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The Source with Kaitlan Collins
Trump Flying To Davos Amid His New Threats To Europe; DHS: Arrests Related To MN Church Protest Coming Soon; Trump Touts Year 1 Accomplishments In Marathon Briefing. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired January 20, 2026 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WILL RIPLEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (on camera): To realize his dreams of worldclass North Korean movies, Kim Jong-il used a familiar tactic in his day that sounds like a Hollywood plot itself. He kidnapped a South Korean movie star, and her director ex-husband, and it happened right here in Hong Kong.
RIPLEY (voice-over): The year was 1978. North Korean agents abducted Choi Eun-hee and Shin Sang-ok, taking both to Pyongyang, forcing them to make 17 films for Kim Jong-il.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, ANDERSON COOPER 360: That was Will Ripley, reporting.
The news continues. "THE SOURCE" starts now.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: I'm boarding Air Force One to travel with President Trump, as he heads to Davos, Switzerland, where there is a growing storm of tension with European leaders there.
I'll see you, tomorrow night, live on the ground in Switzerland. You're in the hands of Kasie Hunt tonight. And this is THE SOURCE.
KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST, THE SOURCE WITH KAITLAN COLLINS: All right. Travel safe, Kaitlan.
I'm Kasie Hunt. Thanks to all of you for joining us.
As President Trump sets off for the Swiss Alps. Leaders from across the political spectrum say he's actively threatening the economic and military alliances that have served as the underpinning of the global world order for decades.
And just before he took off, well, the President has been on a tear.
It started with the memes, one in which he, along with the Secretary of State and the Vice President, they plant an American flag in Greenland. He also posted real screenshots of actual text messages from other world leaders. French President Emmanuel Macron texting Trump, quote, "I do not understand what you are doing on Greenland."
And the NATO Secretary General wrote this, quote, "I am committed to finding a way forward on Greenland."
Confusion only increased, with the President adding the threat of a trade war with Europe to his threats of military force.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: What happens to the tariff threat to Greenland if the Supreme Court comes out and rules against you on the tariffs? And--
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Well I'll have to use something else.
REPORTER: How far are you willing to go to acquire Greenland?
TRUMP: You'll find out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: You'll find out.
It's talk like that that has Denmark, a founding member of the NATO alliance, preparing for potential conflict with the United States. Even as President Trump insists that America's European allies and Greenlanders themselves should love what he's doing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I think something is going to happen that's going to be very good for everybody. Nobody has done more for NATO than I have, as I said before, in every way.
REPORTER: What gives the U.S. the right to take away that self- determination?
TRUMP: I haven't spoken to them. When I speak to them, I'm sure they'll be thrilled.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Sure they'll be thrilled? Eh. It is safe to say they are not thrilled.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EMMANUEL MACRON, PRESIDENT OF FRANCE: It's as well a shift towards a world without rules, where international law is trampled underfoot and where the only law that seems to matter is that of the strongest.
MARK CARNEY, PRIME MINISTER OF CANADA: Let me be direct. We are in the midst of a rupture, not a transition. ANDERS VISTISEN, MEMBER OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT: Let me put this in words you might understand: Mr. President, (bleep) off.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Well, there you have it.
We begin tonight with no one better to talk to on a day like this. CNN Political Analyst, New York Times White House correspondent, Maggie Haberman.
Maggie, thank you so much for being with us tonight.
This was a remarkable day, even on the scale that President Trump has us all living on. He's now heading off to Davos, where he's going to face some of these world leaders who are angry, baffled, concerned, confused about what his plans are for Greenland.
Can you help us understand exactly what is driving the President when it comes to Greenland, and how far he is prepared to take it?
MAGGIE HABERMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, THE NEW YORK TIMES, AUTHOR, "CONFIDENCE MAN": I can't help you understand how far he is prepared to take it, Kasie, because I'm not sure he knows himself. And not all of his aides and advisers, and members of his administration are happy with how far he is going right now, and his rhetoric. Others are quite happy. But he leaves himself many different doors to push through.
But what he wants is conquest. I mean, it's really not much more complicated. He sees it as territory that he should be able to have. He's been talking about this since his first term.
[21:05:00]
He treated it as something of a joke, frankly, in his first term, and climbed down from it. But there was effort put into looking at whether some kind of an acquisition was possible, on a strategic basis. That's very different than what he's talking about right now, which is, I want it. I should have it. I'm going to tariff countries that don't support this or that threaten to push back. And the sentiment changes day to day.
