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The Brief with Jim Sciutto

CNN International: Trump: "You'll Find Out" Plans for Greenland; Trump to Face NATO Leaders in Davos; Greenland's PM: Dispute with U.S. Could Threaten World Order; Deadly Catalonia Train Derailment Just Days After Fatal Train Collision in Southern Spain; Trump Slams E.U. Leaders Ahead of Davos Trip; DOJ Subpoenas at Least Five Minnesota Officials; Massive Snowdrifts Affect Russia's Fast East. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired January 20, 2026 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR, "THE BRIEF": Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Jim Sciutto in New York, and

you're watching "The Brief."

Just ahead this hour, hours before his trip to Europe, President Trump is asked how far he will go to obtain Greenland. His answer, you'll find out.

U.S. Justice Department subpoenas at least five officials in Minnesota. And Russia's Far East is buried under its heaviest snowfall in decades as a

winter blast sweeps across Asia.

Well, President Trump is set to depart Washington in the next few hours for Davos, Switzerland, to attend the World Economic Forum there at this year's

gathering of the global elite. The U.S. president's ambition to take over Greenland seems to be overshadowing just about everything else.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: I think something's going to happen that's going to be very good for everybody. I think that we will work something

out where NATO is going to be very happy and where we're going to be very happy. But we need it for security purposes. We need it for national

security and even world security. It's very important.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: America's allies are standing up. French President Emmanuel Macron gave this not-so-veiled critique of Trump's entire foreign policy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH PRESIDENT: It's as well a shift towards a world without rules, where international law is trampled underfoot and where the

only law that seems to matter is that of the strongest, and imperial ambitions are resurfacing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: We should note the French president has an eye infection. That explains the sunglasses. That is a sentiment echoed by the Canadian Prime

Minister Mark Carney, who also had strong words.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK CARNEY, CANADIAN PRIME MINISTER: It seems that every day we're reminded that we live in an era of great power rivalry. That the rules-

based order is fading. That the strong can do what they can, and the weak must suffer what they must.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining us now live from Davos is Richard Quest. And, Richard, I wonder, as you speak to officials there and others, Trump said, oh well I

think we'll come to some sort of agreement, everybody will be happy. That's certainly not what I'm hearing from European officials. Are you hearing any

hope for a way out of this?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE AND CNN ANCHOR, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS: Well, the hope for a way out of it comes from people like Scott

Bessent, the U.S. Treasury Secretary, who says don't retaliate. Those who retaliate usually get worse, referring to China on the last tariff. Or Gary

Cohn, the former adviser, economic adviser, who says Trump always takes a maximalist approach and then compromises somewhere way below where, exactly

where he always wanted to be.

The problem with all of that is, can you rely on it? And if you are facing a question of sovereignty, should you be playing the games of having to

trust that the other person doesn't mean what they're actually saying?

Christine Lagarde is the president of the ECB, European Central Bank, the main central bank for the Eurozone. And she put it to me like this, when

you look at the situation, yes what Carney says, what Macron says, yes, it's all following Stephen Miller's idea of power, force, strength. But if

you're looking at it from Europe's point of view, then it means you've got to do something.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTINE LAGARDE, EUROPEAN CENTRAL BANK PRESIDENT: OK. I'm going to tell you something which I hope will be proven right next year. This is a wake-

up call, a bigger one than we ever had. And I think that Europe is going to look at its strength, look at its weaknesses, do a, you know, a big SWOT

analysis and decide what do we need to do to be strong by ourselves, to be more independent, to rely on the internal trade that we do with each other,

so that we can just not ignore, but at least be prepared and have a plan B, just in case the normal relationship is not restored.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[18:05:00]

QUEST: And besides that, also, Jim, business leaders, CEOs are starting to speak out, whether it's Telefonica of Spain saying this is a reminder that

Europe needs to get its own tech champions, or Brad Smith from the U.S. on Microsoft saying we need to remember how much business is done within and

between NATO countries. Until now, Jim, the business CEOs, they've been terrified of their own shadow, not wanting to piss off one side or the

other. Today, was different. Today, they started to speak.

SCIUTTO: I imagine they were watching the markets today as well, and not just the stock markets, but more notably the bond markets where yields did

rise, not quite as much as they did on Liberation Day, which seemed to temper Trump's ambitions then. Do folks you speak there foresee a major

financial disruption from this?

