused on.

BROWN: And as you point out, it's not just about one person, right?

ALVAREZ: Right.

BROWN: That has bigger implications.

BLITIZER: And I just want to make the point again, he's a permanent legal resident and he's not an undocumented immigrant or anything like that.

[10:05:01] He's a permanent legal resident of the United States who is making pro-Palestinian statements, and that's why apparently he's being detained.

ALVAREZ: Yes. And lastly, I'll just say, his attorney said during this hearing, Mr. Khalil is being deprived of speech. They see that if he is in detention, he is being deprived of his rights. So, that is something we'll see flushed out as well.

BLITIZER: Excellent reporting. Priscilla Alvarez, thank you very, very much. Pamela?

BROWN: All right. Happening now, Wolf, the Trump administration has the green light to send the Oregon National Guard to Portland as part of its immigration enforcement crackdown. That's after a federal appeals court overturned a lower court order barring the deployment.

There's at least one more legal hurdle to clear before there will be boots on the ground from the National Guard, but this decision marks a notable victory for the White House as it challenges other Democratic- led cities over troop mobilization.

So, let's go to CNN National Correspondent Nick Watt, who was in Portland last night.

NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is the ICE facility at the center of this issue. And these are the allegedly war-ravaged streets, according to President Trump, where he wants to send the National Guard.

Now, there are a few dozen people around here, protesters perhaps, but very, very peaceful for now. We are not going to see National Guard on these streets for at least a few days because there are still legal wrinkles to come out.

So, basically, there were two temporary restraining orders, one saying that the federal government could not federalize the Oregon National Guard, the second saying that they could not deploy federalized National Guard in Oregon.

What has been lifted is that order saying that they weren't allowed to federalize the Oregon Guard. They can now do that, but, technically, they still can't deploy federalized National Guard on these streets, not yet. The federal government thinks it's just a formality for that restraining order also to be lifted.

Now, why did the judges rule this way? Well, there was damage to this building in the summer. There was some violence here in the summer. Federal protection service officers had to be sent in. So, these two judges, two of the three judges, ruled that the president was acting within his authority to send federal troops to execute the rule of law. The government had also argued that this constituted a rebellion what's been happening here. The judges did not agree with that.

Now, Oregon officials are going to fight this and continue to fight this. The governor called this an unwanted, unneeded military intervention, gross un-American abuse of power. The attorney general says, we are on a dangerous path in America. It's going to be interesting to see over the next few days and we will be watching the reaction of the people here on the street if and when, probably when, National Guard Troops arrive. Back to you.

BROWN: All right. Nick Watt, thanks so much. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right. Happening right now, the vice president of the United States, J.D. Vance, has arrived in Israel where he is trying to hold together the U.S.-brokered Gaza ceasefire. The truce has been looking rather shaky after both Israel and Hamas exchanged deadly attacks over the weekend.

Vice President Vance met with the White House special envoy, Steve Witkoff, and President Trump's son-in-law, Jared Kushner, who are also both in Israel right now. The New York Times is reporting that there are deep concerns within the Trump administration that Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu may abandon the ceasefire deal. We'll have more on the visit in just a few minutes. We're getting new information.

And still ahead, quote, tragedy averted how police say a family's very quick thinking prevented a possible mass shooting at one of the nation's busiest airports.

BROWN: And then later it's one of the most popular gaming platforms out there, especially for kids. Now, the state of Florida is cracking down on Roblox. The demands from the attorney general there to help protect children.

You are in The Situation Room. We will be right back.

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BROWN: Happening now, a battle over on campus protests and government power. Today, an appeals court in Philadelphia is considering the case of Mahmoud Khalil, a Palestinian activist who is fighting his deportation from the U.S. Back in March, ICE agents arrested Khalil as part of the Trump administration's crackdown on pro-Palestinian activists.

He was prominent at Columbia University in protests against the war in Gaza. This is what he told us when he appeared in The Situation Room in late July.

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MAHMOUD KHALIL, PRO-PALESTINIAN ACTIVIST: The Trump administration wanted to find anything against me so they can deport me. They had to literally go through every application I ever applied in this country to find these bogus claims that I willfully misrepresented my green card application. But it's absolutely retaliation and I did not misrepresent anything.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Well, today, his attorneys are arguing that efforts to deport Khalil, a legal U.S. permanent resident, violate his right to free speech and are likely unconstitutional. But the Trump administration is citing a rarely used law to make its case.

Joining us now to better understand this and the implications is CNN Senior Legal Analyst Elie Honig, a former state and federal prosecutor, also the author of the new book, When You Come at the King, Inside DOJ's Pursuit of the President from Nixon to Trump. Hey, Elie, great to see you.

So, tell us more about this rarely used law that administration officials are arguing today.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: So, Pam, the law that the Trump administration is trying to use to deport Mr. Khalil is the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952. It's a rarely used law, but what it says is that the secretary of state can deport a non-citizen if the secretary of state finds that that person poses negative consequences for U.S. foreign policy.

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Now, Mr. Khalil filed a lawsuit to try to block his deportation under that law. The case wound up with a federal district court, which is a trial level judge in New Jersey. That judge held extensive hearings over the summer and he concluded, first of all, that the administration's effort to deport Mahmoud Khalil was unconstitutional, that the law itself is overly broad and that it violates Mr. Khalil's First Amendment rights.

The judge also released Khalil on bail, which is why he's not in behind bars, which is why he's free today. And what's happening now today is the next level up. The intermediate court of appeals for the third circuit is reviewing that. So, both sides are having that argument about whether his deportation is constitutional and whether he can remain free on bail.

BROWN: This case involves one person, right, Mahmoud Khalil, but its core issues here of free speech and government power run deep and could have these huge implications. Do you believe this is ultimately headed to the Supreme Court, and how do you think that they might rule on it?

