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What We Know with Max Foster

Putin Suggests UAE For Possible Site Of Summit With Trump; Protests Underway As Israeli Security Cabinet Considers Expanding Gaza War; Higher Tariffs Now In Effect For U.S. Trading Partners; Texas Supreme Court To Rule On Removal Of Lawmakers; OpenAI Launches Chatbot Upgrade GPT-5. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired August 07, 2025 - 15:00   ET

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[15:00:47]

MAX FOSTER, CNN HOST: Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin could meet next week in the Middle East. But will the Ukrainian president attend?

This is WHAT WE KNOW.

The long anticipated in-person meeting between U.S. President Donald Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin could happen next week.

Mr. Putin said today during a meeting with the Emirati president that he has nothing against the idea of Mr. Zelenskyy attending if certain

conditions are met, though. He also confirmed he would likely meet with President Trump next week and that the UAE could be where the talks take

place.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): We have many friends who are ready to help us organize events of this kind. One of our

friends is the president of the United Arab Emirates. I think we will decide, but this will be one of the suitable, quite suitable places.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Well, Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says he should be involved in any talks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Everyone knows that key decisions in Russia are made by one person, and that this

person is afraid of sanctions from the United States of America, and that it is only fair that Ukraine should be a participant in the negotiations.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Let's go straight to Kristen Holmes. It does suggest, doesn't it, hearing from Zelenskyy there that he's not currently involved in this

meeting. That seems to be being teed up next week.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, I do want to make one thing clear. There is nothing that has been finalized yet. And

anyone that you're talking to at the White House, they are telling you that its not final until its final. There are still things that they have to

agree on, particularly logistics, setting what exactly the sit down would even look like. Would Zelenskyy be involved?

All we know right now for certain is that President Trump, on this call with European leaders, suggested that he would be sitting down and was open

to the idea of sitting down with Vladimir Putin as early as next week. And when you talk to some of these White House officials, they're a little bit

squishy on exactly when that would happen or what that would look like. And that's because there are a lot of logistics and preplanning that would have

to go into this.

Now, President Trump, in that same call, mentioned Zelenskyy as part of this, saying essentially that he would meet with Putin and then afterwards

would have a trilateral with both of these leaders. But again, one of the things that was interesting is that Trump was asked about this yesterday,

and he said that he has been burned by Putin before or let down by Putin before. And that's why you're not seeing the White House really get ahead

of this, or even President Trump, because they're going to see how this plays out.

And one thing to point to is what you heard from Vladimir Putin there saying he'd be open to having Zelenskyy there if certain conditions would

be met. When you look at certain conditions being met, that's just part of what has to go on in terms of negotiating between the United States and

Russia. And we're just simply not there yet.

From everyone I've spoken to, these are preliminary conversations. They're, of course, looking at multiple locations. I've heard the White House has

been briefed on this idea of UAE, but there are other places that are still in play. It's still very early.

Now, that doesn't mean that they're not working to try and get something on the books. We know President Trump is eager for a meeting with Vladimir

Putin. We also know that he's been urging his staff to look into various options talking to them, asking them questions about what's even possible,

how this would look.

But again, they are all being pretty careful when it comes to publicly releasing any information about this, because President Trump has now, in a

way that he didn't believe the first term, seen himself be burned by Vladimir Putin on multiple fronts, having these lengthy conversations with

Putin in which he goes back on his word. So now, you're seeing a much cagier Donald Trump when it comes to talking about the Russian president.

FOSTER: Okay, Kristen at the White House, thank you.

Protests underway across Israel tonight and in Jerusalem, where the security cabinet is meeting right now on a plan to expand the Gaza war.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says Israel intends to take control of all of Gaza. He's pushing to expand the war to root out Hamas, despite

opposition from the Israeli military chief and the families of the hostages. An Israeli official says the operation would take months and

require forcing more than a million Palestinians out of Gaza city and other areas into compounds in southern Gaza.

[15:05:01]

Here's what Mr. Netanyahu told Fox News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL HEMMER, FOX NEWS HOST: Will Israel take control of all of Gaza?

