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The Story Is with Elex Michaelson

Minneapolis on Edge After New ICE Shooting; Is ICE Making Cities Less Safe?; SpaceX Capsule on Way Back to Earth from ISS. Tensions in Iran Rise, as U.S. Intervention Seems Likely. President Trump Continues to Push for Control of Greenland. Aired 12-1a ET

Aired January 15, 2026 - 00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[00:00:00]

DANIEL BRUNNER, RETIRED FBI SUPERVISORY SPECIAL AGENT: It's that individual, that agent was feeling threatened and he used his firearm to mitigate the threat, to stop the threat. If he was being attacked with a shovel, his shots were to stop the threat, not to kill him, not to disable him. It was to stop the threat. Once the threat was stopped, then he could stop firing. So, yes, if he was being attacked by a shovel, appropriate action was to discharge his firearm if there was no other recourse.

LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR: Daniel Brunner, Chief Arradondo, thank you so much.

Thank you all out there watching. Elex Michaelson is going to pick up our breaking news coverage out of Minneapolis right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

ELEX MICHAELSON, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Elex Michaelson live in Los Angeles.

We are following multiple breaking stories right now. We begin in Minneapolis, where a federal law enforcement officer shot a person in the leg after that person allegedly resisted arrest and assaulted that officer. The city, of course, still reeling from the fatal shooting of Renee Good by a federal agent one week ago. These are images from the streets tonight.

The Department of Homeland Security says the officer was trying to apprehend a Venezuelan man in the country illegally. That subject allegedly fled the traffic stop, began to resist, and then assaulted the officer. During that struggle, two people came out of a nearby apartment and allegedly attacked the officer.

Police say the suspect got loose, joined the assault. That's when the officer fired what were described as defensive shots, and hit that person in the leg. The officer and the injured man are both in the hospital, and the two other people are in custody.

It's been a wild night on the streets. Let's go live right now to CNN's law enforcement correspondent, Whitney Wild, who is right in the middle of it.

Whitney, what's happening right now?

WHITNEY WILD, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CORRESPONDENT: Well, now the scene is very calm. We've seen most of the law enforcement leave the area. We're right at Lyndale and 22nd in Minneapolis, and we'll take you on a walk down the street here so you can see.

Earlier this was really busy. There was a lot of at least vehicle traffic. We saw lots of protesters here. And I'd like to walk to the end of this block here, Elex, because it was at this general area where earlier we saw multiple tear gas canisters thrown at protesters. At one point, the smoke became so thick that we actually got separated as a team. And there were tear gas canisters detonating all around us.

One hit me, hit my foot, hit my side. One went off right beneath photographer Jonathan Scheer's face, and he was coated in that tear gas liquid here. And so now I just -- I want to come to the end of the street here, Elex, because I want to see what this scene looks like now because it was quite chaotic earlier.

And what you're seeing is fireworks apparently here. That looks like civilian fireworks. I don't see any law enforcement here now, but earlier it was actually hard to tell what was a firecracker, what was rifle, what was the tear gas canister because it was so dark, so smoky, and all you'd see were, as you just saw, like bursts of -- burst of what looked like a firework actually in the air. And then we would later find out that it was tear gas.

The area had been completely coated in tear gas, and now you're still seeing -- sorry, it's pretty slippery. You're still seeing some crowds here, I think. Do you want to walk a little closer? OK, well, hold on, there's a lot of vehicle traffic, so we'll walk a little closer now. Still pretty busy. OK. That was a flashbang, I think. Hold on. What was -- or maybe that was a firework. I can't tell.

Elex, it was, you know, there were dozens and dozens of protesters out here who were really close to law enforcement. They were right up on them screaming in their face. This is a city that has been on edge since the shooting of Renee Good. That was one week ago. This is going to do nothing to calm things down. This is again a city that is already on edge. Protesters very angry, and now we're seeing more protesters here still in the heart of Minneapolis, Elex.

MICHAELSON: Can you describe what it's like to --

WILD: So what you're seeing right now are fireworks. Do you see this? Hold on. These are people waving what looks like the Mexican flag. And then there were a couple fireworks earlier. There's a group down here at the end with a Mexican flag here, Elex.

MICHAELSON: Can you describe what it's like to experience tear gas like you did? What that feels like? What that smells like?

WILD: Well, it's unpleasant.

MICHAELSON: There we go.

WILD: Can you -- all right, so this is, hold on. Wait. We're coming right up on a vehicle that looks like it was torn up.

MICHAELSON: And we apologize for the language.

