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The Brief with Jim Sciutto

CNN International: Zelenskyy Says He Feels Betrayed by Trump; Bipartisan Group of U.S. lawmakers Criticize Trump Diesel Deal; Trump Ramps Up Campaign Blitz as Republicans Face Tight Races; U.S. Stocks Fall After Worrying Inflation Report; U.S. Midterm Elections Now, Just 20 Days Away; New Book Tackles 1984 Killing in Beirut; Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Speaks to CNN. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired October 14, 2026 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[18:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR, "THE BRIEF": And welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington, and you're

watching "The Brief."

Just ahead this hour, Ukraine's president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, says he feels betrayed by the US, and that it's painful when President Trump

chooses one side. We'll get the view from Kyiv. New inflation data hits U.S. markets hard just 20 days out from midterm elections. We'll have the

numbers and their potential impact. And we'll hear from Navi Pillay, this year's Nobel Peace Prize laureate.

The Ukrainian president says President Trump's diesel deal with Russia shows that Washington is on the wrong side. Volodymyr Zelenskyy got candid

during an interview with Piers Morgan during his visit to London.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PIERS MORGAN: Do you feel betrayed by what has been happening?

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: Really, yes, really between us. But I mean, it's a little bit more complicated than just my emotions or my

feelings. Yes, it's -- it depends not on my -- not on me. I mean, this -- our country has to survive, and we count on our real partners, strategic

partners, United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: President Zelenskyy says it is a pity that Ukraine is losing the U.S. as a, quote, "strong partner." So, what led to this? Ukrainian

officials cite a series of what they see as betrayals. The first was President Trump's decision to allow Moscow to supply diesel fuel to the

U.S. and global markets, which President Zelenskyy called a gift to Russia's Vladimir Putin.

Then, for two nights this week, Ukrainian commanders noticed they were no longer receiving early warnings of incoming Russian ballistic missiles,

which depend on U.S. intelligence. As a result, Russian missiles were striking without the warning necessary to move residents into shelters.

Over 48 hours, 20 Ukrainians were killed. Ukrainian officials told me they found the timing suspicious. This past weekend, as we reported, the Trump

administration had warned Ukraine the U.S. could suspend intelligence- sharing if Kyiv did not halt deep strikes on Russian energy facilities.

By the start of the week, President Trump insisted such intelligence- sharing continued. So, what explained the lack of missile warnings? U.S. officials blamed the weather. Ukrainian officials suspected it was

deliberate. America says it was a failure, a European official told me, but it can't be the truth.

By Wednesday, Ukraine had lost another key aspect of U.S. support, with the U.S. placing restrictions on military-grade Starlink services. Those

restrictions disrupted Ukrainian air defenses, again threatening lives. This will give Russians a real leverage on a front line at a time when we

are effectively stopping their advances, a Ukrainian official told me. Ukrainian presidential adviser explained Ukraine believed the Starlink

restrictions were, like the lack of missile warnings, deliberate. "It is clear that this action cannot be a coincidence and is linked to the current

political situation." End quote.

In each case, Ukrainians see U.S. politics trumping Ukrainian lives, and for them, that makes the U.S. an ally they can no longer trust.

Joining me now is someone very much at the center of these Russian attacks, the deputy mayor of Kyiv, Konstantin Usov. Mayor, thanks so much for

joining.

KONSTANTIN USOV, KYIV DEPUTY MAYOR: Hello, Jim. It's great to be with you.

SCIUTTO: So, you very much have a dangerous front seat to this. I wonder, when you saw earlier this week that those early missile warnings were not

coming, and when you saw restrictions placed on military-grade Starlink, which as you know Ukraine uses to defend itself against incoming drones, do

you believe that the U.S. was deliberately applying pressure to Ukraine?

USOV: Great question, Jim. I think American intelligence sharing is one of the most valuable forms of assistance Ukraine currently receives. In the

case of ballistic missiles and missile strikes in general, I would speak not as a military person, but as someone responsible for making a Ukrainian

-- European capital functioning while Russia is trying to just disable it.

[18:05:00]

So, time is everything. Intelligence sharing is all about advance warning, and advance warning is not about military information. It means additional

time to activate air defenses, alert civilians, and respond to a threat. We know from our air force that the initial wave of ballistic missiles on last

days came without any usual warning from our partners, although warnings did come before that all those years. I cannot tell you why that happened.

I -- and I wouldn't speculate about decisions inside the American government, but I can tell you this. From Kyiv perspective, the reliability

of these systems is literally a matter of life and death for real civilians, and we need American intelligence sharing to remain continuous

and predictable. This is crucially important for us.