What he is betting, Kasie, right now, on his way to Davos, is that some of these world leaders are not going to be as confrontational with him directly, as they were in their speeches. Frankly, just as he often is not as confrontational with people directly.
But I think that the Canadian Prime Minister's words were, I think that the most significant today, which were, There is a new world order, and we have to accept it.
Trump has made no bones about not really caring for NATO over the past 10-plus years. So, it really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.
HUNT: Maggie, you say that there are some people inside the administration that are happy with what he's doing, and others who are not. Can you describe those factions a little bit more?
HABERMAN: Everybody is not rowing in the same direction on this. Most people believe that, yes, they would like to have -- that he wants Greenland. He's the president. He was elected. Not everybody agrees with exactly how he is going about this, and are concerned about how willing he is to push the envelope.
But again, this is a very different administration, Cabinet, West Wing, than we saw in term one, when there were these massive, big factional fights.
It keeps getting described that way internally now, and really that's not quite what it is. It's just that there are some disagreements, but everybody is generally going to do what the President wants.
What I do keep hearing is, This must be Stephen Miller's idea, or This must be this person's idea, or this might -- this is Donald Trump. This is what he wants. And his administration is going to row in the direction he wants. They're just not always going to do it, simultaneously, as happily as others might be. But it's not the same as term one where you really did have factions. It was just not at all the same.
HUNT: Maggie, one thing we've heard some conversation about, in the last day or so, is this old treaty from the Truman era that would allow America to put more troops, expand those military bases that we gave up. Does the President see that as a potential off-ramp? Or is he really just totally uninterested in getting off this highway?
HABERMAN: So, this as an off-ramp has actually been under discussion for several weeks, Kasie. This has come up a lot among national security officials and other advisers within the White House.
I don't know how much of it is an off-ramp or a more realistic version. I mean, again, with Trump, you never quite know whether he is doing a maximalist version and he's going to do some kind of a climbdown, or whether he is just going to keep going. But yes, it is true that that treaty is one option that people are looking at.
It is worth remembering, when people keep asking him, Are you going to invade Greenland, or, Are you going to use a military option? The U.S. has a military -- to your point, has a military base there. So, they could expand the troop presence. But it's a little different than, say, going to Venezuela.
HUNT: Maggie, at this point, you mentioned the Canadian Prime Minister. And he mentioned in his speech that we can't be nostalgic, right? That was the word he used. There's no room for nostalgia.
HABERMAN: Right.
HUNT: Some people speculated that perhaps his concern is that Canada may be the next thing that the President is looking at. He obviously has joked or talked about, depending on who you ask, that Canada be the 51st state. Is that part of what's going on here? Is this bigger than just Greenland? HABERMAN: I think that in terms of President Trump's mind, look, I mean, I think President Trump is, again, as we said before, looking at what he sees as acquisitions, there was serious talk about somehow trying to acquire Canada, earlier this year, within his government. I mean, I'm using, serious, a little bit loosely. Certainly not the way it was about Greenland.
But these things, as you know Kasie, very well, start out as trolls with President Trump, and then, they become very real pretty quickly. Whether that is what this falls into or not, in terms of Carney's mind, I think that he is being pragmatic, and I think that he is sort of pushing away from the U.S. He does have other places that he could draw closer to.
But what he is trying to say is, We cannot rely on the idea that if we go along -- and he is not trying to say it -- he did say it, If we go along with what President Trump wants, all of us, not just Canada, eventually he's still just going to keep taking and taking, and that is what he has shown with the tariff threats that come on and come off, and come on and come off. With a trade deal with the EU that he is then willing to blow up, there's just no throughline, which I think was his point.
But yes, is there concern about what Trump could do to Canada? It's always part of it. I think it's also just that sort of being neighborly and being encompassed by the United States is just not a guarantee anymore.
HUNT: Really remarkable state of affairs.
Maggie Haberman, thank you so much for starting us off tonight. Really appreciate it.
HABERMAN: Thanks, Kasie.
HUNT: Of course.
[21:10:00]
I want to bring in now a member of the House Foreign Affairs and Armed Services Committee. Democratic congresswoman, Sara Jacobs of California. She actually just traveled with a delegation to Denmark.