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: We intend to. In order to, A, assure our security, remove Hamas there, enable the population to be free

of Gaza and to pass it to civilian governance. That is not Hamas, and not anyone advocating the destruction of Israel. That's what we want to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Well, as Israel weighs expanding its offensive in Gaza, hostage families are taking to the water, urging leaders to reconsider. They say

continuing the war will only further endanger hostages and have launched a flotilla in protest, sailing towards Gaza.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LIOR HOREV, CHIEF STRATEGIST FOR THE FAMILY FORUM: Unfortunately, we cannot enter Gaza and get our loved ones back home, but this is a call.

This is an SOS call. This is a mayday call to the Israeli government. The decision of the cabinet to prolong the war will be a death sentence to

those alive, and will make it impossible to return those who have been murdered by Hamas and still are held in Gaza.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: For Palestinian civilians in Gaza, an expanded war could make the current humanitarian crisis unfathomably worse.

CNN's Oren Liebermann following all these developments for us from Jerusalem.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: The key question here that were looking for coming out of the security cabinet meeting is, what does

the full conquest of Gaza, as one Israeli official put it, look like? And that's a question that the political echelon has to essentially decide and

then order for the Israeli military.

According to the military, Israel already controls some 75 percent of Gaza with a military occupation. So, what does pushing into that last 25 percent

look like?

The phased plan that's being considered, according to Israeli officials, that we have spoken to, would take 4 to 5 months. The first phase would be

evacuating Gaza City and other populated areas. Thats approximately 1 million Palestinians, nearly half the population that would be displaced

into southern Gaza, where Israel and perhaps the U.S. would build compounds to effectively house and shelter and contain them.

Meanwhile, at that point, the debate is whether Israel lays siege to what's left of those areas or conducts a more intrusive operation and goes

directly into those areas where in some cases, Israeli soldiers haven't been to this point.

Now, what's critical to note here is the discord within or between, rather, the Israeli military level and the political level. The IDF chief of staff,

Lieutenant General Eyal Zamir, has warned that a full military occupation of Gaza would endanger Israeli soldiers, would endanger the hostages in

areas where they are believed to be, and would add a tremendous burden onto the Israeli military after nearly two years of war. And that's not to say

anything for the humanitarian crisis that would likely worsen if Israel expands its control of Gaza.

Meanwhile, as you just heard from Netanyahu, there he is pushing for a full military takeover, effectively the larger of those escalation options that

are being considered. The question now is what comes out of the security cabinet meeting? It's possible that after hours of discussions, there may

not be a vote and they'll continue discussing it in the coming days. But frankly, if Netanyahu wants to push this through, the expectation is that

he very much has the votes to move in the direction that he just stated he wants to go in.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Oren Liebermann there.

Nations around the globe dealing with the harsh new reality today in the wake of another sweeping round of U.S. tariffs. U.S. President Donald Trump

is celebrating the levies, which are the highest the United States has imposed in nearly a century. The new tariffs could drive up the price of a

number of products for American consumers, including computers, clothing and toys.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRAD SETSER, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER TO U.S. TRADE REPRESENTATIVE: The overall effect is going to be less trade. There's going to be fewer

imports. Those imports are going to be a bit more expensive. Because we're tariffing a lot of parts, a lot of inputs, we're going to be exporting

less.

So, the net effect is primarily a reduction in trade with higher prices for many consumers. And then some significant compression of profits in those

sectors where companies decide to sort of eat the cost of the tariff out of their profit margin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Let's see what investors make of all of this. Then the Dow is down about two thirds of 1 percent currently.

CNN business and economics reporter Anna Cooban is with us.

We're really getting -- I mean, people didn't know if it was going to happen or not. But actually, if we step back from this, it's a profound

change to the global system, right?

ANNA COOBAN, CNN BUSINESS & ECONOMICS REPORTER: It's absolutely enormous. I mean, some of the tariffs that we're seeing on U.S. trading partners,

U.S. allies are, you know, really need to be seen to be believed. We've got 50 percent on Brazil. We've got 39 percent on Switzerland. It's completely

upended the global trading order.

And it's also not the end of it. I mean, Trump is looking into putting extra tariffs on pharmaceuticals, for example. There are investigations

into that. He said this week that he could put a tariff up to 250 percent on those exports into the U.S.

[15:10:02]

So we are not at the end of this by any stretch of the imagination.

FOSTER: In terms of the -- I mean, people forget, don't they? They keep implying -- some American politicians imply these are taxes on foreign

companies and foreign countries, but they're not. They're taxes on U.S. businesses and they will affect the flow of product going into the U.S.