QUEST: If it plays out, as Donald Trump is suggesting we can do it the hard way, then yes. Today was the worst day since October in terms of

market falls. This is a crack, arguably a fissure in the market. Remember Mark Carney, who you were talking to about a second ago, he said this isn't

a transition at the moment, it's a rupture in the transatlantic relationship.

So, if this is a rupture that falls into a massive, then yes, you are going to see business, because the level of uncertainty that has returned that

Lagarde talked about, that level of uncertainty cannot be ignored by market participants. Investors will high -- well, literally, they'll head for the

hills.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Vote with their feet and their wallets. Richard Quest, thanks so much. Well, the prime minister of Greenland is making quite clear

that he takes President Trump at his word, saying an attack on the territory could threaten the current world order.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JENS-FREDERIK NIELSEN, GREENLANDIC PRIME MINISTER (through translator): It's not likely that there will be a use of military force, but it has not

been ruled out yet. This leader from the other side has made it very clear that it's not ruled out, and therefore we must, of course, be prepared for

everything. But we must emphasize that Greenland is part of the Western alliance, NATO, and if there is further escalation, it will also have

consequences for the entire outside world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: For his part, President Trump has argued that Greenlanders would be thrilled, his words, to become part of the U.S., that despite thousands

of Greenlanders protesting over the weekend against just that possibility.

Our Nic Robertson joins us. He's still there in Greenland. Nic, are you meeting anybody there who would be thrilled to be part of the U.S.?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: No, I think what would thrill them would be two things, one step at a time. The first one would be

the details of what President Trump is actually intending to discuss in Davos, the things that he thinks is going to make NATO happy and that he

can find a landing place for this massive disruption with European allies. They'd like to see details with that. And then the thing that would make

them thrilled is that Donald Trump would drop this desire to actually own Greenland the hard way or the easy way. I think that's what would thrill

them.

You get a sense of that level of preparedness that the Greenland government, the prime minister wants to have here because the Greenland

government has asked the Danish government to send their sort of emergency. So, it's a civilian response unit, emergency responders. They go to floods.

They go to earthquakes. They've been sent here. And their mission here is, I think, very telling, their mission is to secure communications places, to

secure vital infrastructure, to install an early warning system, to provide information about crisis management.

So, the government here is following through on what the prime minister here is saying. And they're trying to get ready for a really bad

eventuality, although he says he hopes it won't happen. And that's on top of the Danish government already upping the military presence here.

So, thrilled would be an understatement of how people here would feel if President Trump completely dropped his claims and went back to his 1951

agreement, which they'd be thrilled to continue with.

[18:10:00]

U.S. can have as much base space, missile bases as it wants, can have access to resources, minerals, rare earths, as much as it wants. That's the

existing thing. That's what would thrill them.

SCIUTTO: The steps you're describing there, though, Nic, sending a Danish emergency response team, and you've heard, I spoke, for instance, to a

Danish lawmaker yesterday who at least raised the possibility of a military standoff. Are Greenland officials, is the Greenland public taking seriously

at least the possibility of a military standoff over this, of military pressure from the U.S.?

ROBERTSON: Well, a member of the opposition in the Greenland government here, in the Greenland parliament, there's 31 members in the parliament,

eight members in the main opposition party. One member of that party today said that the Greenlanders would fight back. Here's the deal, though.

Constitutionally, the Danish troops here, if their kingdom is attacked, if they come under fire in their kingdom, they are constitutionally obliged to

fire back, irrespective of who it is, U.S. troops, U.S.-NATO partners.

If their kingdom is fired upon, they have to fire back. It's a very ugly scenario, and I don't think people in their heart of hearts can yet bring

themselves to believe that could happen, but they're getting closer to that. Young people we talked to over the weekend said that they were buying

guns.

Look, we talked to a gun store owner, and they told us they're not seeing a spike in sales. But then majority of people here own weapons already for

hunting. I don't think that's quite where people are yet. But I think creeping into conversations here, something we didn't see here two weeks

ago, is a greater sense of animosity towards Americans than we were witnessing a couple of weeks ago. And that, I think, is a factor of several

things. It's the factor of President Trump's language doubling down.

It's a factor of the accumulated stress of the situation. And perhaps it's a factor of having so many journalists in town asking people questions

about how they feel about the current situation. But there's a tonal change in the way that people respond in the context of Americans now. It's not a

big thing, but it's noticeable.