SCIUTTO: It's CNN's reporting that U.S. officials warned Ukrainian officials that it would be a mistake for them to make decisions, including

strikes on Russian energy, that would harm U.S. consumers. From where you're sitting there in a city where Ukrainians die every night from

Russian strikes, do you see the U.S., in effect, equating diesel prices in this country with risk to Ukrainian lives?

USOV: Again, a great question. I would say that we really want ceasefire. Nobody wants this war to end more than Ukrainians, and any serious American

effort to stop attacks on civilian infrastructure is very welcomed by Ukraine.

But look at what's happening -- what was happening over the last few days. President Trump announced this energy ceasefire on Sunday, as far as I

remember. And since then, Russia has continued attacking our energy infrastructure. Last night, all three of Kyiv's combined heat and power

plants were hit. So, I think we need to distinguish an announcement about ceasefire from an agreement that is actually taking place and working and

protecting someone on the ground.

For someone running the city, for me, the test for the ceasefire is quite straightforward. Are the missiles still coming? Are people still dying? Can

we repair our power plants without having them hit again the next morning? And I believe that ceasefire has to be mutual, verifiable, and it should be

backed by real consequences for those who violate it.

Well, and just one other point, I don't think that any ceasefire could be a real thing if it relies solely on constraining one side but not both sides.

SCIUTTO: Before we go, you heard your own president go so far as to say that, we are losing a strong partner, his words describing the U.S. Do you

still consider the U.S. a strong partner for Kyiv?

USOV: Oh, for sure. For sure. And I don't blame President Zelenskyy for being and becoming more and more emotional while navigating this very

complex geopolitical partner-seeking and partner-maintaining mission. But for Ukrainians, there is no doubt that there is a strong recognition who

are our friends, who's our enemy and we do believe that friendship and diplomatic alliance goes way beyond current administration, current

president, or political balance in a domestic political process in this or that country.

And therefore, we do believe that there is a strategic alignment when it comes to values, goals, and the view on how the planet should be built and

how it should live among each other between Ukraine and the U.S. Because I assure you on this fifth year of war that there is no more Western-looking

nation in Europe than Ukraine.

And there is no struggle that could stop Ukraine from actually defending its pro-European, pro-Western choice when it comes to many years ahead.

[18:10:00]

SCIUTTO: OK. Well, given the time there and I know this is often the time when those Russian missiles start flying, thanks so much for joining and we

wish you a safe evening there.

USOV: Thank you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Back here in the U.S. some Republican lawmakers are pushing back against President Trump and his latest shifts on Ukraine. Republican

Congressman French Hill, who's long been a supporter of U.S. support for Ukraine, joins me now from Little Rock, Arkansas. Congressman, thanks so

much for taking the time.

REP. FRENCH HILL (R-AR): Jim, it's always good to be with you.

SCIUTTO: So, you heard the deputy mayor of Kyiv there be quite careful in his statements about the U.S., but the President of Ukraine was quite

direct and he said that he felt betrayed by the U.S. by recent moves. And I'll be frank, I've been speaking to a number of Ukrainian officials, both

in Kyiv and in this country, and they, like the president, say they see pressure being applied here.

The Starlink restrictions, the lack of missile warnings, the diesel deal. Are they wrong not to trust the U.S. as a partner?

HILL: Well, Jim, first let me thank you for your consistent coverage of this horrific invasion by Russia of Ukraine for five years you've been on

the front lines. So, thank you for bringing your consistent reporting.

My view is, look, we just had in September President Trump sign a law that we've worked on for over a year to find consensus in the House and Senate

to fully sanction the Russian nation for its attack on Ukraine.

I think that bill has a lot of flaws. I voted for it. I believe that the piece that we have passed in my committee is a superior way to sanction the

Russian energy industry. And I hope President Trump implements it. He has a step one to report to the Congress by October 18th on it. And the important

issue there for the Ukrainians and for the Europeans are the overwhelming bipartisan, bicameral vote that we worked so hard to try to land in the

House for well over a year.

So, I want Putin to understand that he witnessed for the first time since President Trump's re-election, a strong bipartisan bicameral vote against

his continued attacks on Ukraine.

SCIUTTO: But the facts are, as you know, that he signed that piece of legislation, that piece of paper, but in actions, he's just relaxed

sanctions on Russia to allow it to sell billions of dollars' worth of fuel, which is, as Zelenskyy has said, is more money for Russia's war machine.

So, what's the meaning of that legislation that the president himself is not following it?