And Congresswoman, that's where I want to start tonight. Can you take us to Denmark, and help us understand. I mean, the Danes have fought alongside Americans, in Iraq and Afghanistan, and other conflicts and situations. What was it like to talk to them in this moment?
REP. SARA JACOBS (D-CA): Yes, I'll be honest, there was real bafflement and anger.
A lot of what the Danes told us and the Greenlanders was, Tell us what you want. We want you to invest more in Arctic security. You want more bases? Great. Let's do it. You want more -- you know, you want to do economic development together? Great. Let's do it. Tell us what you want. We are prepared to give that to you, even without these threats and coercion.
And while we were there was one of the biggest protests in Danish history against the United States, which seems kind of crazy. There's polling that shows that Danes used to feel that at 80 percent level, you know, 80 percent of Danes felt like America was their best partner. And now that number is in single digits.
And we heard from Greenlanders that their kids are going to sleep terrified every night. They can't sleep. They're waking up in the middle of the night, sure that they're being invaded by the United States. I mean, they have -- this is very real for the people there, and it feels very, very existential.
HUNT: So, you were accompanied on the delegation, on the trip, by Senator Thom Tillis. He's, of course, a Republican senator who's retiring.
I want to play a little bit about what he had to say about what might happen in Congress if something were to happen, like an invasion of Greenland. Let's watch. We'll talk about it on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BECKY QUICK, "SQUAWK BOX" CO-ANCHOR, CNBC: If something were to happen there, that this would be something that other Republican senators would move it impeach him on. Are you in that camp?
SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): Well, I'm not going to go to impeachment, because I would go to the process of implementing -- let's say it was a kinetic action, or some sort of increase in military presence, that I'd immediately go for a War Powers Resolution. I think that we could easily get veto-proof majorities. That's why I'm trying to advise the President.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Congresswoman, do you think that would be the appropriate response in Congress? Do you think that impeachment should be on the table if he were to invade Greenland?
JACOBS: Look, I think that we would, in fact, have a veto-proof majority for a War Powers Resolution if he were to invade Greenland. I think all options should be on the table, including impeachment at that point. And we need to be doing everything we can, so that we don't get to that point. Because once we've gotten there, we've crossed the Rubicon, and it's very hard to come back.
And so, what I'm talking to with other House Democrats, with our colleagues across the aisle, is what we can do right now. And I think we have some real options, right? We can use the appropriations process to say that no funding can be used for this.
We have War Powers. I would argue we need to pass something before he invades, not after, because I think it's important that we show, strongly from Congress, that this is not something that he has authorization to do. And we have other methods at our disposal to try and stop this, and I think we should be using all of them.
HUNT: Congresswoman, do you think that the harm that has been done to the NATO alliance, up to this point, has made it irreparable? I mean, is it possible to come back to a place, where the United States is at the center of this alliance and is trusted by NATO allies?
JACOBS: I'll be honest. The damage that's been done is already quite large. And even if somehow there's a resolution that comes very soon, this damage has already been done, and I think it will take quite a lot to rebuild trust in the United States as a leader.
And I don't think we've quite reached the point of no return where it's irreparable. I think that if we're able to get to a resolution, if we reinvest in NATO and in our European partners, I do think there's a way to get through this.
But this damage is very real. People are feeling it very presently right now, and it will take a lot to rebuild the trust of our allies.
HUNT: All right. Congresswoman Sara Jacobs, thank you very much for your time tonight. Really appreciate it.
JACOBS: Thanks for having me.
HUNT: All right. Coming up next.
As the President heads overseas, how world leaders are digesting his latest threats to take Greenland.
Plus, the Justice Department ramps up its investigation into state and local leaders there, while the President had this to say about the woman killed by an ICE agent.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It's a tragedy. It's a horrible thing.
Her parents, and her father in particular, is like -- I hope he still is, but I don't know -- was a tremendous Trump fan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:15:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: How far are you willing to go to acquire Greenland?
TRUMP: You'll find out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: That was President Trump today, before leaving for Davos. There, he will meet face-to-face with European leaders who are absolutely stunned by his threats to take over Greenland.
My source tonight is Jeppe Kofod, the former Foreign Minister of Denmark.
Sir, thanks very much for being with us this evening.
The president, President Trump, today, gave a lengthy news conference, and he said that taking Greenland by force cannot be ruled out. How do you hear that? What is your response?