SCIUTTO: And it belies this claim that you will hear from Trump and some of his advisers that Greenland somehow wants this or will come to want

this. Nic Robertson, stay warm there, if you can. Thanks for joining.

Well, a Danish member of the European Parliament had quite a blunt message for President Trump about his continuing threats to take Greenland.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERS VISTISEN, EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT MEMBER, DENMARK: Let me put this in words you might understand. Mr. President, bug off.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Strong words, indeed. Joining me now is a former Danish foreign minister, Jeppe Kofod. Thank you so much for taking the time.

JEPPE KOFOD, FORMER DANISH FOREIGN MINISTER: My pleasure.

SCIUTTO: I won't ask you to repeat that parliament member's words, but do you share the sentiment there that, in effect, Denmark should say, no, this

shall not stand?

KOFOD: Yes, I mean, Denmark has made itself very, very clear to Trump. You know, Greenland is not for sale, not for, you know, something that you can

trade with, not to conquer or take over or become American against the will of the people in Greenland.

Greenland is a nation. Greenland is a people. Greenland has a sovereign right to decide its own future. Nobody else. And that is fundamental rule

of law that we share, you know, in the Western world. And that is now being so utterly undermined by the statement of President Trump.

SCIUTTO: The E.U. president, Ursula von der Leyen, she said today that the old way of doing things is over, that a new form of European independence

is necessary now. I mean, that describes not a temporary impasse between the U.S. and Europe, but a permanent change. And do you believe there's

been a permanent, lasting change?

KOFOD: I think we -- yes, I think we are going rapidly in that direction. And I think for very fundamental reasons. I mean, what President Trump

seems to respect is power, force.

[18:15:00]

And if Europe should be respected by Trump and also European core interests, like ensuring territorial integrity and sovereignty of all

European states and also the Kingdom of Denmark and Greenland, then Europe has to build a strong military, strong economy and be taken seriously. I

mean, that is clear. And I think Europe should do that.

I mean, it's not enough to have a strong transatlantic alliance when that alliance is de facto being blown up by trade wars. And now, this very

hostile attack on sovereignty of NATO member, that could eventually end NATO if Trump carry out, you know, a military operation in Greenland,

taking territory from another NATO state. So, yes, Europe needs to be strong, to be respected. I think there's a good point in that.

SCIUTTO: I wonder how far you define strong. I spoke to a Danish member of parliament yesterday who was very clear about not just what Denmark's red

line is, but how Denmark would respond if the U.S. were to apply military pressure. Have a listen to his thoughts.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RASMUS JARLOV, DANISH PARLIAMENT MEMBER: We will, of course, defend Greenland. If there is an invasion by American troops, it would be a war

and we would be fighting against each other. We know that the Americans are stronger than us, and you have a much stronger military than ours. But it

is our duty to defend our land and our people and the 57,000 Danish citizens that live in Greenland that have made it absolutely crystal clear

that they don't want to be taken by the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: That was Rasmus Jarlov, the Danish member of parliament. Do you believe, do you share his sense there that it could get to that, a military

conflict between the U.S. and Denmark?

KOFOD: Well, I think the problem we are in is that we cannot rule it out 100 percent. I think it's highly unlikely and imaginable. But, you know,

with the rhetoric from President Trump, you know, saying, well, we can do it, you know, the normal way or the hard way, it's up to you. He's now

threatening all the time using force and will not exclude use of military force.

Personally, I don't believe that will happen for many reasons. But I think the threat in itself is just a fundamental attack on NATO, the values we

share, the disrespect for other states, democratic states, territory, which I have never thought will happen in 2026. And, you know, United States and

the Kingdom of Denmark has been close allies for decades.

We have seen each other as the closest allies standing side by side, both in the Arctic, but also around the world fighting terrorism, you know,

protecting our national security. So, I have a hard time to see that our troops should fight against each other. That is not I don't think it's

going to happen. But of course, we have to prepare for everything.

And the member of parliament is right from Denmark that if Denmark is attacked, all our troops are instructed, like in any other country, to

defend its territory and sovereignty. That's why you have a defense. And that goes for any attack.

SCIUTTO: Indeed. Well, short of military confrontation, which I understand is an outlier, Europe is at least saying now that it's willing to suffer

economic pain in response to this, the U.S. imposing tariffs, Europe imposing more, which, of course, will hurt, it'll hurt economically. How

much pain? And do you think Europe is really ready for that and unified in that?