[00:05:04]

WILD: I don't know what it looked -- can you, can you guys hear that? OK, so it -- this is these are, there's multiple vehicles here that have been completely torn apart here. We are going to try to reach out to more law enforcement to find out exactly, you know, who these vehicles belong to and what's going on. But, sorry, it's a little chaotic.

MICHAELSON: Yes.

WILD: Back, you know, back to the tear gas. It's not pleasant. I mean, it's -- it hangs in your mouth. It's hard to talk. It's hard to breathe. You know, it can make you kind of nauseous. But otherwise, it, you know, it goes away pretty quickly. It's a shocking moment when it comes and hits you right on your foot and on your side. And it's so loud that for a moment, it's hard to hear what's going on around you. And it's certainly hard to see what's going on around you.

But after a few minutes, it goes away and you can talk and breathe and explain what's going on. But again, we're trying to figure out exactly what we're seeing here, Elex. But it's quite a scene here just a couple of blocks from where that shooting happened -- Elex.

MICHAELSON: So sometimes in these scenarios, late at night, it draws people who enjoy the process of agitating. We've seen this in different protests across the country where sometimes late at night, it's not necessarily about the cause, it's more about the anarchy, more about the problems. It certainly sounded like the police chief was frustrated by some of the people that are out there tonight.

Can you describe sort of the crowd, who you're seeing and what's happening now late at night at this point once police have told everybody to go home?

WILD: Well, earlier tonight we heard that, you know, Minneapolis officials consider this an unlawful assembly. Now we see zero law enforcement anywhere. And it's mostly people walking among vehicles that are driving down the street. We spoke with one woman who used to live in this neighborhood. Doesn't anymore. And, you know, multiple people who came out to tell us that they felt like it was important to be part of the protest, be part of making their voice heard.

But right now, this does not look much like a protest. It is more like people congregating in an area just a couple of blocks from where that shooting happened -- Elex.

MICHAELSON: Whitney Wild, thank you for your reporting not only tonight, but in the last few weeks on this. And we appreciate you and hope you're able to stay safe. And we'll get back to you if needed. Meanwhile, Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey, he's been vocal about the

presence of federal officers in the city. Just a short time ago he asked residents to go home.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR JACOB FREY (D), MINNEAPOLIS, MINNESOTA: This is not creating safety. It's certainly not creating safety when a huge percentage of the shootings that have taken place so far this year in Minneapolis have been by ICE. So let's be very clear. I've seen conduct from ICE that is disgusting and is intolerable. If it were your city, it would be unacceptable there, too. And for anyone that is taking the bait tonight, stop. That is not helpful. Go home. We cannot counter Donald Trump's chaos with our own brand of chaos.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAELSON: Jacob Frey, the mayor of Minneapolis, in the last half hour.

Joining me now from Minneapolis is Jason DeRusha, a journalist radio host there, longtime TV anchor.

You speak to the people every single day. Give us a sense of the feeling of the folks in Minneapolis tonight.

JASON DERUSHA, JOURNALIST AND RADIO HOST: You know, I will be fascinated to see if there's a different response to this shooting. But to have two shootings involving ICE agents within one week is just not sustainable. Our city cannot handle that on an emotional level. Our law enforcement can't handle that as far as responding to the volume, the sheer volume of calls.

And Elex, you have to look at this situation and say, OK, if the federal government is going to send in 3,000 agents to do immigration enforcement in a medium sized city, you know, where's the crowd control, people who are trained in that? Where is the investigators? I mean, what are we doing here? I think this is the sort of bubbling over frustration.

Now where I wonder if it's going to be different is, look, it is very different if you have a law enforcement officer who is pursuing a suspect, a car chase. Now, we never know. Do you believe the version from the federal government or not? There has not been a ton of disclosure. But, you know, we're talking like a broomstick attack, a shovel. This is Minnesota.

[00:10:01]

Everybody has got the winter shovel ready to go. But you can picture that -- you can picture the -- I keep it in the house. You never know, Elex. There's a lot of snow.

MICHAELSON: Yes. Yes.

DERUSHA: But picture the chaos. This is -- MICHAELSON: Not as big of an issue in Southern California. Yes.

DERUSHA: You know, I know, it's a little different for you, but you have to be realistic, right? OK. You can believe in the cause. You can believe that ICE shouldn't be in your community. And you can also remember that these ICE agents often live in our community. And so to have these ICE agents, maybe tonight they were going after someone who really was one of the violent people that we want off our streets, but there's just no trust.

And so what is the end game of this? How does this continue moving forward because we as a city and as a community can't do this night after night.

MICHAELSON: Yes. And to your point, we have not seen any video of this altercation. And we know sometimes video even can be deceiving depending on the camera angle.