HILL: Well, let's see if he does follow it on the secondary sanctions. I think I don't support that approach to trying to improve diesel prices. I

think that was not the best approach. I support removing the federal tax on diesel fuel, encouraging the states to do a tax holiday on diesel fuel for

90 days. I think that's a much better way to approach this. I don't believe waiving sanctions on diesel fuel in Russia will either greatly affect price

here.

And all it does is send a confusing message, as you point out, about a united front in the United States that we oppose Putin's position in

Ukraine. And we want, I think the president's idea on Sunday was an excellent idea of a mutual immediate energy attack ceasefire encouraged by

the United States and forced by the United States and the European Union and other partners on both countries. That would be good.

I'll believe it when I see it, because I've never seen Putin operate honorably in any instance since he's taken power. Ask the Chechens, ask the

Syrians, ask the Ukrainians.

SCIUTTO: Shouldn't that be clear to President Trump at this point, though? He has pushed for more ceasefires than I can count. Ukraine has said, we'll

do it. We just want Russia to do it. And then Russia keeps attacking. And that's been true in the last several days. I mean, multiple strikes, not

just on Ukrainian civilians who are bearing the burden, as they often are, but also on Ukrainian energy facilities. What reason does President Trump

have to give President Putin yet one more chance?

HILL: Well, look, it's been this way for five years. And, Jim, you and I talked about this all through the Biden administration. And I express my

immense frustration with the on-again, off-again politics of this horrific invasion of Ukraine with back and forth in the U.K., back and forth in the

Germany, back and forth in the Biden administration.

[18:15:00]

This has been unsatisfactory to me for five painful years. The only thing the Russians understand is force. The only thing that Putin will understand

is a united front between the allies to Ukraine to bring peace to Ukraine, to bring a compromise that is accepted by the Ukrainians.

And so, all I can urge is bring Russia to the table, bring Ukraine to the table, have an energy ceasefire and get serious about it. Otherwise, we

just have this on-again, off-again situation that's not accomplished anything, whether it's weak economic approach or weak military support for

Ukraine that we saw during the Biden administration.

SCIUTTO: The trouble is the support, as you know, has declined. There is no more direct U.S. military assistance to Ukraine. And now, Ukrainians'

concern is that they're going to lose what remains, including intelligence sharing, including access to all the capabilities they need for a military

grade Starlink. It's going in the opposite direction. What are Republicans in Congress prepared to do, along with Democrats, to reverse that?

HILL: Jim -- you know, we've had this back and forth, you know, we've had this back and forth with the United States and with the Ukrainians for the

whole five years. We should continue intelligence sharing. We just authorized them to make Patriot missiles. President Trump just approved

that in the last few weeks. We are backing NATO and European allies in their supply to Ukraine.

So, I hear you, and I agree that we should be firmly committed with our European allies of ejecting Putin from Ukraine and bringing him equally to

the table. And that's my position. So, I hear you, but I do want to emphasize how frustrating it's been for five years to have inconsistent

economic sanctions and inconsistent military support of the Ukrainians by both administrations and by European governments.

SCIUTTO: And Ukrainians, as always, paying the price, which, of course, you know, given your own visits there.

HILL: I understand, and that's why I stand firmly with the Ukrainians.

SCIUTTO: No question. And you've done your time there. Congressman French Hill, we appreciate you joining.

HILL: Thank you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Well, here in the U.S., with 20 days to go until the midterm elections, President Trump is continuing a campaign blitz to try to boost

Republicans, even in reliably red areas. He just wrapped up a rally in Arizona and will then speak in Montana in the next several hours. Trump won

both states in 2024. The president's campaign schedule is ramping up as Republicans fear they're going to lose control of the House, possibly even

the Senate.

This comes amid Trump's unpopular war with Iran, continuing affordability issues, and the president's approval rating underwater at 33 percent,

according to CNN's Poll of Polls. Speaking just a short time ago, the president tried to sound upbeat.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: So, we're going to elect a strong Republican majority in the House and Senate, and I think we have a really good chance.

And to be honest with you, you know, I'm not on the ballot. And they say if I'm on the ballot, we get 49 percent more votes. So, I'm here to say,

please pretend I'm on the ballot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Kevin Liptak joins me now from Montana, where he is awaiting for the president to arrive there. The president is running this, and he said

repeatedly, treat me -- treat it like I'm on the ballot. I know that historically, that has benefited Republicans, but are his own advisers and

our Republican candidates confident that having him on the ballot, in effect, is a good thing for Republicans this cycle?

