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Interview With Rep. Sam Liccardo (D-CA); Republicans Target Anthony Fauci; U.S. Military Running Low on Munitions?. Aired 11- 11:30a ET

Aired August 06, 2026 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DAVID GOLDMAN, CNN BUSINESS SENIOR REPORTER: Now, there is supposed to be an 11-fold increase in the amount of computing power if all of those data centers are built, 565 gigawatts, up from 50 today. That is enormous.

[11:00:10]

But Columbia Business School thinks that we're probably going to get a three-fold increase in the next three years. Construction is happening, up 46 percent, according to the Census Bureau, but they are very, very costly, Wolf. One single data center costs $8 billion. Obviously, that is a hurdle as well.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: All right, lots going on that front.

David Goldman, thank you very, very much.

And the next hour of THE SITUATION ROOM starts right now.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: Happening now: messaging on munitions. President Trump denies the U.S. has a weapons shortage amid the war with Iran, as the vice president gives a glimpse into the negotiations.

BLITZER: From invoking the Fifth Amendment to contempt of Congress. Senator Rand Paul just laid out what happens next after the committee he chairs voted to punish Dr. Anthony Fauci. We have details coming up.

We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I'm Wolf Blitzer with Pamela Brown, and you're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BLITZER: We begin this hour with a fiery response from President Trump. He's denying reports that the United States is running low on certain munitions, as the five-month war with Iran drains stockpiles.

The president posted on social media that the United States has -- quote -- "massive amounts."

BROWN: And sources tell CNN the military has exhausted nearly 80 percent of interceptors for a critical missile defense system. So, let's go straight to CNN's senior White House reporter Kevin

Liptak.

So, what more is the president saying about the U.S. munitions supply -- munition supply here, Kevin?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Pamela, he's really trying to tamp down on any suggestions that the U.S. doesn't have what it needs to fight this conflict.

But we know these concerns about the U.S. weapons stockpile, they have been boiling kind of for months, really since the war began, but they are coming to the fore now at what is sort of an inflection point for the conflict, as the president debates a major escalation here.

And what he wrote on social media very late last night -- or, actually, it was very early this morning. It was just past midnight. He said that the U.S. has massive amounts of -- quote -- "munitions" -- unquote -- "especially of certain types. Additionally, large amounts are being manufactured and shipped to the U.S. as needed. Defense companies are building the largest number of plants and factories in our country's history."

But, of course, it's going to take some time between when a defense company announces a new factory and when these weapons are rolling off the assembly line, and that has been a concern for American officials behind the scenes.

CNN has reported that the U.S. has exhausted nearly 80 percent of interceptor for a key defense system. That's the THAAD system. And that is in addition to using roughly half of the Patriot interceptor missiles, and that's, of course, a concern for the U.S., but it's also a concern for American allies in the Gulf, which rely on these weapons and on these systems to defend themselves against Iranian retaliation, which would be a concern if the president decides to escalate the conflict.

That's part of why leaders from these Gulf countries had asked the president to try and allow some space for diplomacy as he was weighing these considerations. The vice president, J.D. Vance, addressed the state of the diplomacy in an interview. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I do think that where we will ultimately land, it's going to be messy and it's going to take some time to get there. Where we will ultimately land -- as you see, oil, I think was at $79 today.

Those oil prices are going to come down and stay down. Iran will never have a nuclear weapon, and the United States will be in a stronger position. But we're kind of in the middle of the game, and I think people are trying to prejudge exactly how this is going to go.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LIPTAK: Now, when it comes to the diplomacy, Iran says today that it is finalizing a deal with Oman to reopen the Strait of Hormuz, but they say they still need a number of conditions met by the United States, including lifting the naval blockade and easing some of the sanctions that went back into place after that memorandum of understanding fell apart -- Pamela.

BROWN: All right, Kevin Liptak, thank you so much -- Wolf.

BLITZER: All right, Pamela, joining us now, former NATO supreme allied commander, retired U.S. army General Wesley Clark. He's also the founder of Renew America Together.

General, thanks so much for joining us.

GEN. WESLEY CLARK (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Hey, Wolf.

BLITZER: There have been several reports, as you know, of this so- called dwindling of U.S. defensive munitions stockpiles, something President Trump is now categorically denying.

How is that potentially, though, a factor in this war with Iran if air defense systems, for example, stockpiles are going down and down?