KOFOD: Well, I think nobody wants a trade war and nobody wants a conflict with the United States. I mean, all the time there's appeal to President

Trump. Let's work together on Arctic security, on securing, you know, a U.S. national security, activating NATO, work together economically. But at

the same time, I think what I was saying before that Europe now has learned the hard way is that the only real thing that President Trump is respecting

is power.

And if he threatens again with a trade war, raising tariffs that will be detrimental to our companies, businesses in Europe, then Europe will fight

back. And I'm sure this time Europe will fight back to the bitter end, because that's the only way to stop that from happening in the future.

Showing an example, being powerful instead of just accommodating something which will not even be a deal, because there is a deal that is now not

respected. So, I think Europe will fight back this time.

[18:20:00]

SCIUTTO: Jeppe Kofod, thanks so much for joining the program.

KOFOD: You're welcome. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Well, Spain reels from one of its deadliest train crashes in years. We're just learning that at least one person was killed, dozens of

people injured in another accident, a commuter train in Catalonia derailed. Officials say a wall fell onto the tracks and then struck the train. We'll

continue to follow that story.

Just ahead, the U.S. Department of Justice has now subpoenaed multiple Democratic officials in Minnesota, including the state's governor. As part

of a probe into what it says is alleged interference with ICE's operations, we're going to bring you the latest after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: President Trump marked the first year of his second term with a sometimes rambling news conference. It was about 15 minutes shy of two

hours. He began his monologue by complaining about his public relations. Then, he showed off mugshots of people he said were undocumented migrants

who'd been apprehended in recent ICE operations. He went over many topics, gas prices, Somalia, even Greenland, of course. Remember, as we've been

reporting, he has not ruled out even military action to take control of the island.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How far are you willing to go to acquire green?

TRUMP: You'll find out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Alongside the more newsworthy headlines, there were plenty of bizarre rambling moments, including this one as he dug up the past to

complain about the Biden administration.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Ended Joe Biden's weaponization of our government and removed his hand-picked radical left Marxist prosecutors from the Department of Justice

like deranged Jack Sicksmith (ph). He's a sick son of a bitch. They gave me the worst of the worst, and here I am. How did that happen?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining me now, Congressman Ami Bera, Democrat from California. Thanks so much for taking the time.

REP. AMI BERA (D-CA): Jim, thanks for having me on.

SCIUTTO: I wonder, listen, it's hard to pin down a particular point of that news conference for you to respond to, but I will ask you, because the

president once accused the previous administration of weaponizing, for instance, the Justice Department.

[18:25:00]

Of course, we now have the president adding to his long list of Democratic officials that he has gotten his Justice Department to investigate, these

being the elected officials of the State of Minnesota, including the governor. What's your reaction to those subpoenas?

BERA: I mean, we know who's weaponizing the Justice Department, that's Donald Trump. Many of us criticized Merrick Garland for being relatively

slow and methodic, but that's the way this process is supposed to work. Again, Joe Biden didn't do a weaponization here. He went through the

process. He was hands-off. He didn't give direct orders for who to arrest and what to do. Again, that was left up to Merrick Garland, his attorney

general. I think and many of us thought he -- Merrick Garland went a little slow.

Donald Trump is known to try to distract folks to actually say, oh, the other guy did what he's exactly doing. So, we've got to rebuild this. We've

got to restore a real Justice Department, and that's a problem right now.

SCIUTTO: Of course, the president is on his way soon to Davos, where he is threatening -- and this is the view of European officials, not my view --

he's threatening to blow up the NATO alliance because he's decided he wants to take Greenland by any means necessary, the sovereign territory of

another country, Denmark.

You have said that you've spoken to Republicans who express their own worries about what they're seeing out of the president. The trouble with

that, right, is that you and I have heard Republicans quietly express reservations and then, well, not do much about it. Do you get the sense

that there's any real movement on the other side of the aisle to somehow restrain the president?

BERA: You've seen Senator Murkowski, Representative Don Bacon, put forth resolutions, war power stuff. This is a moment in time where Denmark is an

ally. Greenland is a territory of Denmark. When I've talked to the Danish ambassador, when I've talked to the representative of Greenland, they're

more than happy to have us increase our military presence there. We've already got an Air Force base there. They're more than happy for U.S.

companies to go into Greenland, help develop the critical minerals and supply chains that are necessary there.