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, and they seem to be making that gamble, despite the president's historic unpopularity,

including in a lot of red states like Montana, that having him out here telling low-propensity voters, you know, voters who might vote in

presidential cycles but don't turn out for midterm elections, to go out and vote, that that will be what does it, that that will be what turns around

what is a very negative midterm season for Republicans.

But there is a flip side to that, and that is the liability, that if Republicans start to see the president out more and more, start to hear him

talk about his unpopular policies more and more, that that could just drag Republicans down.

Now, in Montana, the focus is on a House race. There is a Senate race here, but there are three candidates. Two of them are on the left-leaning side,

and they're splitting the vote, and so the Republican seems likely to win. The focus is more on the House, and that in this district pits Aaron Flint,

who's a conservative radio host, against Sam Forstag, who is a park service firefighter. He's gotten a lot of national attention. He's started this

progressive wave of young Democrats who are running.

[18:20:00]

Now, I actually put the question that you asked me to Aaron Flint earlier, that doesn't having President Trump here put you in a tough place because

he is so unpopular? And actually, when you drive around town here, there are signs linking Aaron Flint to President Trump and specifically to the

war in Iran.

Now, he didn't really answer that question directly. He sort of turned it around and claimed that his rival was being backed by people who are even

more unpopular than Trump, like Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. But he did make the point that in rural districts like this one, the people who go out and

vote in presidential elections are overwhelmingly not likely to vote in the midterms. And he seems to be making the gamble that it is worth whatever

risk there is in having Trump next to him, if it means some of those Trump supporters, low propensity Trump supporters, go out and vote.

The other issue that you have in this particular district is the Democratic brand is just really unpopular. You've seen that in the last couple

election cycles. Montana, in some ways, used to be a purple state, but it has tilted more and more conservative.

Now, I spoke to Sam Forstag as well, who's the Democratic candidate in this race, and he also acknowledged that a lot of people are pissed off. And he

understood why people were pissed off with the Democratic Party. That's the word that he used. And he essentially said that a lot of the economic

problems that people are facing here on housing and other issues started during the Biden administration. So, he's kind of embracing that anger and

suggesting that he would bring a different perspective to Washington.

And so, we'll see what Trump says in his speech tonight. You know, he doesn't often talk about housing, which is the big issue when you talk to

people here. So, we'll see what he has to say when he's here in a few hours.

SCIUTTO: Kevin Liptak, thanks so much for joining. Well, still ahead, a hotter than expected U.S. inflation report triggers sharp losses on Wall

Street, plus new fears about A.I. demand also hitting stocks hard. We'll have the details after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Welcome back. In today's Business Breakout now, a hotter than expected U.S. inflation report helped trigger steep losses on Wall Street.

Wednesday, tech stocks hit the hardest, falling more than one and a half percent. The S&P 500 fell more than one percent, its worst day since July.

[18:25:00]

The last U.S. inflation report before the midterm elections shows inflation at a 3.7 annual rate. In September, increasing chances of another Federal

Reserve hike before the end of the year.

Inflation came in worse than expected, due in large part to rising energy prices. Gas prices rose more than nine percent last month and are now 34

percent higher than they were last year. But it wasn't just gas, with price pressures extending well beyond that. In the U.S., the report shows

inflation rising faster than wages for the sixth straight month, contributing to discontent felt by many Americans. Moody's Analytics says

the average American household is paying $2,000 in additional costs due to the Iran war.

In addition to the inflation data, tech stocks came under pressure amid new fears about A.I. growth. Shares of NVIDIA-backed A.I. cloud firm CoreWeave

tumbled more than 15 percent on concerns over rising borrowing costs. Shares of Dell HP and other data center-related firms fell sharply on

concerns about demand. Chip stocks also sold off.

Joining us now, Paul La Monica, senior markets writer for Barron's Magazine. So, Paul, I mean, hot inflation report, a lot of it's fuel, but

it wasn't only fuel and gas prices. I mean, clearly, the Fed does not have control of this at this point.

PAUL R. LA MONICA, SENIOR MARKETS WRITER, BARRON'S: No, and it's going to increase the odds of a rate hike by the Fed, potentially at its next

meeting at the end of this month, which, of course, is right before the midterm elections. Even if the Fed holds steady then, there's still a very

strong chance that the Fed is just pausing and will raise rates again in December unless we finally start to see inflation cool in future consumer

price index readings. And obviously, the concern about the war in Iran not being over just yet, that's keeping gas prices elevated.