COOBAN: Yes. And we actually saw the deputy prime minister of Ireland today say that Irish businesses need to start thinking about diversifying.

FOSTER: Because they're big in pharmaceuticals.

COOBAN: Yeah, diversifying who they send their products to. And so, although we've seen the U.S. come out today to say that about $100 billion

worth of import taxes have been collected in revenue since April. And obviously, that's a very healthy number.

But in the long run, this could lead to higher inflation. We're already seeing signs of that potentially. And also slowing jobs -- slowing job

growth will U.S. businesses be -- because of all the uncertainty around this, discourage from hiring, for example?

FOSTER: And then the consumers will feel it at the other end, if indeed it does transpire.

COOBAN: Yes. Well, U.S. businesses who import products from abroad could be passing on higher costs to the end consumer. That is certainly something

that many economists expect.

FOSTER: Okay, Anna, thank you so much.

Clock ticking down to two major deadlines in the battle over a redistricting in Texas, one that could have national implications across

the U.S.

Texas Governor Greg Abbott has asked the state Supreme Court to decide in the next few hours whether he can remove Democrats from their seats for

leaving Texas. The state's attorney general says Democrats have until Friday to return, or he'll declare their seats vacant.

Meanwhile, U.S. Senator John Cornyn of Texas says the FBI has agreed to help state law enforcement as it tries to bring Democrats back. It remains

unclear, though, what type of role, if any, the FBI would play.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GENE WU, TEXAS STATE HOUSE DEMOCRAT: We know that the governor has no power outside of the state, and we know that the federal government cannot

get involved in this unless there is a legal reason why they are allowed to get involved. And frankly, you know, this isn't my seat. I mean, it sure as

hell not Governor Abbott's seat. And if they want to come, take it, they got to go through the people of the state of Texas because this is who seat

this belongs to.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Steve Contorno is with us from Chicago, the temporary home for a number of Texas House Democrats.

Steve, where do you think this is going to go then?

STEVE CONTORNO, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: You know, that's a great question that we've been sort of playing this hour by hour because it has been

changing. At the same time, we are at a stalemate in many respects. The lawmakers have left the state, the Texas legislature, legislature can't do

anything without a quorum. And this legislative session is scheduled to end on August 19th. So, we have just gotten into this sort of escalating war of

words, in the meantime, with some significant threats being levied at these lawmakers from Republicans in Texas and the White House itself.

Now, I will say in talking to these lawmakers, they expected to face some hardships from leaving the state. They knew they were going to get fines.

They knew that if they tried to get back into the state, they could have law enforcement chasing them down. They did not anticipate that they would

have Greg Abbott attempting to remove them from office. That is something that caught them off guard. And they actually huddled with their lawyers to

see if this was something he actually had the power to do, and they were assured that he does not.

And they also did not anticipate having a potentially compliant FBI working with Texas law enforcement to track them down outside the state. The reason

why they left for Illinois and New York and Massachusetts is that they were far away from the jurisdiction of the Texas Rangers and would not be able

to be brought and dragged back to the capitol.

The governor of the state, Greg Abbott, is saying that he actually has FBI agents looking for these individuals, not just in the streets of Texas, but

outside of Texas as well. Now, this could all just be bluster, and that is certainly what Texas Democrats believe. However, we have asked the FBI

office in Chicago right now. They have no comments.

All of this is taking place as this debate continues to escalate beyond Texas to the national level. We are seeing California begin to take steps

to rewrite and redraw its own map to retaliate for what Texas is doing. We also saw the vice president of the United States, J.D. Vance, in Indiana

today meeting with lawmakers there and hoping to encourage Republicans to redraw the Indiana map to favor Trump, as well.

FOSTER: Yeah, it's interesting.

Steve, thank you. We'll be keeping across it and following your updates.

Another interesting move from President Donald Trump wanting a new U.S. census count, but one that will not include people living in the U.S.

illegally.

[15:15:05]

On social media, the president said he has instructed the Department of Commerce to work on this. Traditionally, the survey counts the population

of each state, regardless of immigration status. The census data is then used to determine congressional representation. The constitution mandates a

national census every ten years based on, quote, the whole number of free persons, not just citizens.