[11:05:06]

CLARK: Well, I think the greatest impact is the ability to defend ourselves and our friends and allies in the region from Iranian retaliation. So I think we have got most of what we need and lots of it to strike targets.

Once you destroy the radars and you take out their anti-aircraft missiles, you get your aircraft in. Now you still have risk, but you can get over the target or close enough to it, you can use joint direct attack munitions and many other things that are basically iron bombs with guidance on them.

We have got a lot of that. But when it comes down to the Patriot system or the THAAD, well, that's a significant consideration. If we were able to take out all the Iranian's' missile capacities, well, then it wouldn't be as big a factor. But right now we haven't quite figured out how to get all those missile cities.

BLITZER: Iran is negotiating directly, but only with Oman. The vice president, J.D. Vance, you just heard him, said that peace talks with Iran would be messy and take time. What leverage do you think the United States has, the Trump administration right now? Has the U.S. lost its military ability to force Iran into some sort of peace agreement?

CLARK: I don't think we have lost the ability to force Iran militarily.

But I think what the Iranians see is, they see the politics in the United States. And they see this is a president who's worried about congressional elections and the country's split and the public doesn't like this. And the Iranians are -- they're students of history, just like the Russians and Chinese.

They have seen this movie before, especially in Vietnam, and they know what can happen. So that's the big constraint on the military. We do have a lot of economic opportunities. Look, American firms would love to go in there. But here the problem is our friends in the Gulf wouldn't like to see Iran become the largest and most powerful economic factor in the region.

So there's some constraints in our ability to effectively use this. So it is going to be messy, as the vice president said. Maybe we can work our way through it. I think first we have got to sort of go through the 60-day period, get the strait open if we can and get the ticking plot removed from us while we do this.

BLITZER: Let's see if that happens.

The issue of scarcity of U.S. defensive munitions is being felt beyond the Middle East. That's -- you know that Ukraine, for example, is running out of air defenses, and President Zelenskyy has been urging Western allies to try to provide more. They need it desperately in the face of these Russian attacks.

But there are few options with which to replenish from Western stockpiles, and President Trump has backed away from providing Patriot interceptor technology to Ukraine. Should the U.S. let Ukraine build its own Patriot air defense missile system?

CLARK: Absolutely.

And we should be helping do it as rapidly as we can, because their fight really is our fight. As Laura Loomer went over there and saw a couple of weeks ago, these are people fighting for their very existence as a state, their culture, their families, and they're as much as possible sharing our values.

They also have the strongest armed force in Europe and the most experienced. And so we want them as our allies. We don't want to see them crushed. And there are humanitarian considerations, obviously, foremost here in terms of, the way the Russians use their missiles is to create mayhem and destruction of civilians.

So we don't approve of that. And so we have got the solution. The French-Italian missile system Aster is good, but it's not available either. So between the French-Italian system and the Patriot system, got to help the Ukrainians move forward with creating their own system or build Patriots, and probably Patriots is the fastest way forward.

BLITZER: Yes, and the Russians keep attacking civilian targets in Kyiv, the capital, and other urban areas, killing civilians in Ukraine. That's a serious, serious development, to be sure.

General Wesley Clark, as usual, thanks very much for joining us.

CLARK: Thank you, Wolf.

BLITZER: Pamela. BROWN: All right, Wolf, new this morning, a Senate panel has voted to

hold Dr. Anthony Fauci in contempt of Congress after he invoked the Fifth Amendment more than 100 times last week at a hearing.

We're now waiting to see if Dr. Fauci will face criminal prosecution by the Justice Department.

BLITZER: CNN senior reporter Annie Grayer is up on Capitol Hill. She's been watching all of this.

Annie, CNN senior legal analyst Elie Honig told us last hour that if he referred to the Department of Justice, it would go to the U.S. attorney for the District of Colombia. That would be Jeanine Pirro. What more are you hearing?

[11:10:07]

ANNIE GRAYER, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Well, Wolf and Pam, I spoke with the chairman of the Senate Homeland Security Committee, Rand Paul, after this vote.

And he told me that today his committee is going to be walking over these criminal referrals to the attorney general and to D.C. District Court. Now, this is sort of an unprecedented way to go about this, because, normally, if a criminal referral makes it out of a committee, it then would get a floor vote, in this case in the Senate.

But Senator Paul says that he doesn't need to do that. At this point, he might have a Senate vote later down the line. Democrats are furious at this tactic and warned during this hearing that, if Republicans go forward with this, that they might try and do something similar if they ever reclaim the majority, because Paul is essentially setting a new precedent here.