SCIUTTO: The other -- if you dig down in the data, there were other things, higher prices for computer hardware and software. I mean, we're

seeing all the costs of building this A.I. infrastructure working its way into prices.

LA MONICA: Yes. I think that is definitely the case. It's a problem for consumers and more troubling now for investors as well because Wall Street

is starting to worry about the health of some of the companies that are part of this A.I. food chain. You mentioned CoreWeave, that stock falling

15 percent today because of rising worries about the yields on its bonds spiking. It's a sign that investors are nervous that it will be able to pay

its debts. Chip stocks led by NVIDIA down for seven straight days. They were the darlings of the A.I. trade. Now, all of a sudden, they're being

shunned. Investors are worried whether or not this is just temporary remains to be seen.

But it is obviously a bit of a concern right now, given that before this, it had been mostly bullish about A.I. We all thought that, you know,

companies like NVIDIA, Microsoft, et cetera, were just going to keep going higher and higher.

SCIUTTO: Well, we've seen them pull back before and then immediately go up again. So, we'll see what happens this time. Paul La Monica, thanks so much

for joining.

LA MONICA: Exactly. Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Today's other business headlines, eight U.S. states say they have filed separate consumer protection lawsuits against OpenAI. The states

allege the company falsely advertises ChatGPT as safe for young people. They claim the chat bot is dangerous to vulnerable people such as children

and has coached many users to take their own lives. CNN has reached out to OpenAI for comment.

Bank of America shares fell more than four and a half percent after it reported weaker than expected third quarter results. The bank disclosed a

$1.2 billion fine by U.S. officials for failing to flag suspicious transactions. The president of the firm's international activities tells

CNN the company is now working to improve its standards.

Russia's economic envoy says the country's diesel deal with the U.S. will go ahead despite facing, quote, "execution issues." Kirill Dmitriev says

Russia is ready to work with Americans to make sure the fuel makes its way to the U.S. He accused Europe of hypocrisy over its criticism of the

agreement.

Coming up after the break, here on "The Brief," one of the tightest races in the U.S. midterm elections. The Democrats try to take back a Senate seat

in Texas where the polls say it's now neck and neck. We'll take a look coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:30:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back to "The Brief." I'm Jim Sciutto. And here are the international headlines we're watching today.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says he feels betrayed by U.S. President Trump's deal to buy Russian diesel. Zelenskyy made the comment

after meeting in London with the British Prime Minister, Andy Burnham, and with King Charles. He told interviewer Piers Morgan that Trump's deal was a

victory for the Kremlin.

Pope Leo thanked fellow Catholics for their prayers after getting surgery in Rome. It's his first public message since he was diagnosed with a common

type of lung cancer on Tuesday. Doctors say his recovery is proceeding as expected.

A federal judge is ordering the Trump administration to allow CNN, MS NOW, and Politico to access the White House while their ongoing lawsuit plays

out. The judge says banning access likely violated the First Amendment. With evidence suggesting the outlets were targeted in retaliation purely

for their coverage. The Justice Department filed a notice of appeal while its antitrust division is probing five major TV networks over how the White

House TV pool operates.

Trump administration is now threatening election officials in California with legal action if they do not review a list of alleged non-citizens on

the Los Angeles voter rolls. This according to letters obtained by CNN which give the officials two days to comply. It's the latest step in a

government-wide push to find voter fraud and of course recent pushes showed it is very minuscule. He's made baseless claims the president of widespread

cheating in elections regardless. This all comes with just 20 days to go before the midterms.

One of the most interesting contexts to watch U.S. Senate race in Texas. Two new polls reveal no clear leader between the Democrat James Talarico

and Republican Ken Paxton. The last time a Texas Democrat was elected to the U.S. Senate was back in 1988. In less than 90 minutes, CNN will host a

primetime town hall with Talarico in Fort Worth.

Joining me now, Margaret Talev, senior contributor at Axios and director of the Syracuse University Institute for Democracy, Journalism, and Censorship

-- sorry, Citizenship. Thanks so much for joining.

MARGARET TALEV, SENIOR CONTRIBUTOR, AXIOS: Hey, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Very much the opposite of your role, although you have to fight censorship these days. Margaret, you follow these elections very closely

and you've covered your share of elections. And you've covered your share of elections with polling that proved out to be way off.

[18:35:00]

When you speak to folks on the inside of Democratic and Republican campaigns, where do they see these midterms going?

TALEV: Yes, I mean, I think on both sides of the aisle, what you're seeing experts, analysts, campaign strategists, what they're seeing are two

things. Number one, they're seeing sort of the aggregate trend lines moving in Democrats' favor. The wind is more beneath Democrats' wings or it's more

against President Trump and therefore the Republican Party.