HONIG: It certainly could be headed that way. And, yes, the issue, on the one hand, the administration says this is a law Congress gave the president, the secretary of state, very broad authority to deport people in their discretion. On the other hand, Khalil's argument, which the trial judge agreed with, is that if it's used to punish people for what they say, that would violate the First Amendment.

Now, whoever loses here in the Third Circuit Court of Appeals will almost certainly ask the full court of appeals, today's in front of a three-judge panel, but will then ask the full court of appeals to rehear the case. But whoever loses there will almost certainly ask the U.S. Supreme Court to take the case.

Now, the Supreme Court tends to take very few of the cases presented to it, but this one presents core constitutional First Amendment issues. And so I think it's got a higher likelihood than your average case of the Supreme Court taking it.

BROWN: All right. Really quickly, I want to ask you about yesterday's ruling that clears the way for National Guard troops to deploy in Portland. The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals was split 2-1. You had two Trump-appointed judges siding with the administration, and the third judge appointed by President Clinton, a Democrat, dissented, calling the majority opinion absurd. How did you view this ruling?

HONIG: Stark disagreements between these three judges. So, the two Trump-appointed judges in the majority found, first of all, it's largely up to the president whether there are these emergency conditions that require deployment of National Guard to enforce federal law. And the second thing that the two judges in the majority found is that conditions on the street in Portland dating back mostly to the summer, mostly they cite examples from June, July, and August, were serious enough. There were incidents of violence at federal officers and directed at federal buildings to justify the president's use of this power.

But the dissent from the Clinton-appointed judge is a very pointed dissent. In fact, the judge writes, I strenuously dissent, which is unusual. That judge, first of all, says essentially the president's not entitled to any degree of real deference here. And, second of all, that judge says, well, the examples that the majority is looking at, those are out of date. Those are mostly from the summer, and you have to look at the situation now.

So, the parties really -- the judges really disagree, first of all, on how much power the president has and, second of all, on what are the actual conditions on the street and how much of an emergency is it? This one too, Pam, I think could well be headed up to the U.S. Supreme Court.

BROWN: All right. We'll be tracking it closely. Elie Honig, thanks so much. Wolf?

BLITZER: All right, Pamela. Tragedy averted, that's what Atlanta authorities are now saying after police arrested a possible mass shooting suspect at the airport there in Atlanta. The family of the suspect, Billy Joe Cagle, called police to report that he was armed, live streaming on social media and headed to the airport to, quote, shoot it up. Surveillance images show him walking around the Atlanta airport's very crowded south terminal before being confronted by officers.

Cagle was not armed when he was arrested, but police say they found an AR-15 with 27 rounds of ammunition in his truck parked just outside.

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MAYOR ANDRE DICKENS (D-ATLANTA, GA): This individual did have a semi- automatic weapon and this individual was mentally challenged. And when you have those combinations together, it can turn out to be deadly.

CHIEF DARIN SCHIERBAUM, ATLANTA POLICE: I do believe that Mr. Cagle was headed back to his truck to retrieve it, and I do believe he was likely to use that weapon inside the crowded terminal that he had just seen.

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BLITZER: Cagle is charged with making terroristic threats and possession of a firearm by a felon.

BROWN: I just think it's so important to take a moment and really think about this. Thank goodness for his family paying close attention and alerting authorities.

BLITZER: Yes.

BROWN: That is so key in preventing these --

BLITZER: We're getting more of that family members notifying authorities of possible danger out there, and that could save a lot of lives.

BROWN: It can. They're the first line of defense.

All right, coming up here in The Situation Room, shocking new allegations from one of Jeffrey Epstein's most vocal accusers. Up next, new excerpts from Virginia Giuffre's memoir released after her death.

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BLITZER: New developments this morning involving Jeffrey Epstein victim Virginia Giuffre. In her posthumous memoir coming out today, Giuffre feared she might, quote, die a sex slave at the hands of Epstein and his circle. And we're also learning police in London right now are investigating whether Prince Andrew asked an officer to dig up dirt on Giuffre, his sexual assault accuser.

BROWN: CNN Royal Correspondent Max Foster joins us live from London. So, Max, there are also some new allegations in Giuffre's memoir. What more are you learning?

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MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR AND ROYAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's interesting because the first sort of versions of this book came out from the U.K., here it is, and there's some slight discrepancies with the U.S. revision version. It's a really harrowing read. It's very difficult to hear some of the testimony in here, but I'm going to just to warn you ahead of this quote, because this is one of the most harrowing, searing parts of the book, then I'll explain what we learned today. So, she writes that just when I thought things couldn't get worse for me, they did, Epstein trafficked me to a man who raped me more savagely than anyone had before. We were on Epstein's Island when I was ordered to take this man to a cabana. Immediately, it was clear that this man who I've taken pains to describe in legal filings only as a well-known prime minister, wasn't interested in caresses. He wanted violence. So, it's a really harrowing part of the book.

In the U.K. version, it's just described as a minister, and now we see that it's a prime minister. So, this is something that we didn't know before. She doesn't name the prime minister or many of the other men that she writes about in this book. Actually, her co-author on this book, Amy Wallace, has said it shouldn't be up to the survivors to out their abusers. It should be up to the authorities. So, she's saying this is another reason why the so-called Epstein files should be released.

BROWN: Wow.

BLITZER: Max Foster, thank you very much for that update, a horrible story indeed.

BROWN: Really, really disturbing.

And just ahead here in The Situation Room, confirmation in jeopardy, President Trump's picked to lead the Office of Special Counsel in hot water over alleged racist text messages. We're going to have the latest coming up.

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