[21:20:00]
JEPPE KOFOD, FORMER FOREIGN MINISTER OF DENMARK: Well, of course, it's like utterly unacceptable statement by the President, because using force against another NATO country, a close ally to United States, Denmark, the Kingdom of Denmark, including Greenland and Denmark, will be unprecedented, and will de facto lead to dismantling of the NATO alliance. And it will be, I would say, self-damaging to the national security interest of the United States, so.
So, I hope it's a threat without substance, and I really also think that President Trump should look at what is the key interest of United States. And it is to have a strong transatlantic alliance working together on Arctic security, including in Greenland, deterring any adversary in that region, protecting U.S. national interests by protecting U.S. mainland.
And if U.S. wants, they are, as you know, free to deploy much more military assets in Greenland. There's been a defense treaty since 1951, allowing U.S. to be in Greenland with military assets, bases, and they can do that.
So, I hope that it's an empty threat. But we have to take it very seriously until he steps down from that threat.
HUNT: Have you seen his actions, recently, on the world stage, as underscoring the need to take him seriously? Does, for example, what the President did in Venezuela make you think it's more likely he'll follow through and take Greenland?
KOFOD: Well, I think that it's not comparable in the sense that you -- I mean, Venezuela and operation there was another type of operation, law enforcement operation. I don't want to discuss that.
But Greenland, the Kingdom of Denmark, is an ally to the United States, is a democratic country. We have been in this same alliance since this was founded. We're actually, both United States and Denmark, part of the founding fathers of the NATO alliance. It has protected our security. We have worked together. Also, when U.S. was attacked from terrorists, we stand side by side by with the Americans in Afghanistan, in Iraq, and other places around the world.
So, it will be something unheard of, if United States will take territory from another NATO state by force. So, I don't think it will happen. But I think the threaten itself is, of course, totally unacceptable, and you see all Europeans reacting very strongly against that.
But at the same time, we are all recognizing, like President Trump, that there is a security concern in the Arctic. I mean, the world is changing. The Arctic is changing. And we should deploy much more military assets up there. That's what Denmark has decided over the last years. And now, we also see NATO operations in the High North, which is very, very good, I think.
But solving that problem, we do together better than, of course, U.S. taking somebody's land. Because Greenland belongs to the Greenlandic people and nation, and to nobody else.
HUNT: The President heading to Davos tonight, where world leaders, business leaders, tech leaders, political leaders are gathering. If the President is watching tonight, what would you say to him, directly?
KOFOD: Well, I would say to him that let's work together to ensure that the security concerns we share, and that the President has, and he has a point there, let's address them together.
We're doing it at the moment. I mean, we will be very happy to welcome much more American military personnel in Greenland. I mean, today there is maybe around 150, 200 in one military base, Pituffik Space Base, in Greenland. If you go back in time, there's been maybe around 10,000 U.S. military staff there at one point, and maybe 15 to 17 military bases installations in Greenland.
So, let's work together, instead of blowing our alliance up, which has served us so well, and that will be in the core national security interest of the U.S. not to blow it up. So, that appeal, I would tell the President, and I hope that he will listen and understand what is best, also for United States.
HUNT: All right. Jeppe Kofod, thank you very much for your time tonight, sir. I really appreciate you joining us.
KOFOD: Welcome. Thank you.
[21:25:00]
HUNT: All right, let's get some perspective now from Rahm Emanuel. He is former Ambassador to Japan under President Biden, and, of course, the former Chief of Staff to President Obama.
Rahm, it's great to see you. Thank you so much for being here.
RAHM EMANUEL, FORMER AMB. TO JAPAN UNDER PRES. BIDEN, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO PRES. OBAMA, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL & GLOBAL AFFAIRS COMMENTATOR: Thanks, Kasie.
HUNT: So, the Europeans have taken a variety of different tacts to try and get through to President Trump on this. A number of them know, have learned that going to him directly is really probably the best way to convince him to do something.
But this morning, we saw the President reveal some of that in public.
So Emmanuel Macron had texted him this. My friend, We are totally in line on Syria. We can do great things on Iran.
Flattery, another tactic with the President.
Then he adds, I do not understand what you are doing on Greenland. Let us try to build great things.
The President puts this out there. What do you think of how Macron is approaching this, how European leaders are approaching this broadly. And would you -- would you put out your text -- private text messages--
EMANUEL: Not unless he's subpoenaed.