So take a listen to how he defended this decision when I asked him about it after this hearing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY): This is outside of the ordinary bill-making process. So it doesn't have to go to the House, doesn't have to be signed by the president, and really doesn't have to go before the Senate. There is some precedent for doing it that way, and it still may be done that way.

But, for now, we will hand-carry this over to the attorney general. We will hand-carry this to the district court here in Colombia, and we will -- as a committee, we have voted the majority to refer this. So that will be accomplished today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRAYER: Now, once it gets to the Department of Justice, it will be up to them to decide what to do next.

But we know that Fauci has been a top target of President Trump and Republicans for some time. And Republicans on this committee believe that they have a case because they argue that Fauci should not be pleading his Fifth Amendment rights in a committee hearing and should be answering their questions.

As we saw last week, Fauci pled the Fifth over 100 times. He said that he -- Fauci said that he did that to one protect himself, and, two, he felt targeted by Rand Paul throughout this entire investigation. Democrats have pointed out that pleading the Fifth against self- incrimination is an important constitutional right and don't want to upend that.

So, that will all have to be in front of the Justice Department, who also has to weigh that Fauci is a preemptive pardon that carries all the way through 2025, Wolf.

BLITZER: Our Annie Grayer up on Capitol Hill, thank you very, very much -- Pamela.

BROWN: And still ahead here in THE SITUATION ROOM, Wolf: Embattled Congressman Max Miller says he is not going anywhere and welcomes a new congressional investigation into him. We will get reaction from one of the first lawmakers to call for the probe.

BLITZER: And, later: Where's my refund? Corporate America is getting them after President Trump's sweeping tariffs were thrown out. But what about the Americans who paid higher prices?

That story and more just ahead right here in THE SITUATION ROOM.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:17:34]

BROWN: Happening now: Ohio Republican Congressman Max Miller is defying pressure from fellow lawmakers to end his reelection campaign, despite a looming deadline. Miller faces allegations of domestic abuse from multiple women, including his ex-wife, and he denies their claims.

The House Ethics Committee is now investigating, and Miller says he welcomes a probe to clear his name because he has -- quote -- "nothing to hide."

Joining us now is Democratic Congressman Sam Liccardo of California.

Hi, Congressman. Nice to have you back on the show.

So, you were maybe the first member of Congress to publicly call for an ethics investigation into Miller. Now that it's happening, what's going through your mind?

REP. SAM LICCARDO (D-CA): Well, it's good that we have an investigation.

And thank you, Pamela. It's good to be with you. But we need an investigation to work. And the problem we have seen too

often and the reason why Congress has been a safe haven for too many abusers, is these investigations take far too long. Cory Mills is still in Congress a year-and-a-half after a criminal investigation (AUDIO GAP) abuse.

And we need real reform that's going to ensure that members of Congress are actually held accountable. Look, I don't want to get ahead of the investigation. Certainly, there's a credible allegation of things that should horrify every American.

And I certainly acknowledge as a former criminal prosecutor that if three separate women at different times of Max Miller's life made false allegations about physical abuse, then Max Miller would have to be the unluckiest human being on the planet.

But, nonetheless, let's have the investigation. But we should also be calling for Max Miller to resign to save, if for no other reason, his own family from all this.

BROWN: I'm curious what you think about what House Speaker Mike Johnson has said. And he said in a recent interview why he's not urging Congressman Miller to end his reelection bid, saying: "We have to allow this process to play out, and we don't take disciplinary action against members for allegations."

Do you think that's a fair point?

LICCARDO: I think it's cowardly. I think Speaker Johnson needs to stand up as an individual.

Yes, we have an official process, and certainly that investigation process should proceed, and no official action should be taken until the investigation is done. But we know that Speaker Johnson has stalled out on these investigations.

And Cory Mills, the reason why he's still in Congress voting is because Speaker Johnson needs his vote. We still don't have a conclusion to that investigation. So, we know what's going on here.

[11:20:08]

Speaker Johnson should hold his people accountable in the same way, as Democrats, we held Graham Platner and Eric Swalwell. Many of us called for them to resign and step down when these allegations came out. Speaker Johnson should be doing the same.

BROWN: And I should note, we know of an ethics investigation that I reported along with my colleague Ali Gordon of Representative Jimmy Gomez, who's a Democrat, who is being investigated by the Ethics Committee. So you support it basically on both sides of the aisle is what you're saying.