But on the other hand, there are real questions about not just methodology, but how narrow the margins of error are in some of these races and also the

modeling. You know, it's based on assumptions about who is going to turn out. If those assumptions are wrong, if Republicans are disproportionately

unlikely to respond to surveys, then the polls can, you know, be off just enough to make a difference.

So, most strategists on both sides of the aisle think that Democrats are very well poised to take back control of the House of Representatives, but

that the Senate is up for grabs. And in Texas, just as you mentioned, there are like a few new polls out today that on paper maybe show the Democrat,

Talarico, go ahead. But it's by such a small amount. It doesn't mean anything. You can't take it to the bank. What it effectively means is that

the races appear tied.

SCIUTTO: OK. What's going to happen before the election and during the election? We don't know. After the election, though, there are lots of

signs of what this administration might do to challenge results. And you have the Justice Department today threatening legal action in California.

In last election, officials basically confirmed that the people who are registered voters are actually U.S. citizens. And you and I know that

they've looked at this a million times over and found only minuscule numbers of noncitizens on voter rolls. Is this a sign that this

administration, whatever the results, is going to say rigged election? We're not going to see you, Congressman, or I mean, you can imagine.

TALEV: Look, I think it's a legitimate question just because we all live through January 6th, right. We all remember what happened there. But it

certainly seems like at a minimum, the administration is trying to pressure test every election official and every governor in every state in red

states, as well as blue states, but particularly in blue states.

And in the case of California, as you mentioned, they're asking the elections leaders both statewide in L.A. County to literally open up a

thumb drive, take a look around and sequester all these voters or potentially registered voters that the federal government has flagged.

Elections are run by states, not by the federal government. It's not clear at all legally that the federal government, especially within this close to

an election, has any jurisdiction over this. But they are trying to scare and pressure, threaten prosecution. They have literally made threats about

prosecuting elections officials, if any non-citizen voters are determined to exist in all 50 states. And there have been efforts in more than half of

the states, almost all unsuccessful at this point, to try to get those states to turn over voter registration data that is non-public to the

federal government.

So, we don't know yet what this procedure is about after the election. But we do know that right up until Election Day, this administration is

determined to pressure, try to make states blink, try to get them to comport in some way.

SCIUTTO: Well, we know you'll be watching it closely both before and after. Margaret Talev, thanks so much for joining.

TALEV: Thank you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: One last reminder, join us for the CNN Jubilee Media Town Hall with James Talarico. That begins at 8:00 p.m. Eastern time, 1:00 a.m. in

London.

Just ahead on "The Brief," a new book takes a hard look at an unsolved murder from more than 40 years ago and what it says about the Middle East

then and today. I'm going to speak to the author just after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:40:00]

SCIUTTO: This year's winner of the Nobel Peace Prize is speaking out about Israel's war in Gaza. Navi Pillay is a human rights pioneer and lawyer from

South Africa. Pillay participated in the anti-apartheid movement and later served as a judge on the International Criminal Tribunal for Rwanda. She

recently led the U.N. commission that found Israel is committing genocide against Palestinians in Gaza. Israel has strongly denied the allegations in

that commission's report.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NAVI PILLAY, NOBEL PEACE PRIZE RECIPIENT: As a longtime judge, I'm not surprised when defendants deny the charges against them. I point to the

work we did. It's a two-year examination of evidence. We received the support of organs inside the United Nations, including satellite footage.

We had our own team. And refreshingly, the evidence came from inside Israel where NGOs have been blocked by the government from cooperating with us and

with the international court.

So, first, I can tell you that we verified the facts. And we stand by this finding that genocide has occurred and is occurring. And until a court of

law, that's the International Court of Justice, pronounces on this matter, ours is the most authoritative statement on this.

So, compared to that work, any state that's named there should immediately investigate these charges. Of course, they didn't let anyone in to examine,

to investigate. They didn't let us in. They didn't let international journalists. But now they have a comprehensive report. They should now look

towards carrying out investigations and prosecutions themselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: The Nobel Peace Prize laureate speaking there. Well, now, to an unsolved murder from more than four decades ago and what it teaches us

about the Middle East today. In 1984, two gunmen assassinated the president of the American University of Beirut. Malcolm Kerr had been born and raised

in the city. His murder might have been lost among a number of horrific crimes in Lebanon in the 1980s, but it has meaning.

My next guest is the author of "The Best Kind of American," which tackles the mystery of Kerr's death and the story it tells about the region today.