DERUSHA: Right. Yes.

MICHAELSON: To know exactly what happened. If the story that Homeland Security is saying proves to be true after an investigation, you certainly understand how the officer could be fearing for his life. And in this situation, that officer did not necessarily even shoot to kill. He just shot in the leg to, you know, get out of that situation. So it is a different situation here. But as we see in the streets sometimes nuance is not a big thing on social media and not a big thing when it comes to mobs.

DERUSHA: Right. Yes. Well, and I'll also say that I've never had a law enforcement officer tell me about a defensive shot. I'm not familiar with that particular move in the training manual. Right? I mean, so, I mean, I'm glad it was a defensive shot, you know, whatever that is. But, there are going to be a lot of questions about this. And the reality is, as you astutely point out, people see what they want to see.

They hear what they want to hear. They're going to drive this event once again. Part of the frustration for many of us in Minnesota is that this now becomes another talking point. Oh, the mobs are attacking ICE agents. Oh, they're shooting fireworks off. They're all of this, on and on and on. And the reality is, we as a community, yes, I think we all around America agree that if there are dangerous people on our streets, we want them locked up.

And if those people should not be in our country, we want them out of our country. But this sort of mayhem in our streets, I was driving around part of Saint Paul today to go to my favorite Mexican owned grocery store. Well, American owned. It's a third generation, owned by a couple of unbelievable women. And it was practically a ghost town because employees are afraid to show up, American citizen employees, and customers are afraid to show up as well.

So this is hurting our economy. It's hurting our psyche. And people are getting hurt. And so what is the plan? And to the leaders, what are you guys doing, right? Could we get some -- could we get a governor, a mayor, a president, a secretary of Homeland Security in a room or on a phone and try to figure out what is the path forward besides the legal route that's being pursued?

MICHAELSON: Yes, there has certainly not been very much of that bipartisan negotiation in terms of this. Both sides seem to be ramping up the writer at not bringing it down.

Jason DeRusha, one of the leading voices in Minneapolis. Appreciate you taking time for us tonight. Thank you so much.

DERUSHA: Thanks, Elex.

MICHAELSON: And so with all this breaking news, clearly the issue of immigration, once again, top of mind. Up next, we're going to debate that live with our political panel. Brian Tyler Cohen on the left, Katie Zacharia on the right. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[00:18:11]

MICHAELSON: We continue to follow the breaking news out of Minneapolis, Governor Tim Walz just shared this statement on X. "State investigators have been on the scene in North Minneapolis. I know you're angry. I'm angry. What Donald Trump wants is violence in the streets. But Minnesota will remain an island of decency, of justice, of community and of peace. Don't give him what he wants."

The Department of Homeland Security says that a federal officer shot defensively and wounded a Venezuelan man who attacked him. That man shot in the leg. He is said to be in the country illegally.

Protesters have been facing off with law enforcement on the streets all night. The mayor is telling them, quote, "don't take the bait, go home," and to not counter what he called President Trump's chaos with more chaos.

Now, this new incident happens as a CNN poll shows that Americans surveyed are critical of the conduct of ICE agents in last week's shooting of Renee Good. 56 percent of respondents called the force used in the shooting an inappropriate use of force. 26 percent believe it was appropriate, 18 percent say they haven't heard enough to say. The poll also reported that 51 percent of respondents said ICE actions are making cities less safe, 31 percent said ICE is making cities safer, 18 percent said those actions didn't have much of an effect either way.

Clearly, 18 percent is not really following the news.

Let's talk immigration now with our political panel. On the left, Brian Tyler Cohen, who hosts the podcast "No Lie with Brian Tyler Cohen," averages over 200 million views a month on YouTube. And on the right, making her debut on THE STORY IS, legal and political strategist Katie Zacharia.

Welcome to you both. Thank you so much. Welcome, Katie. Good to have you here for the first time. Ladies

first. Let's start with you. What do you think, is ICE making cities safer or less safe?

[00:20:05]

KATIE ZACHARIA, LEGAL AND POLITICAL STRATEGIST: I disagree with those people on the poll that say it's making it less safe. I emphatically and completely think that ICE is making our city safer. What makes them dangerous and the presence of ICE is the violent rhetoric against the ICE agents. Democrat leadership, spurring them on to go get out in the streets and fight them, calling ICE agents the Gestapo. That's Tim Walz said that about the ICE agents.

That instills fear in people to go fight immigration officers that are doing their job. Let's backtrack. They wouldn't have to be doing this job had the border been sealed in the first place and proper immigration and border regulation were in place during the Biden and Kamala years.