Coming up, more on Mr. Netanyahu's push for a full takeover of Gaza. Despite some opposition from families of hostages, how will Israelis react

to his plan? We'll discuss.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FOSTER: We're keeping an eye on Jerusalem, where Israel's security cabinet is meeting right now, to consider expanding the war in Gaza.

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu pushing for a full takeover as a way to root out Hamas, despite opposition from members of the military and

families of hostages. An Israeli official says the operation would require the mass relocation of Palestinians into compounds in southern Gaza.

Palestinian Parliament member Mustafa Barghouti accuses Israel of ignoring an alternative plan that would end Hamas rule. He told CNN that Mr.

Netanyahu's real goal is ethnic cleansing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MUSTAFA BARGHOUTI, PRESIDENT, PALESTINIAN NATIONAL INITIATIVE: The plan is there, but Netanyahu refuses it because Netanyahu not only doesn't want any

Palestinian to rule Gaza, he doesn't want to have any Palestinian in Gaza. This is an act of ethnic cleansing in the 21st century. And I am so shocked

that the American administration, the Trump administration, is participating in that and allowing it to happen. This will make the United

States complicit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Well, Gaza's interior ministry is asking countries to stop airdropping aid, saying the grave dangers to people on the ground far

outweigh any benefits.

[15:20:06]

It wants more land crossings to be opened. Instead, a call echoed by the World Food Programme, which says, quote, we can't airdrop our way out of a

famine.

CNN's chief global affairs correspondent Matthew Chance is getting an up close look at airdrop operations from Jordan, riding on an air force plane

that dropped aid into Gaza. He explains the obstacles and the dangers surrounding those airdrops.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: You got these big transport aircraft behind me. These are from the Jordanian air force, but

there are other countries as well, like Germany and Belgium and the United Arab Emirates and France and Britain. They're all sort of taking part in

this international humanitarian effort to drop aid in Gaza.

And they're loaded up with pallets in the back, cargo space. You then take off from this airport in Amman, which is in Jordan. Head over towards the

Gaza strip. The back opens up and then the aid pallets, they parachute off into the waiting crowds below. You can see on the tailfin of this aircraft

there's a very idealistic scene painted of a Jordanian transporter, actually one of the Jordanian transporters dropping humanitarian aid into

Gaza. And people are gratefully receiving it.

The reality is much more chaotic, much more violent. Remember, there's an intense humanitarian starvation crisis underway in Gaza. And so people are

absolutely desperate for any kind of food that they can get. And so, these aid drops result in chaos on the ground, people scrambling, violence. There

have been multiple stabbings of people as they try to get their hands on the aid packages.

Also, people have been killed by the aid pallets actually hitting them on the head as they drop down. And so, look, this is a far from perfect means

of delivering humanitarian assistance into that crisis zone. But having said that, there is intense starvation that's gathering pace in the Gaza

Strip.

And so today, for instance, we delivered six and a half tons of powdered milk and tinned food to Gaza from the back of one of these Jordanian

transport, military transport planes. It's not much. It's nowhere near enough to tackle the hunger problems in Gaza. But it's better than nothing.

And for some people in the Gaza strip, it may make the difference between life and death.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: Well, we've seen large protests in Jerusalem and in Israel over the last several weeks calling for an end to the war. So, what we want to

know tonight is how will Israelis react to an expansion of the war in Gaza, if indeed there is one after this cabinet meeting.

Joining me now, Daniel Levy, president of the U.S. Middle East project, thank you for joining us.

I mean, we are tonight seeing multiple protests across Israel, organized largely by the hostages of the missing families. They clearly don't want an

expansion of this war. What about the rest of Israel? I mean, how much support is there across the electorate?

DANIEL LEVY, PRESIDENT, U.S./MIDDLE EAST PROJECT: Well, that's why this is a significant moment, Max, because it's another one of these moments where

that internal polarization is coming to the fore. This time, not just with many of the families of those Israelis still being held in Gaza who are

convinced that the obstacle to getting their members of family back is Prime Minister Netanyahu, and that he is now further endangering them.

But, of course, also because this -- of this schism with the military leadership who are saying this endangers the hostages, this is going to put

us in an even more untenable position, I think, in the back of their minds may well be issues that they won't articulate, such as are we going to be

held responsible for further war crimes? And they know that they will have to hold this territory and be the providers of assistance. That's probably

going to go very badly, given everything we've seen thus far, and they will be subject to resistance from the guerrilla movements that remain.