They want us there. They don't want us there by force. They want us there through cooperation and negotiation. Again, they don't present a threat,

and there is no threat from Russia or China or others in Greenland.

SCIUTTO: Is there anything different to you about this crisis in terms of the way that Congress may react? Because again, you and I have seen

Congress look the other way on a whole host of things that actually had large bipartisan majorities, for instance, military support for Ukraine

being one of them. And yet, those dominoes fall one by one, largely because Republicans don't want to get on the wrong side of the president, even

outgoing Republicans. Do you see something different about this crisis with the U.S. threatening treaty allies, or might this just be added to the list

of, well, shrugs from Congress?

BERA: I mean, we need Republicans to stand with Democrats. And again, they're saying all the right things right now. They're giving all the right

signals. But we've watched time and time again when President Trump acts on his own, but they go silent. This is not a moment to go silent. This is a

moment to express your support for NATO, to understand what Article 1 means, to say that, wait a minute, Greenland's not a threat, Denmark is a

friend, to send a strong signal to President Trump, especially before -- who knows what he's going to say at Davos tomorrow.

We saw this rambling two-hour press conference that you were just referring to. He is, again, unhinged. There does seem to be no guardrails holding him

back. This is where Republicans and Democrats, Congress as a separate branch of government, needs to stand up, reassert our faith in NATO,

reassure our allies in Europe that we're there together protecting freedom, democracy, and that we've got to do this together.

SCIUTTO: Thom Tillis, who actually pulled back some of his criticism today, he was pressed, actually, on another network as to whether he was

criticizing the president, and he said, well, no, I'm not criticizing the president. He has raised the prospect, at least, of blocking new

nominations for the president, which a Republican senator could conceivably do.

Is that a likelihood, in your view? Because the idea of Congress getting together for some big, you know, bipartisan vote might seem out there for a

lot of folks watching this broadcast. Do you see something more simple than that or kind of a lower bar?

BERA: Yes. Thom Tillis is retiring, so maybe he will have the courage to use the means he has. We've talked about doing this maneuver called the

discharge petition, putting something out there where if you can get 218 signatures that forces a vote on the floor, we use it to pass subsidies for

health care. I think we ought to use it to put something out there to reassure and reaffirm our faith in NATO, our partnership there, and do

things to block the president from unilaterally taking action on Greenland. Because again, there's no threat there.

[18:30:00]

SCIUTTO: We'll see where that goes. Ami Bera, we appreciate you joining us as always.

BERA: Thank you, Jim. Be well.

SCIUTTO: All right. So, for a look now inside the thinking inside the White House, Kristen Holmes joins us now. Goodness. President is going to

Davos. He seems like he's full of confidence, emboldened following the Maduro operation. He wants Greenland. He's not going to back down. He did,

though, say in that long press conference, well, you know, we'll get to a point where NATO is happy. I mean, is there any actual potential movement

from the White House on this, or is he going to take it by any means necessary?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, that is the big question. And I've even heard from people who are close to President

Trump and close to this White House that they aren't entirely sure what the end game is. President Trump is known for his posturing. He obviously made

this actual capturing of Maduro in this military operation. As you said, he's confident after that. He's confident after the strikes in Iran earlier

last year on the nuclear facilities there. He believes in the military might, and he's certainly leaning on that as they talk about Greenland.

But there really is not an appetite among almost anyone that I talk to, and that includes lawmakers, Republicans, aides, advisers, and allies, to have

some kind of military intervention when it comes to Greenland, particularly given that they are a NATO ally. Now, that's not going to stop President

Trump from taking it as far as he possibly can. But again, there is no appetite for that.

Now, when you talk about President Trump kind of going up there and talking for this hour and 45 minutes on a variety of topics, you heard from him a

number of points that he made on NATO. Now, all of them are things that he's said before, but they, of course, take on new meaning given the

context of this very moment, things like, I believe that the United States would support NATO, but I'm not sure if NATO would step in and rescue the

United States.

Again, something that gives us a little bit of an indication that he's not really quite ready to get rid of or allow the NATO relationship or allow

NATO to completely fall apart, because he continues to say that the United States would step in and help NATO if that was ever needed. But there are

still a lot of questions as to what that's going to look like, and it's very clear that these relationships with these various European leaders are

growing more tense by the day.