MICHAELSON: What do you think? Less safe, more safe?

BRIAN TYLER COHEN, HOST, "NO LIE WITH BRIAN TYLER COHEN" PODCAST: I think that it's not necessarily the rhetoric that's making us less safe. I think it's the fact that you have these inept, unqualified ICE agents who are shooting unarmed moms three times in the face because they wouldn't stop their car.

I mean, it's just -- it's crazy to think that the rhetoric -- we heard from Jacob Frey, who is the mayor of Minneapolis, and he was saying, we were a community of peace. Don't take the bait because we know that Donald Trump wants nothing more than to be a wartime president. And if he can't get it in Venezuela, if he can't get it in Panama, if he can't get it in Greenland, then he's going to send the military into American cities.

He's trying to do it in the city that we're in right now, Los Angeles. He's tried to do it in Portland, tried to do it in Chicago, tried to do it in Washington, D.C. Anywhere where he can incite violence so he can feel like a wartime president, so he can justify these troop deployments he's going to do. And this is just one more iteration of exactly that.

MICHAELSON: Katie, you're shaking your head.

ZACHARIA: Yes, I'm shaking my head. A, Renee Good drove into an officer with a car, which is a lethal use of force.

COHEN: That is -- that's absolutely untrue.

ZACHARIA: And when you use a lethal --

COHEN: It's, you know --

ZACHARIA: Use of force.

(CROSSTALK)

COHEN: The sad part about that is that --

MICHAELSON: She drove her car. She hit the officer. It's, I think, debatable whether she was trying to hit the officer, but she did drive her car and the officer appeared to be hit from at least some of the camera angles.

COHEN: The sad part about that is that everybody can see with their own eyes, and so we can tell after having watched that footage, you know, there were multiple gunshots where the officer and according to "The New York Times" analysis of this, where we can all see, again clear as day, that these gunshots went in her side mirror, in her side window. Her window was open. So there is no reason why this officer should have been using lethal force.

We already know, by the way, that the officer should not have positioned himself in front of this car. But beyond all of that, when we hear from the right this idea that they're going to rewrite history and tell us not to believe our own lying eyes, it puts on full display the extent to which this is all being done in bad faith, all being done to justify this undue force.

MICHAELSON: Katie.

ZACHARIA: Lying eyes is watching an officer walk around the car and having Renee Good drive into him after he had already been dragged by another car six months earlier. And it is justifiable self-defense. A car can be a lethal weapon when used as such.

COHEN: Right. When used as such, and that's not how he was using it.

ZACHARIA: That is.

COHEN: And if this officer --

(CROSSTALK)

MICHAELSON: Let her finish her point, Brian.

ZACHARIA: And he used justifiable retaliatory lethal force against a woman who drove into him, and that is an -- you're saying that's, don't believe your lying eyes. I'm saying they're asking us to not believe our lying eyes in defense of the ICE agent. And again, I go back to my original point. ICE would not have to be there had the Biden-Harris administration followed the law, had they enforced border immigration in the first place.

No country, no sovereign country can exist without border regulation. We had over 10 million border encounters during Biden and Harris. That's just border encounters, likely 17 million or more illegal immigrants, people that came in unchecked. And as again, as a mom, if I'm Renee Good and I have ICE telling me to get out of my car, I'm going to get out of my car. I am not going to put my kids at risk, leave the motherless, and let -- and hit an ICE agent and create chaos. I think that is so irresponsible. And I'm in much disagreement with you.

MICHAELSON: But to the point about, could there be more done to not create these situations? Because federal immigration enforcement wants to work with a lot of these Democratic officials in sanctuary cities and say, let us honor ICE detainers. Let us go into the prisons. Let us work with you so we can target the worst people and not have to go into the streets. But in a lot of cases, a lot of these cities, Minneapolis, Los Angeles, others are saying, no, we won't work with you at all. I mean, could that create a situation where there's -- we have a more safe situation?

COHEN: The reality is that nothing justifies the force that we're seeing right now at the hands of these ICE agents. Look, I mean, if you're asking whether it would be easier if everybody just kind of laid down and allowed ICE to infiltrate the cities and do whatever they want to do, of course. But that's not what ICE is looking to do. ICE is looking to incite as much violence, as much pandemonium as they can, so that they can use that as justification to ramp up their operations.

[00:25:05]

We know that these people, again, Donald Trump wants nothing more than to be a wartime president. Greg Bovino wants nothing more than to ramp up these operations. They revel in the violence, the chaos, the dysfunction that they're creating right now. There is no de-escalation happening in any of these cities. There was no de-escalation happening in L.A., in Portland, in Chicago, in D.C., and there's not de- escalation happening here as you see the images beside me on the screen in Minneapolis.