Kim Ghattas is an Emmy Award winning journalist, contributing editor for the Financial Times, and she joins me now here. So, good to have you.

KIM GHATTAS, AUTHOR, "THE BEST KIND OF AMERICAN": Thanks for having me, Jim.

SCIUTTO: So, I had heard about this story because he's the father of the famous coach of the Golden State Warriors, right? But it brings you back to

a time 40 years ago that seems like a different time, but is actually quite familiar to today.

GHATTAS: It is, unfortunately.

SCIUTTO: And you have a great line in the book. In the new West Beirut, there was no room for high profile bridge builders, especially not

Americans who offered such a contrast to the image that Hezbollah and Islamic Amal painted of the enemy. That was his problem, was he was a

bridge builder.

GHATTAS: You know, Jim, when you try to explain the Middle East to a general audience, to your viewers, to readers out there, you want to break

it down to, you know, accessible stories.

[18:45:00]

And the best way to tell a story that is a geopolitical tragedy that we've been living through since the '80s up until today is to tell a human story,

which is also a human tragedy, and that is the assassination of a man who loved Lebanon so much, spoke the language, was born there. Three of his

children were born there, including Steve himself, to try to elucidate the why, because the Kerr family actually had a lot of information already

about the who.

And they went to trial in the '90s, and they sued the Islamic Republic of Iran and won, although there was no one in the courtroom. And Iran was put

on trial as a state sponsor of terrorism in absentia, if you will. But the why of why he had been killed is what I try to elucidate further in the

book.

And, yes, it is because he did not fit the image that America's enemies wanted to paint of America as the enemy. But there were many other

mysteries and events that led to his murder, which readers will discover, thanks to my research.

SCIUTTO: Bigger picture, just for a moment, given the events there today. And, of course, you experienced firsthand the war in Lebanon just in recent

weeks and months, you know --

GHATTAS: I lived in Beirut, yes.

SCIUTTO: There you go. A very dangerous place to live.

GHATTAS: Well, Beirut is a good place to live. Lebanon is still -- you know, it's not just the headlines that we see.

SCIUTTO: Perhaps South Beirut.

GHATTAS: South Lebanon.

SCIUTTO: South Beirut in the midst of the --

GHATTAS: Absolutely.

SCIUTTO: Is it any safer for bridge builders today?

GHATTAS: That's a great question. That's a great question. I think that, unfortunately, it is both just as dangerous sometimes because we've had

many more assassinations after Malcolm Kerr's assassination in the 1980s. Friends of mine have been assassinated, including a great intellectual,

Samir Kassir, assassinated by proxies of Damascus at the time under the Assad regime and of Iran.

But it is also now that we need bridge builders more than ever, from Israel to Iran, from Beirut to Damascus and all the way to America, to try to

understand why we are still living through this vortex of violence, which, as my research shows, really started in Lebanon in the 1980s.

SCIUTTO: I mean, you make the connection between Iran, Syria, Hezbollah and Lebanon going back to the '80s. I mean, it's changed, though, right, in

part as a result of the war in the last couple of years and that Syria is no longer led by the old rulers.

GHATTAS: Absolutely.

SCIUTTO: Iran is still quite powerful, but arguably weaker. Hezbollah, arguably weaker as well. I mean, is that triad, is it any weaker and less

capable of causing the kind of divisions and attacks?

GHATTAS: I think the Iranians are still very much capable of causing damage in the region, and we're seeing the economic impact on Saudi Arabia

with their proxy militias of the Iranians. The Houthis now in Yemen launching attacks against Saudi Arabia because Hezbollah has been so

weakened.

What I try to show with my writing and my research is how the Israeli invasion of Lebanon in 1982 triggered a lot of the events that we're seeing

unfold today, because unnoticed at the time, as soon as the Israelis drove into Lebanon with their tanks, the Islamic Republic sent revolutionary

guards to Syria and on to Lebanon to begin the fight against Israel and then America, because the Marines also show up in Beirut, and America

becomes a target in the Middle East of violent bombings for the first time. That's in Beirut.

SCIUTTO: Yes, those Marine barracks. But I mean, the question is, has anybody learned lessons, right? Here is the U.S. That was in the '80s. I

mean, you had two wars in the 2000s leading into the 2010s in Iraq and Afghanistan. Now, you have another war in Iran. You talk about the Israeli

occupation of Lebanon. I mean, look at the pictures. You know better than me.

GHATTAS: Absolutely. Southern Lebanon --

SCIUTTO: Southern Lebanon, it's just been raised. Have we learned anything?