HUNT: --with the Europeans?
EMANUEL: No. No.
Well, first of all, we laugh at it, but there's going to be no trust here. He's destroying whatever thread of trust you have. And trust me, we all trade on that, all of us, if I trust we're going to do something. He's destroying that. And it's going to come back to boomerang against the President.
And I advise that other presidents all give to each other, and I can say this as a former mayor, former member of Congress, Ambassador, your word is everything. And that's not true for President Trump, and he just made another dent in a very important asset, which is the trust to the president, or the trust to the country. And that's another piece of the collateral damage that's going to happen in Greenland. America is going to be isolated here, and our word will not be counted.
Now, I keep getting back to this, and I would just speak in the language of President Trump. Why do you want to pay full price for what you can get for free? There is nothing Denmark and Europe won't give, pay for. You want 12,000 troops, which you used to have in the United States here? We'll help build the bases, we'll help refurbish the runways. Why do you want to try to buy something with American money that you can get for free? That's number one. And we're ready to do it.
Number two. They're talking about destroy -- this will destroy NATO. Nothing would make him happier. He's getting a twofer there. And in the end of the day, there's geostrategic interest. This is ego- strategic interest. He told The New York Times, This is about how I feel psychologically.
Well, the American people today, with dropping stock market, rising interest rates, we're already paying for his psychological interests. People are going to pay more for their mortgage. People are losing their life savings and their retirement account in the stock market because of his ego.
And so, to me, that's the way I would approach this, both in the sense of the cost and the power.
I do think that probably the most important thing that was said today was by Prime Minister Carney of Canada. That said, we are entering a new world. One is going to be based on power, the other one is going to be based on trust and alliance.
I used to have a strategy with the White House. We were going to isolate the isolator. That's what we were going to do to China. We are now isolating ourselves, and we're going to be worst off for it. Canada just got a deal on our back -- in our front yard with China. The United States is the party out of there. Japan and Korea got together. I helped build with the President, for President Biden, the trilateral, the United States, Japan, Korea. Worst day in China's life. We're the party out of that. The President's isolating America, making it weaker.
HUNT: I want to play for you Gavin Newsom, who likely 2028 presidential candidate, burnishing his foreign policy credentials in Davos. He criticized European leaders for the way that they've been handling some of this. Let's watch what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D-CA): I can't take this complicity. People rolling over. I should've brought a bunch of kneepads for all the world leaders. I mean, handing out crowns and handing -- I mean, this is pathetic. Nobel prizes that are being given away. I mean, it's just pathetic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Is he right?
EMANUEL: Well, the one thing you have to understand about the President is he punches down, kisses up. He doesn't treat Putin and Xi like this. If, anyway, he acts weaker seeking their favor. But he does punch down.
I don't think -- given what Europe is facing. They're facing an economic challenge from China. They're facing a political and strategic challenge from the United States. They got Russia fighting a war. I don't think, A, Europe is engaged in the right argument. But they weren't the one that gave the Nobel Peace Prize away. It was a Venezuelan leader. So, in many ways, the moment in time calls for supporting our European allies, finding a common argument and helping there.
Let me take a step back of where we really are. And not in this analysis, but I think what Prime Minister Carney was getting, which I think is really important, the United States' today larger export is our political dysfunction. That's what you're seeing.
[21:30:00]
China's largest export is its economic dysfunction in the world. China has a massive problem at home, and they're exporting it, all that problem, to the rest of the world by overproducing and selling at a discount, destroying your local economy.
We, through our political dysfunction, is now exporting our political dysfunction, attacking Greenland, attacking allies in Europe, doing things where we lose our trust, lose our alliances.
Those are the two most disconcerting and creating the most disorder in the world is a disorder at home, economically for China, and politically for the United States, and we've left it at the front door of the rest of the world.
HUNT: All right. Ambassador Rahm Emanuel, thank you very much for being with us tonight.
EMANUEL: Thank you.
HUNT: It's great to spend some time with you.
Coming up next here. How the Justice Department escalated prosecutions in Minnesota, including issuing subpoenas to five top officials in the state. We'll break down the new reporting with my legal source, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:35:00]
HUNT: New tonight. Homeland Security Secretary, Kristi Noem, has a warning for protesters who interrupted a church service in Saint Paul.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KRISTI NOEM, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: There's going to be arrests in the next several hours, Greta. There will be arrests tied to that, and people will be brought to justice for how they violated the law in that situation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: On Sunday, dozens of protesters went into Cities Church, protesting a pastor there who also appears to be a top ICE official in the Twin Cities. Hours later, the DOJ's Civil Rights Division launched an investigation.