However, so that's what's driving an internal schism. However, the bigger picture, I think if one zooms out and looks at it from the outside, is this

could well be a distraction. Because whether it's Netanyahu's plan of moving into these three areas, or whether it's what the military is saying,

which is to encircle the three areas and carry out strikes from the outside, both of those plans entail the continuation of what is credibly

being described by many individuals and organizations and experts as a genocide, whether they go with the Netanyahu or the military leadership

plan.

There's no ceasefire, dozens being killed every day, no ability to get the aid that's needed in. You just saw those pictures, airdrops, and this Gaza

Humanitarian Foundation defined by Medecins Sans Frontieres as massacres masquerading as aid. That situation is going to continue to deteriorate.

[15:25:01]

And it's all part of what is openly stated by the Netanyahu government, which is to kettle Palestinians into a concentration camp in the south of

Gaza in advance of their expulsion. And it's the alignment of these extreme statements and the extreme actions on the ground, which I think is leading

to an increasing call for action, not just words to prevent this.

FOSTER: Netanyahu, he's still referring back to what happened. Obviously, that horrific attack in Israel and saying Hamas needs to be completely

degraded. That's what's really driving this mission. And there are people, of course, who relate to that. This is the one final chance they have to

stop terrorism coming from Gaza.

LEVY: Yeah. You see, Max, does one ever believe that if you continue an occupation, if you deny people their rights, if you pursue a genocide

against them and an apartheid regime, that under those circumstances you will have security. That never happens, Max.

And what Netanyahu is actually telling us is very important because he is saying that whether the hostages are released or not, we are going to

continue with this campaign of maximalist goals. That has been his message throughout, because some people have said, you know, if only Hamas would

release the hostages, it's over. Netanyahu's government has told us throughout these 22 months that they will pursue these maximalist goals,

irrespective of the release of the hostages.

They won't achieve those goals. They haven't achieved them thus far. One of the interesting things going on, I think, max, in this standoff with the

military leadership, is Netanyahu creating a scenario whereby he will then blame the military for not achieving what can't be achieved because there's

no military solution. You need politics. Netanyahu refuses politics.

He will blame them because either he will say they didn't pursue my plan, or he will say they didn't do it with enough enthusiasm, enough vigor. They

were always against it. The interesting counterpoint to that is that this is a chief of staff appointed by Netanyahu himself, not the guy who was in

charge on October 7th.

If he does stand up to Netanyahu, I'm not suggesting that is necessarily going to happen. But if he does, it could be an even greater internal

crisis, because let's acknowledge that one of the issues is Israel tries to portray an image of a being omnipotent, but Israel is a small country. They

face real issues with the number of reservists with exhaustion. This would pile further pressure on them. And you can't manage a perpetual war with a

divided society.

And I think that's why many former senior military figures and many others in Israel, that some are criticizing the morality of this, but most of them

are stepping back from the issue of the war crimes. They're not focusing on that. They are focusing on whether this is a step too far, an overreach on

the part of Israel that could boomerang not just in terms of its international reputation, but also in terms of whether the society can be

held together under these conditions.

FOSTER: Daniel, as ever, really appreciate your analysis on this. We're still waiting for the outcome of that cabinet meeting. It could have

happened all week. I mean, we've been talking about it all week, but it still hasn't happened yet.

So, clearly, there is that big internal debate, isn't there? And those cabinet meetings with the military still being resolved. Thank you.

Still to come, the presidents of Russia, Ukraine and the U.S. could meet as soon as next week for a historic summit. Details on what needs to happen,

though, for that to become a reality.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:31:56]

FOSTER: A meeting between U.S. President Donald Trump and Russian leader Vladimir Putin could happen next week to discuss the war in Ukraine. Mr.

Putin said today he would likely meet with President Trump and the U.S. president told European allies on Wednesday that he intended to meet with

his Russian counterpart. But American officials are now suggesting nothing has been finalized.