You know, he has this whole statement where he says Macron and him are friends, but basically nobody really cares about Macron because he's on his

way out the door, saying he hasn't spoken to Macron or Starmer since he started posting on Truth Social. But this is a very tense moment for the

world. It's a very tense moment for U.S. officials who are trying to maintain these relationships with our European allies while still answering

to the commander-in-chief.

SCIUTTO: And to your point, Europeans definitely find this to be quite a nervous moment as well. European officials, Kristen Holmes at the White

House, thanks so much. And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:35:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back to "The Brief." I'm Jim Sciutto and here are the international headlines we're watching today.

President Trump says NATO is going to be very happy with what he works out on Greenland. Ahead of his trip to Europe, he said once more that he needs

the Arctic Island for national and even global security. Trump said people in Greenland will be thrilled to become part of the U.S. even though

they've made quite clear they're very much opposed to the move.

Vladimir Zelenskyy says he will only meet with Trump at the World Economic Forum in Switzerland if he meets Ukraine's security guarantees. Overnight,

Moscow launched its largest air assault this year on Ukraine, killing at least one person in the Kyiv region. Zelenskyy says his top priority is to

end the war and is grateful for U.S. and Ukrainian teams working together.

Sources say the U.S. Justice Department has subpoenaed at least five Democratic officials in Minnesota. They include the governor, Tim Walz, and

Attorney General Keith Ellison, as well as the mayors of St. Paul and Minneapolis. This is part of a probe into whether local and state leaders

somehow obstructed federal immigration officers and efforts. All officials so far named, as we noted, Democrats.

The Border Patrol's commander at large accused those officials of creating a difficult operating environment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GREG BOVINO, COMMAND-AT-LARGE, U.S. BORDER PATROL: Leaders like Tim Walz or Mayor Frey have relied on heated rhetoric and accusations that distract

from the facts. And what we do is legal, ethical, and moral. Everything we do every day is legal, ethical, moral, well-grounded in law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Critics of the Justice Department are denouncing the way it handled the shooting death of protester Renee Good, shooting death by an

ICE agent. The FBI briefly opened a civil rights investigation into the ICE agent who shot her, then quickly switched its focus to investigating Good

and her widow.

Joining me now, Cooley Law School professor and former Florida judge Jeff Swartz. Good to have you back, Jeff.

JEFF SWARTZ, FORMER FLORIDA JUDGE AND PROFESSOR, THOMAS M. COOLEY LAW SCHOOL: Nice to see you, Jim. Thank you for having me.

SCIUTTO: So, lots of questions for you. You heard Greg Bovino there announce with confidence that everything ICE and CBP agents are doing in

Minnesota are lawful, legal, et cetera. There are a lot of videos out here out there that show that's not true.

SWARTZ: Yes.

SCIUTTO: As a lawyer, what do you see?

SWARTZ: I see a lot of violations of the Fourth Amendment. I see people being arrested or seized without reasonable or articulable suspicion or

probable cause. I see a lot of people being taken into custody without establishing probable cause to take them into custody. I see a lot of

violence on the part of the police. It is somewhat reminiscent to me to all the way back to 1968 when I saw what the Chicago police did with the people

who were demonstrating there during the Democratic Convention.

This kind of stuff just shouldn't be taking place if they are, in fact, only looking for the worst of the worst. And if, in fact, they're only

looking for people who they know are, in fact, illegally in the country. So, I just see too much going on here to tolerate.

SCIUTTO: OK. So, let's talk about these subpoenas of the Democratic officials in Minnesota. The statute DOJ is relying on, rarely used,

traditionally invoked against explicit threats or obstruction to federal agents, not against lawmakers, elected lawmakers, setting enforcement

priorities and standards. What is the legal threshold here for this case to stand up, and do you see it standing up?

[18:40:00]

SWARTZ: Well, the first thing they're doing is they're looking for documents, whether it's text messages, e-mails, things like that, between

these five people. Two of them are our county -- two different counties, people who are involved in the government. And then there's the mayor of

St. Paul and the mayor of Minneapolis and the governor.

And the idea that they're looking for is to see if there is some form of, albeit conspiracy among them, to come up with means to obstruct ICE and

what they are doing. I think that's what they're looking for first, something that they can hang their hat on.

The second thing that I think they'll do is that they'll draw these people into grand juries. And when they go to these grand juries, they will be

offered basically immunity, use immunity, the idea being to make them testify. They can't use those statements at trial, but they can use them to

indict the people who make the statements and indict the other people who are being drawn into all of this.