Our source tonight, CNN's Senior Legal Analyst, Elie Honig.
Hi, Elie, wonderful to see you.
Is there a case here?
ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST, FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NY: There is, Kasie. There is a statute called the FACE Act, which makes it a federal crime to intentionally interfere with somebody else's practice of their religion.
Now it's important to note, this is a misdemeanor for first-time offenders. So, that means the maximum penalty here would be a year. It means the people wouldn't necessarily be entitled to a jury trial. So, it's a fairly limited crime.
But yes, if you look at the face of the law, the conduct that we see on this video does seem to meet the statutory elements.
Now, there's a separate question that prosecutors ought to ask, which is, is this a good idea? Is this worth it to charge? But it seems quite clear, if you look at what Secretary Noem says there, and if you look at the response of DOJ, that they do intend to press forward. And yes, I think the actions do match the law here.
HUNT: Really interesting. All right. We're going to continue to follow that.
But the other story I wanted to dig into with you are these subpoenas that the DOJ has sent to five local officials in Minnesota, including the Governor, including the Mayor of Minneapolis. Do you -- how would you frame the significance of them deciding to do this. It seems relatively unprecedented. But is there a really strong, solid reason? Are they on solid ground?
HONIG: Well, it's a big deal, and it's a precipitous step if you're going to issue subpoenas to elected officials. I just looked at some of those subpoenas. They're public now. And they tell us a lot. They tell us, first of all, DOJ is in fact, investigating these Democratic officials.
And the thrust of these subpoenas, if you look at the attachment, where it says, Here's the documents we want? It seems to be focused on what we would ordinarily call sanctuary city or sanctuary state policies. The subpoenas basically say, Give us your policies about how you're telling your state and local cops to deal with the Feds.
But this is really important, Kasie. It is not a crime, it is not obstruction, to refuse to cooperate. So in order to make this case, prosecutors are going to have to show some affirmative act of obstruction. And thus far, for all the rhetoric we've heard from Pam Bondi, and Todd Blanche, and Kristi Noem, I've not seen them point to something that crosses that line. So, there are perfectly valid political and policy criticisms of sanctuary city policies, but I've not seen anything in them that's remotely criminal.
HUNT: Fair enough.
And Elie, before I let you go, we're just -- we're doing Round robin tonight on this, because there's more legal news out of the DOJ, and that's the Attorney General, Pam Bondi has said that Lindsey Halligan, who is the Acting U.S. Attorney in the Eastern District of Virginia, overseeing some of those really controversial cases, Jim Comey, Letitia James, will not continue in that role.
But Bondi said -- issued this statement. She says this, quote, "The circumstances that led to this outcome are deeply misguided. We are living in a time when a democratically elected President's ability to staff key law enforcement positions faces serious obstacles. The Department of Justice will continue to seek review of decisions like this that hinder our ability to keep the American people safe." What do you make of this?
HONIG: Well, they can continue to challenge these rulings and appeal these rulings. But thus far, every court to have considered the issue of somebody appointed in the way Lindsey Halligan was, and Alina Habba was, and other U.S. attorneys around the country, has ruled that it was unconstitutional.
So, it's actually the right move that DOJ is finally pulling back on this, because for several months, Kasie, after the ruling came down, that Lindsey Halligan was not the U.S. Attorney, that office continued to sign its documents with Lindsey Halligan's name as the U.S. attorney's. In fact, several judges rejected that. Several judges excoriated prosecutors for doing that.
[21:40:00]
So, DOJ has accepted the reality now, and the reality is that Lindsey Halligan was not constitutionally-appointed, nor were the other U.S. attorneys. They can appeal if they want. But as of this moment, they're not constitutional U.S. attorneys.
HUNT: All right. Fair enough. Elie Honig, thank you very much. Really great to see you.
HONIG: Thanks, Kasie.
HUNT: I want to bring in my political sources tonight.
Van Jones, former Obama administration official.
And Bill Stepien, former White House Political Director under President Trump.
Welcome to both of you. Thank you so much for being here.