GHATTAS: Some people have learned lessons. Others are not. Some people are still trying to continue what they started in the 1980s. And we've heard

the Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, after the assassination of the supreme leader of Iran, Ayatollah Khamenei, in February, say this is a

war I've dreamt of for 40 years, right?

SCIUTTO: Yes.

GHATTAS: And then in Iran, the man leading the negotiations and dictating the terms of the war against America and the region, because Iran's

neighbors are being targeted, is one of the people who led that first contingent of Iranian Revolutionary Guards to Lebanon in 1982. Some of the

same actors, some of the same dynamics.

Iran, over the last four decades, had learned that if you push back against America, if you attack America, America will eventually cut its losses and

run and fold. And now, they're suddenly facing with a president who, not so much out of strategy but perhaps more out of ego, is not backing down. And

I think what we need to pay attention to is the upcoming few weeks with the Israeli election, the midterms in the United States. It's not only Israelis

who are going to the polls or Americans who are going to the polls. The Iranians are going to have a vote as well. And this is a very volatile

moment.

SCIUTTO: Well, the book is "The Best Kind of American." The author is Kim Ghattas. Appreciate having you on.

[18:50:00]

GHATTAS: Great to be here.

SCIUTTO: And still to come just after the break, the top matches from an action-packed day in the UEFA Champions League.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Incredible action today in the UEFA Champions League with Paris Saint-Germain trouncing Manchester City 4-2. Don Riddell was watching. Man

City didn't come out on top.

DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT: No, they didn't. They started the game quite well. Remember, Manchester City are playing under a cloud of controversy

these days after the Premier League released its findings of its investigation just over a week ago where they decided and found that City

were guilty of more than 100 breaches of their financial regulations.

This was the first time that Manchester City had been at home since then and they ran into the back-to-back European champions Paris Saint-Germain

who just absolutely took them to the cleaners in the first half. That's Desire Doue scoring for the PSG lead and then just a couple of minutes

later, Ousmane Dembele made it 2-nil. And by half-time, the Parisians were 3-nil up. A lovely touch here to set up Vitinha. And this just was an

absolute nightmare for Manchester City.

Now, they did much better in the second half. Erling Haaland scored a couple of goals. That's Pep Guardiola, their former manager there, looking

absolutely shell-shocked at half-time. But in the end, City lost this game by four goals to two. So, very, very disappointing for them.

And these are just such strange times for this club because we don't know how this Premier League investigation is going to play out. Well, we know

how the investigation will play out. We don't know what the consequences or the penalties are going to be. So, the future is very uncertain. Here's the

response from City after the game.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ENZO MARESCA, MANCHESTER CITY MANAGER: We started quite good until the first goal. We conceded the first goal. And then we conceded the second one

after one minute. And probably that created a little bit of a bad feeling. So, in the first half, we struggled. And in the second half, I think we

were much, much, much better. And probably we deserve even something more.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What were you thinking when you're 3-nil down, just 30 minutes into the game, up against one of the best teams in the world?

It's already a tough task, made even tougher with that score line. What wasn't working?

MARESCA: No, it was -- yes, it was a bit strange, to be honest. Because, again, I think until the first goal, we started quite good. We were in the

game. We created something. We didn't concede nothing. Then we conceded the first one. And after one minute, I think two minutes, we conceded the

second one. So, as you said, it's already difficult. But then when you concede two goals in two minutes, it becomes even worse. But we didn't lose

half-time. We adjusted something. We didn't lose the balance. And I think - - again, I think in the second half, we created enough to deserve something more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[18:55:00]

RIDDELL: He's right. Manchester City did have an awful lot of chances and they just didn't take many of them.

And it was a great night, Jim, of Champions League action across nine games. We had no less than 46 goals. It was a breathless night of

entertainment.

SCIUTTO: Don Riddell, thanks so much. Finally, tonight, Joni Mitchell has finally become a U.S. citizen more than 60 years after leaving her native

Canada. The legendary singer-songwriter made it official at a naturalization ceremony on Tuesday. The 82-year-old posting a picture of

herself holding U.S. flag with the caption, a journey that began 62 years ago. Mitchell was born in Alberta, Canada in 1943. The iconic artist is in

the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, won a Lifetime Achievement Award at the Grammys in 2002. Best known for big '70s hits like "Big Yellow Taxi,"

"Woodstock" and "Amelia."

Well, thanks so much for joining us today. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington. You've been watching "The Brief." Please do stay with CNN.

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[19:00:00]

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