MICHAELSON: I mean, do you think, Katie, that, what do you say to the argument that chaos is the point, that really what Stephen Miller and folks in the Trump administration want is for people to self-deport? And so having these images of ICE looking scary is kind of the point, so that it encourages people to get out on their own, which is actually cheaper.

ZACHARIA: Yes. They want self-deportation. If they didn't have to send ICE in or go into any of these cities, I don't believe that they would if everyone decided to self-deport. And I want to give a hypothetical scenario to your point. If Democrat mayors, and Muriel Bowser in Washington, D.C. actually really paired up in support of the National Guard to bring crime down in our city, now I know that's different from ICE, but she said we're going to support the Trump administration because I care about my city and I want crime to go down.

If, for instance, Karen Bass said, we want to see ICE -- we want to see less ICE and so therefore I'm going to encourage people to self- deport, I'm going to encourage people to listen to the authorities, to listen to the federal authorities that are here and in complete agreement and with the support of the Supremacy Clause of the Constitution based on federal law, I'm going to support this and encourage these people to exit on their own, because they shouldn't have been here in the first place. That would deescalate. If we had Tim Walz not calling them the Gestapo, that would de-

escalate a situation. If they knew they didn't have to go into this marijuana farm right up the road in California and not have people coming after them, and not be on the defensive. If these people would walk out and say, here are our papers or here or not, or I'm going to surrender, I'm here illegally, and are told by Gavin Newsom and Karen Bass and other governors, this would de-escalate the situation.

COHEN: First of all, if you don't want to be called the Gestapo, do not shoot unarmed moms of three in their cars. Second of all, if this is really about crime, how do you -- how do you -- how does that answer the question of native born populations commit crimes at higher rates than immigrant populations? If this is truly about crime.

ZACHARIA: National Guard is in Chicago for what? Did he say I want the National Guard in Chicago to -- only for illegal immigrants? No. Why did the National Guard go to Washington, D.C.? Why? Because it is -- it was a dangerous city that was not being run well. And it had --

COHEN: We're not talking about that, though. If you're sending ICE --

ZACHARIA: And homicide rates --

COHEN: If you're sending ICE into Minneapolis right now --

ZACHARIA: Homicide rates and gun violence rates are down across the country because of these deportations and --

COHEN: Because of these deportations. Again, again, immigrant populations commit crimes at lower rates than native born population. So again, the question remains, if this is actually about crime, how do you answer for the fact that it's -- that it's not immigrants who are committing crimes at higher rates than native born Americans?

MICHAELSON: Last word because we're out of time. Go ahead, Katie.

ZACHARIA: Immigrants, illegal immigrants, and native population. Three different categories. You are lumping in illegal immigrants and regular immigrants, which I don't think is a fair combination.

MICHAELSON: All right.

COHEN: Undocumented immigrants and immigrants who are documented both commit crimes at lower rates than native born Americans.

MICHAELSON: Although there's some on the right who would say being here in the first place is a crime if you don't have papers. But that's a whole other debate.

Katie, Brian, thank you both for this debate. We appreciate it. It's the one that a lot of people are having, and we appreciate being able to do so in a civil way right now. That's the only way we're going to get through this is we actually talk to each other.

In the coming hours, we're going to be closely following the return of the SpaceX Crew 11 as they make their way back to earth, right here in Southern California. Stay with CNN for more on why NASA is bringing them home earlier than planned. We've got an astronaut who helped design the capsule that they're coming back in to join us live next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[00:30:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MICHAELSON: Happening right now, a SpaceX capsule is on its way back to Earth from the International Space Station. We are about three and a half hours away from expected splashdown in the Pacific Ocean for Crew-11. It's supposed to happen probably off the coast around Long Beach. NASA is bringing the team home because of a health concern for one of the crew members.

The space agency says that unidentified crew member is in stable condition and well cared for. The capsule is carrying an American commander and pilot, along with mission specialists from Japan and Russia. One American and two Russians will remain on board the space station.

Joining me now here live in studio is Garrett Reisman, professor of astronomical engineering at USC, a former NASA astronaut who helped to design the capsule at SpaceX with Elon Musk and the crew there that they're actually flying in right now. You're like the best person to talk about this stuff, so thank you so much for coming in. So, you've been up in the ISS, talk about what they could treat there and what they might not be able to treat there.

GARRETT REISMAN, PROFESSOR OF ASTRONAUTICAL ENGINEERING, USC: Well, I think the first important thing they recognize is the fact that you may or may not have a doctor. So like on my first mission, we didn't have a doctor. We had a veterinarian, which is like the closest we had.