LICCARDO: Yes, absolutely.

And, yes, we need reforms in this process. It's taken too long for these investigations to start. We need to be giving subpoena authority to the Office of Congressional Ethics so they can get investigations under way quickly. Many of these allegations, Max Miller's case, have been around for years.

And these investigations obviously are being stalled by leadership that wants to keep people in their seat so they can have their vote.

BROWN: So you think it's just raw politics.

LICCARDO: Absolutely.

And if we want a real investigatory process, we would have real accountability. We'd have a shot clock on these investigations. We'd have publication of the results. (AUDIO GAP)

BROWN: Oh.

LICCARDO: ... investigations even after people resign.

BROWN: We're having a little issue with your signal. Hopefully, it stays strong now.

But I want to play some of what Congressman Miller and President Trump said about all of this. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MAX MILLER (R-OH): And people have asked me, what are you going to do? Are you going to drop out of this race? Are you going to resign? Are you going to get out before the deadline? And my answer to you, Jake, is no.

And I can tell you why. In 2016, when President Donald J. Trump faced the most extreme allegations in the world that hit him day after day after day, and people in the media, very much like yourself and others, said that he would have no shot at winning, that he should not be the president of the United States, but guess what?

He stayed in and he was resilient.

QUESTION: Can you comment on Representative Miller?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hope he's able to work it out. I feel badly for him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: What is your response, Congressman?

LICCARDO: Well, it's remarkable that he clings to Donald Trump as (AUDIO GAP) was found liable for sexual assault by a jury and indicted by four separate grand juries.

So, look, we understand the tactic here. Look, Max Miller's in trouble.

BROWN: But voters put him in office.

LICCARDO: This investigation should proceed.

BROWN: I mean, voters put President Trump back in office. I mean, that was his point, that he was able to weather that storm and get back in office.

LICCARDO: Yes. Yes, absolutely.

Look, we understand politics is politics, but, as members of Congress, we should be holding ourselves to higher standards than simply saying, well, if I can get away with it and the voters keep me in office, all must be well.

BROWN: So, before you go, Congressman, this week's primary elections have resulted in several progressive challengers, as you well know, some even backed by the Democratic Socialists of America, defeating their more moderate Democratic rivals.

As someone who positions themselves as a bipartisan pragmatist, does that worry you?

LICCARDO: We're a big tent. And I may not agree with lots of opinions from some folks who are in DSA, but we're going to need everybody on board in order to defeat Donald Trump.

And I think it's important that we all stand united around some basic issues, for example, the fact that this administration, this Congress needs to do something to reduce the extraordinary cost burden on millions of families. And there are things we can do together and we should all agree on.

BROWN: So I keep hearing that from more moderate Democrats: We're a big tent.

But just to drill down a little bit, do you think viewpoints from the DSA candidates like getting rid of ICE, the Senate, and defunding the Pentagon belong in the Democratic Party?

LICCARDO: Well, I don't agree with any of those views. But I'm not the police for the Democratic Party.

I think the voters will decide whether or not those candidates appropriately represent them and their district based on the voters' ideologies, and that's appropriate.

Every district is different. I think what's important is, in Washington, D.C., when we're moving forward legislation, we're not moving forward the views of the extreme, but in fact the views of the overwhelming majority of Americans who are (AUDIO GAP) on the football field.

BROWN: All right, Congressman Sam Liccardo, thanks so much for coming on the show.

LICCARDO: Great to be with you, Pamela. Thanks. BROWN: Wolf.

BLITZER: And still ahead: Washington, D.C., has a new look these days, with several major construction projects under way. CNN's Tom Foreman will run through some of the president's efforts to try to remake our nation's capital.

That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:29:12]

BLITZER: Happening now: a helipad on hold.

Crews have been working since June to build a new helicopter pad over at the White House. The president says it will be made from carved granite. But, in recent days, we have seen part of that new construction work taken apart. It's unclear why, and the White House isn't giving details.

The helipad is the latest of President Trump's D.C. building projects to come under fire from historians and preservation groups.

CNN's Tom Foreman is keeping a running list of them.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: So you say you want to grab one last vacation to Washington, D.C., before the summer ends. Well, right now, you better remember that the C stands for construction. Let's take a little running tour of the obstacle course.

Here's one of the first things you're going to see. These are grandstands being built for an IndyCar race downtown.

(END VIDEOTAPE)