I want to turn back to Minnesota. And of course, Van, let me go to you first.
Because, the President today obviously defended the actions of ICE in Minnesota. There was a press conference with immigration officials, where they said that everything that they are doing there is moral and ethical.
I'm curious if you agree with that assessment.
VAN JONES, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, FORMER OBAMA ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL: You know, I don't.
And I think that there are two different Americas here.
If you're just listening to conservative news sources, if you're just -- your social media beat is mostly right-leaning, you're going to think, Hey, what are these people protesting about? You just have good ICE officers out there trying to get bad guys out of America. But if you actually talk to the people on the ground, what's happening is really shocking. I mean, you're hearing about American citizens being thrown to the ground, dragged out of their houses, in their underwear, in sub-freezing temperatures. Really stuff that would be shocking in a banana republic or a third-world country, happening every day. Kids afraid to go to school. Restaurants shut down. Because even U.S. citizens are not safe. And American Indians are now being disappeared into a system. Where are you going to deport an American Indian to?
So, it seems like total lawlessness on the streets there. I think Republicans and Democrats should listen more closely to the people who are crying out for attention.
Houses of worship? Off limits. Do not go in anyone's house of worship. That's off limits.
But there's a hue and a cry here that I think Republicans and Democrats should take very seriously.
HUNT: So Van, you mentioned houses of worship.
And actually, Bill, I want to ask you about this. We showed a little bit of what happened at that church earlier. There were protesters that went in to the church. Kristi Noem says that they will be prosecuted. I mean, what impact do pictures and images and events like this have on the debate?
BILL STEPIEN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE POLITICAL DIRECTOR UNDER PRES. TRUMP, TRUMP 2020 CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Well, I do think the White House can always do -- every White House, can do a better job with public relations. And public relations exists in every facet, including law enforcement.
I was really pleased, two weekends ago, to see the White House begin to release the names and the faces and the records and the convictions, and how long these illegal immigrants, these animals, truly have been in our country, for rape and other just heinous crimes. So, I do think the White House needs to talk more about how the states are state -- the streets are safer. Because, they are.
And there's PR involved with this. We know there are lots of images and pictures and things being recorded on phones. But I think the White House needs to do a better job, talking about the PR associated with this, because the streets are safer.
JONES: Well, I do see it somewhat differently, brother. Because, the people who are American citizens, who are lawful residents here, who are being mistreated the way they are, I don't think they feel much safer.
I think also, when call people, Animals, I know you're kind of trying to underscore something for the violent criminals that everybody wants out of here. That can send a signal that it's, you know, kind of all bets are off against a whole community. And I think that's what's happening, is that the rhetoric has gotten so ramped up, that everybody, you know, that they're going after is the most hardened cartel member imaginable, so anything you do to anybody is OK. I think that's very dangerous in a democracy.
HUNT: All right. Van and Bill, you're going to stick around. We've got a lot more to discuss after the break.
Coming up next, President Trump holds a marathon briefing at the White House, bringing a binder full of his accomplishments to mark one year in office.
[21:45:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: So, these are accomplishments. We have a lot of accomplishments. And as you know, this is the anniversary, first anniversary, January, 20th, and it's been an amazing period of time.
Page after page after page, individual things. I could stand here and read it for a week, and we wouldn't be finished.
Look at this. These are all -- each line is something that we did. Nobody did that before. And it's big stuff too. Look, we have the hottest country in the world.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: President Trump, marking the start of the second year of his second term, touting that laundry list of victories before later going on to trash his own public relations team, suggesting that they're not doing a good job getting his accomplishments across to the American people.
The President talked, or, as he likes to call it, the weave, he weaved for about an hour and 20 minutes, before he finally took reporters' questions.
Our political sources are back with me.
Van Jones, this was quite a day for the President of the United States. Quite a press conference. I was struck honestly by how it felt a little different than some of the times he did this in his first term, the energy level, the things that he talked about. What stood out to you today?
[21:50:00]
JONES: Well, I just think maybe the disconnection between his sense of pride and what he's done, and I think the sense of -- I think shame and embarrassment that a lot of Americans feel watching what's happening in Minnesota, watching the United States tear up our alliances, threaten Greenland. You have people who -- people in Greenland, they had blood spilled, trying to help us after 9/11. And now, they're afraid of us. So, there's this big disconnection. We have two different countries. There are people who are very, very proud of all the stuff that Donald Trump did. But I think for a lot of people who are watching it, it's just, I don't think there's not even a level -- there's not words to describe the grief that people feel for the America that we used to have, that was a country that was respected and followed our own laws.