(LAUGHTER)

REISMAN: And that was okay.

[00:35:00]

It was a little weird for him because he wasn't used to having patients that talk back. But we made it work. And most of the time you don't have a doctor. So, when I was on the ISS, there was no physician up there, so they trained me as a crew medical officer, and basically you get the same training as like an EMT, a paramedic, and you have about the same kind of equipment. So, the equipment you have up on board the ISS is roughly what you would have in the back of the ambulance.

So, you don't have an MRI, you don't have a CT scan, you don't have even an X-ray machine. We have ultrasound, and that's really some of the only imaging we can do. And so you're pretty limited. So, if you run into a serious medical problem, you know, all you have is a paramedic. and so you might have to come home. And that's exactly what's happening tonight.

MICHAELSON: And so interestingly there is the ability to come home immediately, which they didn't take. So this was not such an emergency that they felt like we have to get them out right now. So they waited about a week, right, or so to get -- get ready to leave?

REISMAN: That's right. So, it's not something that is that pressing. We train all the time for emergencies like a fire, a depressurization, we have a hole in the space station or a release of toxic atmosphere, we have to go now. And you just have to get into that rescue vehicle and go home. That was not the case here. They had time.

MICHAELSON: So right now they're -- they're falling, right?

REISMAN: Yeah.

(LAUGHTER)

MICHAELSON: And then going to go through the reentry process, something you've been through. Describe what reentry is like as a healthy person who's in the best shape of your life.

REISMAN: Right. So, we don't know what's wrong with this crew member, and it may be problematic. What they're about to go through is not a kind of a very gentle ride. It was for me because I came home in the space shuttle and that is much more gentlemanly. You come home just like riding in an airplane and you don't pull more than about 1.4 Gs. So it's like, it's pretty smooth. It's like -- It's like -- It's like a good day on Southwest Airlines.

(LAUGHTER)

REISMAN: It's not bad --

MICHAELSON: A little bit more expensive flight, though. Yeah? And no peanuts. Yeah.

REISMAN: And no overhead space, but --

MICHAELSON: Right.

REISMAN: But on -- But on the drag-in (ph), it's different. It's a capsule. Okay? So, when they first hit that atmosphere, they're going to hit a G spike of about five and a half. So they'll pull 5.5 Gs that you'll feel like you weigh five and a half times what you really do when that happens. That's pretty uncomfortable. And especially if there's something wrong with you, depending on what's wrong with you, that could be really a problem. And then the -- then there's shock events as the --

MICHAELSON: And that's inside the capsule that we're looking at a picture, at least a previous version of the capsule.

REISMAN: That is a previous --

MICHAELSON: That you had mocked up. Yeah. REISMAN: That was kind of a -- Yeah, that was a very early --

MICHAELSON: An early version.

REISMAN: -- prototype that, I think you got to see, actually (ph).

MICHAELSON: Yes. Yeah, I was out there with you that night. I think that was back in 2014. But talk about the capsule, because you helped to design where they are right now. What's it like inside there?

REISMAN: Well, the whole entry process is very automated. There's only a limited amount of control that the crew has over the trajectory that is following as it comes down. And like I said, it does -- it is pretty violent. You get that big 5.5 G spike. Then later you're going to have the parachutes come out. When the parachutes come out, it really yanks on it and then it swings around, and then splashdown is also, it's kind of like a car crash. So you have to go through all that, and if you -- We don't know what's wrong with this astronaut, but if it's a broken rib or something like that, this could be a very memorable night.

MICHAELSON: Yep. Well, it is going to be a memorable night and we're going to be here all night to document it with a special four hour edition of The Story Is tonight. You're going to stick with us for part of the night as well. We've got a whole bunch of experts. We're going to be carrying this whole thing live. Touchdown is supposed to happen around 12:40 a.m. Pacific Time. So Garrett, thank you. We'll see you in the next hour with more on this.

We're also keeping track of turmoil in Iran tonight after the government there closed its airspace and insisted claims of violence against protesters are being inflated. We'll talk to one of our region's leading experts live to get some insight on what's happening and what the U.S. might do in terms of military action. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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MICHAELSON: We are following breaking news on multiple continents tonight, including in Iran, where some domestic flights have just resumed. The skies over Iran were empty just a few hours ago after the government closed down its airspace for hours. The U.S. and a number of European countries are urging their citizens to get out of Iran. This comes weeks into its deadly crackdown on anti government protest.