This is a this is a major threat. If there are people who know how to put this case together and they can find what they're looking for, they'll

indict them.

SCIUTTO: Convict as well? Because we've seen indictments of, say, James Comey, Letitia James, that fell apart quite quickly after the fact.

SWARTZ: I don't think that their intention is to convict. This is not this is not your father's DOJ or our DOJ where they were looking for

convictions. I think that what they're looking for is a way to harass these people, try to make them fall in line, to intimidate other people in other

states from doing all of this. That's kind of what's going on here. And it's just -- you know that's what they're going to try to do. And if they

can get an indictment, they won't care whether they convict or not. It won't matter.

SCIUTTO: Minnesota's attorney general points out that the subpoenas came shortly after his office sued the Trump administration. Might their lawyers

be able to make a case for selective or retaliatory prosecution?

SWARTZ: They could try. The problem would be at this point as to whether they're going to use it in other areas of the country. They're not going to

stay in Minneapolis and St. Paul forever. There is always the possibility that they will try to use this same approach going to other cities,

sanctuary cities, as they call them, to try to interfere with their ability to interfere. I think some of it is also meant to draw in possibly and

identify leaders of the protests. And this is some way of intimidating those type of efforts in other places. It's disturbing to watch.

SCIUTTO: Law professor Jeff Swartz, thanks so much for joining.

SWARTZ: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: Still ahead, uncertainty is back. Christine Lagarde, the head of the European Central Bank, speaks out on President Trump's renewed terror

threats against its allies.

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[18:45:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back. In today's Business Breakout, U.S. stocks fell sharply on Tuesday, the first trading day of this week. The Nasdaq and S&P

tumbling more than 2 percent over the U.S. president's threats to Greenland. In other financial markets, the dollar dropped. Safe havens gold

and silver rallied to new records. And this is crucial, everybody's watching the bond markets, U.S. treasury yields spiked.

In Davos today, the U.S. treasury secretary, Scott Bessent, dismissed fears that Europe will dump treasuries to push back against President Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT BESSENT, U.S. TREASURY SECRETARY: The U.S. treasury market was the best performing market in the world, or the best G7 performing bond market.

And we had the best performance since 2020. It is the most liquid market. It is the basis for all financial transactions. And I am sure that the

European governments will continue holding it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: U.S. Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick also tried to downplay any potential economic costs for the U.S.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HOWARD LUTNICK: U.S. COMMERCE SECRETARY: So, you can start with a kerfuffle, but in the end, right, the United States and Europe are great

allies. The United States and the U.K. are great allies. These are great allies, right? We are great allies with Canada. We are great allies. It

doesn't mean you don't have an argument. It doesn't mean you don't disagree. But it doesn't change the fundamentals of the United States knows

who our allies are. And if we're going to have a kerfuffle, so be it. But we know where it's going to end. It's going to end in a reasonable manner.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Europeans aren't convinced. Lutnick says he believes the U.S.- E.U. trade agreement reached last year remains on track, and that the E.U. should hold off on hitting the U.S. retaliatory tariffs, even as Trump has

promised tariffs, new ones, on Europe.

Christine Lagarde, the head of the European Central Bank, is less sanguine. She told my colleague Richard Quest the tensions over U.S.-European

relations will weigh on the global economy for months to come.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LAGARDE: Well, it's a movie we've seen before. And what is, I think, more important than the tariff themselves is the rising uncertainty that we are

seeing again. So, uncertainty is back. And I think it's really very inconvenient for both corporate America, SMEs in America, and the same in

Europe, because people then don't exactly know how they're going to sell, how they're going to buy, who is going to bear the burden of tariffs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Joining me now is William Lee, chief economist at Global Economic Advisors. Thanks so much for taking the time.

WILLIAM LEE, CHIEF ECONOMIST, GLOBAL ECONOMIC ADVISORS: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: Let me ask you a very basic question, what is the value of a trade agreement with the U.S. when President Trump reaches trade agreements

and then changes the term within weeks or months, as he's doing now with Europe? There was a trade agreement or at least a framework for one. And

now, he is slapping 10 or 25 percent tariffs on Europe if he doesn't get what he wants in Greenland.

LEE: Well, Jim, I think the basic principle about a trade agreement is really what's important. When people are planning as to what they're going

to do when they have a trade agreement, it's what it is that the trade agreement is about.