HUNT: Bill Stepien, do you see it that way?
STEPIEN: I'm struck by the fact that he was standing at the podium. You said he was -- he talked for an hour and 20 minutes, and then took questions, and then you compared his performance today to the first term.
I compare it to who was in office just before him. I mean, you had a president in Biden who was in bubble wrap, protected from the press, protected from the media, protected from the public.
This is accessibility. You may not like what you're hearing. But you have someone who's open, who's communicating, and not in bubble wrap. And I think that's a big departure from the past.
HUNT: One of the things, of course, the President did say is that they're not doing a good enough job, messaging. Which, when you're a political reporter, like me, that often happens when the public is not taking in what you're saying.
But the challenge here, of course, the big picture for Americans is affordability, right? They don't feel like they can afford their groceries. The President's numbers on the economy are not -- they were the one thing that in the first term really held, even when he was unpopular on other things. That's not the case anymore.
And his Treasury Secretary was in Davos, OK, where all these very wealthy people are meeting. And he talked about the housing -- the administration's housing policy. Of course, the cost of housing, a huge drain on American budgets.
I want to play what the Treasury Secretary said, and we'll talk about it on this side. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: We're going to give guidance at some point to see what is a mom and pop that someone -- maybe your parents, for their retirement, have bought five, 10, 12 homes. So, we don't want to push the mom and pops out. We just want to push everyone else out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Bill Stepien, is this not out of touch? I mean, most people are struggling to buy their first home. Only 4.6 percent of U.S. homes are second homes, let alone 5, 10, 12 homes.
STEPIEN: Well, look, there's a big problem in the country when the average age of first-time -- for first-time home buyers is 40. This is -- this is good policy, though. And I think whether this was a guy with too many homes, or more homes than me, or misspeak, it was -- this is the right policy, right? Making sure people have the chance and ability to buy homes and not Wall Street firms. I'm not letting a misquote or a misspeak get in the way of really what's good policy, and that's what this was talked about today.
HUNT: Van, last word.
JONES: Look, I agree that the Trump administration is doing a good job pushing back on some of these big corporations that buy up people's neighborhoods. That's a good thing.
But they are out of touch. And it's very hard to be so out of touch, you think the average person has 10 extra houses. We don't, sir. We don't.
HUNT: Van Jones. Bill Stepien. Thank you both very much for being with us tonight. Really appreciate the perspective from both of you.
Coming up next here. A big announcement from Vice President, JD Vance, and his growing family.
[21:55:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HUNT: Tonight, a joyous White House first for the nation's second family. Second lady, Usha Vance, has announced she's pregnant with her fourth child.
In a joint statement, with Vice President, JD Vance, the second couple shared, they're having a boy, writing, Usha and the baby are doing well, and we are all looking forward to welcoming him in late July.
This will mark the first time a sitting second lady has had a baby while in office.
Our congrats to the Vance family.
Thanks for joining us here on THE SOURCE.
Please do tune in, catch me tomorrow, every weekday in "THE ARENA," 04:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.
But don't go anywhere. "CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP" starts now.
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN HOST, CNN NEWSNIGHT WITH ABBY PHILLIP: Tonight.
The Western alliance on the brink. Donald Trump heads to Davos to face the allies he's threatening to divorce, and threatening to invade.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: How far are you willing to go to acquire Greenland?
TRUMP: You'll find out.
VISTISEN: Mr. President, (bleep) off.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Plus, police in Minneapolis sound the alarm on ICE in their streets who are now stopping cops.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARK BRULEY, POLICE CHIEF, BROOKLYN PARK POLICE: They're being stopped in traffic stops, or on the street, with no cause.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Also, the Feds subpoena Minnesota Democrats, as liberals hit their limit.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR ZOHRAN MAMDANI, (D) NEW YORK CITY, NEW YORK STATE: I am in support of abolishing ICE.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[22:00:00]
PHILLIP: And breaking tonight. The administration admits in court that DOGE accessed sensitive data about Americans.
Live at the table. Cornel West. Ben Ferguson. Leigh McGowan. Kristin Davison. Max Boot. And Elliot Williams.