President Donald Trump has refused to rule out military action, but seems to be softening his tone, depending on the day as we know it. This kind of sends a lot of different messages here. A day after warning Iran against executing protesters, he now claims no executions are taking place, but didn't reveal how he got that information.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD TRUMP, US PRESIDENT: We've been told that the killing in Iran is stopping and it's stopped, and it's stopping, and there's no plan for executions or an execution or executions. So I've been told by (ph) a good authority we'll (ph) find out about it. I'm sure if it happens, we'll all be very upset.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

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MICHAELSON: Meanwhile, Iran's Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps says it has received nearly 400,000 reports of security violations and suspected terrorist activities, leading in some cases to arrests.

A warning: The video you're about to see is disturbing. It's a video posted online which appears to show rows of body bags in Tehran. The U.S. based Human Rights Activist News Agency estimates more than 2,400 protesters have been killed since the start of the crackdown. But Iran's foreign minister insists that figure is exaggerated.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ABBAS ARAGHCHI, IRANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: The exact figure will be announced very soon, perhaps tonight by our authorities.

(UNKNOWN): So you're saying it's less than a thousand people?

ARAGHCHI: No, no, no. Hundreds of people. I certainly, you know, deny the numbers and figures that you have said. It is an exaggeration. It is a misinformation campaign.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MICHAELSON: Dalia Dassa Kaye is the author of Enduring Hostility: The Making of Iran's -- America's Iran Policy. She's also a senior fellow at the UCLA Burkle Center for International Relations. She joins us live here on set. Welcome to The Story Is for the first time.

DALIA DASSA KAYE, SENIOR FELLOW, UCLA BURKLE CENTER FOR INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS: Thank you.

MICHAELSON: So, you have studied the U.S. relationship with Iran. You literally wrote a whole book on it. What's sort of the options for the U.S. right now? Because we've heard President Trump's rhetoric, probably intentionally, all over the map.

DASSA KAYE: Yeah, well, as you say, it's not the first time he's sent mixed messages. We kind of saw this play back in June when the U.S. attacked Iran for the first time in the history of this adversary (ph) relationship. He suggested just days before that attack that maybe a deal would be possible. And then we sent B-2 bombers to destroy three nuclear sites.

So, I think, you know, anything's possible now. I think it's an extremely unpredictable situation, both because of the Internet blackout in Iran and because of the unpredictability of this president.

MICHAELSON: Right. And we saw in Venezuela also sort of mixed messages sent. And then that surprise attack happening in the middle of the night there. In both of those situations they moved in, though, air -- aircraft carriers, right before. That has not happened yet. It could happen. If it did happen, what does that tell us? And the fact it hasn't happened, what does that tell us?

DASSA KAYE: Well, you know, I think, you know, it would be significant and it could change. And there are some initial reports, but it has not been confirmed that that could be happening. But the U.S. does have other assets in the region. We still have tens of thousands of forces. We have cruise missile capabilities. There's lots of other options.

I think we shouldn't get too focused on the operational. I think the bigger question, certainly we know if the U.S. wants to strike Iran, it can. The question is what kind of strike, how extensive.

And most critically, I think we need to be worried about to what end. What are we doing with this force? What are we going to achieve? And what's really not clear is whether military force of any kind, but certainly a limited attack, would be able to actually topple the regime or help the protesters is what the President suggested he wanted to do.

MICHAELSON: I mean, is that what you think, that if they strike, it actually hurts the protesters?

DASSA KAYE: Well, I think it doesn't necessarily help them. I mean, there are other ways to help the protesters beyond military strikes, because strikes could absolutely backfire. And historically this is not a way that you topple regimes. You tend to have to go in with ground forces, and so airstrikes are not likely to.

And of course it will feed into the government's narrative that you just heard in that report, which is they're kind of accusing of any opposition of being a terrorist, which is clearly not the case from the limited information we get out. There are many civilians who are very brave and are being shot down ruthlessly by the government.

So, I do think that there are very big limits to military force. And I think we need to look at other options, like helping Iranians with communication, diplomatic options, economic options. There's a whole menu out there. This rush to military force is a bit worrying.

MICHAELSON: So, you have this book looking at this long term relationship and why it's been so contentious. So, what's a big takeaway from that, from your context here that helps inform the way you think about this current situation?

DASSA KAYE: Well, I think the hostility has built up. I mean, you're talking about a adversary relationship that has now lasted longer than the Cold War between the U.S. and the Soviets. So, we have years and years of -- of grievances against each other. We have very difficult, I think, mindset in terms of being able to talk to Iranians.