In the United States, when Trump makes a trade agreement, he's telling everybody, if you invest in the United States, you get low tariffs. If you

don't invest in the United States and want to compete and import your stuff into our country, you're going to have a tariff barrier to go through

because we want to protect those who invested in the United States, both domestic and foreign investors, from unfair competition. That's the

principle. And I think he's been pretty clear and steady about maintaining that principle.

Some of the details may change only because either one or two of their terms were just never met and the two players didn't really fulfill their

obligations. Like, for example, China has really come forth with guarantees of our supply of rare earths. But all in all, these agreements are pretty

clear.

SCIUTTO: But that is not the principle here, because President Trump is threatening and imposing economic tariffs because he wants to make a

territorial acquisition. That's an entirely new demand.

[18:50:00]

LEE: Well, I think this is part of the political negotiation that is essentially giving Greenlanders the choice of wanting to be part of the

United States orbit or the European one. And he's saying to, I think, the world, lay off. Let these guys choose freely, because, you know, we are

offering them economic development. We're offering them a kind of a compact of association that we offer, say, the Marshall Islands and some of our

other territories, where they can freely come to the United States without a visa to work and to live. And give them a choice.

So, right now, they're free to go to Denmark. But would you rather go to Denmark, where the growth rate and job opportunities are half of what they

are in the United States? And I think that's the choice that President Trump is trying to present. And I think the Danes are saying, no, no, no.

It's our stuff. Lay off. And don't even bother. It's very reminiscent of the colonial attitude that the Europeans have had for hundreds of years.

SCIUTTO: But he's not offering a choice. He's saying we want it. Easy way or the hard way. And by the way, the people of Greenland have already made

a choice. They've -- the polls show where they want to go. And they've elected leaders, both Greenland and Danish leaders who are flat out

rejecting this because they see it as a shakedown.

LEE: Well, when my representative from Denmark tells me that I'm not interested, that's one thing, right? When there's a true poll that an

election that takes place among the residents there, that's something else. But, you know, that's something for negotiations, right?

I don't want to preempt, you know, what it is the president can offer. But these are the kind of terms that that that I think they've been talking

about. And I think the Europeans have been very recalcitrant to let go because I think they -- you know, they realize they can't really defend

Greenland the way they -- a sovereign supposed to against a lot of the Chinese and Russian incursions that have already taken place.

I mean, remember, the Chinese have got a strategic interest in the Greenland because they want a northern Arctic extension to the Belt and

Road Initiative, right? They want to be able to come in there and build a lot of stuff and make them dependent upon China as supplier.

By the way, Denmark is already dependent on China as supplier to a lot of the green initiatives. A lot of the solar and wind turbines that they have

are manufactured in China. So, Denmark (INAUDIBLE) said, if the U.S. wants us to do something, they can just ask. But now if we ask, can we put more

base there? Are the Chinese going to let them?

SCIUTTO: Well, don't ask. I mean, it's a subject of a 75-year-old treaty that already exists that allows the U.S. to base troops there, which

Denmark is quite publicly offered repeatedly. William Lee, thanks so much for joining.

LEE: Thanks for having me.

SCIUTTO: Eastern Russia is struggling under the weight of record snowfall. Homeowners digging massive trenches just to get out their front doors.

We're going to have a look coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:55:00]

SCIUTTO: Wow, just astonishing scenes out of Russia's Far East, buried under its heaviest snowfall in 60 years as a winter blast sweeps across

parts of Asia. Tall snow drifts have forced locals to dig trenches just to enter their homes. Scientists say it could be due to climate change

affecting Arctic air patterns. The cold snaps also disrupting transport, closing roads in China and stranding air travelers in Japan. And it's not

just Asia. A major winter storm is set to strike the eastern U.S. later this week.

This might look like a scene from the Arctic, but this spectacular Aurora Borealis lit up skies across the British Isles. The dazzling display of

solar activity was said to be the largest solar radiation storm in two decades. Wow. Stargazers were treated to a rare red-toned light show, red

and green there. If you happen to be nearby and skies are clear at your place, cast your eyes to the sky, you might have a second shot at seeing

the northern lights this evening. I tried last night, but I couldn't quite catch them where I am.

Thanks so much for joining us today. I'm Jim Sciutto in New York. You've been watching "The Brief." Please do stay with CNN.

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