We don't have normal diplomatic relations. We haven't -- we've missed opportunities in the past to try to ratchet down tensions and try to help Iranians improve the situation from within. So, I'm not, I'm sorry to say, but I'm not optimistic.

And my years of research have led me to be pretty pessimistic. And I think we're going to have to have a very different mindset, very different leaders both in Iran and in this country, in terms of how we think about this problem to really change moving forward.

MICHAELSON: Yeah, and there are so many Iranian Americans living here in America, --

DASSA KAYE: Absolutely.

MICHAELSON: -- especially in this region as well.

DASSA KAYE: Yes, yeah.

MICHAELSON: Dalia, thank you. Congratulations on the new book.

DASSA KAYE: Thank you so much. Great to be here.

MICHAELSON: We'll be back on a night of three big breaking stories. More of all of them when we come back.

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MICHAELSON: A White House official says the U.S. has completed its first sale of Venezuelan oil. The official says the deal is valued at $500 million, making good on President Trump's plan to tap into the country's oil reserves.

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Energy executives have been skeptical of that strategy, citing legal and commercial hurdles in the way. The same official says more sales are expected in the near future. U.S. Senate has failed to limit President Trump's war powers in Venezuela. Republicans blocked a bipartisan resolution after Vice President JD Vance cast a tie breaking vote on Wednesday. That measure would have forced President Trump to get congressional authorization for any future military action.

Two of the five Republicans who initially backed the resolution flipped at the last minute. That vote happened after the U.S. launched strikes on Venezuela and captured its ousted president, Nicolas Maduro. Some Democrats say they may push similar resolutions on other countries that may be on President Trump's target list.

France will now join a growing number of European countries for joint exercises in Greenland this week. Officials from Denmark and Greenland say there is a, quote, fundamental disagreement with the Trump administration over the future of the Arctic territory. That assessment coming after a constructive meeting with U.S. Vice President JD Vance and Secretary of State Marco Rubio at the White House on Wednesday. Despite the differences, they plan to keep talking to try to find a way forward. CNN's Nic Robertson has that takeaway on the talks from Greenland.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: I think my takeaway at the moment is that the ground hasn't changed in between the two sides here between Denmark, Greenland and the United States, that that gulf of difference as articulated by the Danish Foreign Minister, we've heard from President Trump saying that it would be unacceptable not to have control of Greenland. The Danish position that that's not their -- that's -- that's not their position that Greenland will remain part of Denmark.

That's what they want. That's not going to change. I think in that context nothing has changed. What Lars Lokke Rasmussen, the Danish Foreign Minister, who's a very highly respected diplomat, a tough negotiator, somebody who can well sit in a room with JD Vance and Secretary of State Marco Rubio and have a tough conversation. He is known and respected in diplomatic circles for that.

By his own definition, it was frank, and that they've agreed to set up this talking group, a high level talking group, to talk through some of the issues. He had said going into the meeting that he wanted to take down the tone of the rhetoric, that he wanted to be able to look the other side in the eye and have this conversation.

But the reality is the conversation has been had, the gaps remain. Yes, it's a diplomatic track. Yes, there's some opportunities here, but I think for the residents of Nuuk and across the rest of Greenland, they know this issue hasn't gone away. I think they'll be -- they will be looking to see what President Donald Trump has been to say next about this on Truth Social or wherever he says it.

That will also be a guiding light for them because they are incredibly concerned that the narrative that's coming from the White House that we haven't heard change at all until this moment, is one that leaves, with a great deal of anxiety, living under a threat. And I think that part of the equation hasn't changed.

I think what has been set here is this opportunity for diplomacy. But it was very clear that from the Danish side there, that they weren't able to move the U.S. on their position at all. And I think that also speaks volumes for where the situation remains.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MICHAELSON: Nic Robertson bundled up in Greenland for us tonight. Nic, thank you so much. The U.S. is indefinitely suspending immigrant visa processing for more

than 75 countries. That includes Russia, Somalia, Brazil, Egypt and Haiti. U.S. official says the suspension will begin next Wednesday. The pause only applies to immigrant visas, including those seeking employment in the U.S. It does not apply to student and tourist visas. That means those seeking to travel to the U.S. for the World Cup this summer will not be impacted. A celebration in Bulgaria to chase off evil spirits and bring good

luck for the new year. It's part of a tradition held every January and intended to ensure good health and harvest for the new year. The festival is a mix of pagan and Christian rituals with roots going back generations. If only they started that a couple weeks ago because this new year is not off to a great start. Maybe it will be after that celebration there.

Thanks for watching this hour of The Story Is. We've got four hours tonight of The Story Is. Hour two starts right now with breaking news.

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