And there's the question of whether Ukraine's President Vladimir Zelenskyy will attend the talks, which one former official in Kyiv said is absolutely

necessary.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DMYTRO KULEBA, FORMER UKRAINIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: Theoretically, President Trump can strike any deal he wants to have with President Putin, but he

understands that he will not be able to enforce it without Europeans and Ukraine. So, therefore, he is not going to make that deal, because making a

deal with Putin will expose him -- an unenforceable deal with Putin will expose him to enormous level of criticism for siding -- for siding with the

Russian dictator, while he will have no real leverage to enforce it if Europeans and Ukraine continue to oppose it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: President Zelenskyy is leaving the door open for a Trump-Putin meeting. He says Russia appears, quote, more inclined towards a ceasefire.

Though Zelenskyy is also keeping his guard up against possible deception.

This as Russia launches a new bid to exert control over the southern Ukrainian city of Kherson, as Nick Paton Walsh explains.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): Russia is moving to cut off and cut up the city of Kherson, claiming its drones would hit all cars on this road into a city occupied

from above, where Russian attack drones haunt your every move.

Incredible damage being done to the city. Clearly, Russia trying to force normal life out of here. And even as last ditch peace talks are happening

in Moscow, drones circulating around ordinary people trying to live here.

But this weekend, the occupier went further still, moving to split the city in two, trying to cut off its southern island, still home to about 2,000

people, by blowing the bridge.

Drone footage caught the moment but it was only partially successful, shredding nerves as much as concrete and sparking a sudden evacuation

effort during which, oddly, the Russians seem to be letting hundreds of civilians out.

And there seems to be some kind of pause in drone activity from what we can make out, enabling some of these evacuations.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you happy you left?

NADIYA, KHERSON RESIDENT: Of course. They are shelling so hard since morning. Where is all of this going to end?

[15:35:00]

We've already been driven crazy by all this. When will they even come to their senses?

Causing such horror, killing everyone for peace.

When is Trump going to come?

Or anyone?

At our age we don't deserve this.

WALSH: They lived alone with almost nothing, so have even less to go to.

NINA, KHERSON EVACUEE: I am so tired of the shelling. My nerves can't take it anymore. There is no plan, I will live where they put me. I am on one

leg, on a crutch.

WALSH: Nine hundred and twenty-five evacuated end Wednesday. But don't try suggesting here. This is Russian mercy.

YAROSLAV SHANKO, HEAD, KHERSON MILITARY ADMINISTRATION: They absolutely do not care what the targets are. Talking about any humanity from the Russians

is absolutely pointless.

WALSH: Russian drone operators post images of their hunting people in the city. The gaudy music as if it is sport wherever we go, anxiety. Our

cameras might reveal locations to the Russians, especially at this hospital. Three injured from drones and shelling already and two more once

we leave.

Sixty-two 2 run outside to help after one drone blast that was hit by a second.

OLEH, KHERSON RESIDENT: Another one came flying. I couldn't even notice where it come from. I fell behind the fence. But I didn't swing my legs

over. They stayed outside. My torso was hidden. And that's when it hit my legs.

WALSH: Many are stuck here, unable to fend for themselves on release at home.

There are three drones over the hospital.

The buzz and gunfire we heard outside moments earlier, just how life is here.

The all-clear has been given after the three drones overhead. And now we have to go quickly.

Hours after we leave, the city and island are hit hard. Russian bloggers giving all civilians a week to leave the island.

Talk of mercy here short-lived. Short-sighted, too.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Kherson, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: So, what we don't know. Will President Trump actually meet with his Russian and Ukrainian counterparts?

Joining me now, former U.S. ambassador to NATO and U.S. special representative for Ukraine negotiations, Kurt Volker.

Thank you so much for joining us.

I mean, there was much positivity about a possible meeting from both sides, the Russian side and the U.S. side yesterday. But we heard from our White

House correspondent earlier that the White House is playing this down a bit more today. Can you help explain that?

KURT VOLKER, FORMER U.S. SPECIAL REPRESENTATIVE FOR UKRAINE NEGOTIATIONS: Well, first off, I think that they know that President Trump and Putin

meeting together isn't going to necessarily solve anything. You got to get Ukraine part of the solution as well.

The White House has been pressing for Zelenskyy to be included in the meeting. Of course, Russia's resisting. And I would also just take a step

back from this.

Yes. It's great to have a meeting. I suppose, if you want to actually push for -- for a settlement. But let's not confuse this with actual progress.

Putin has been rejecting Trump's demands for a ceasefire for months, and there's no indication he's going to do anything different right now.

FOSTER: Who do you think is the winner of that optic of Trump and Putin at least standing together? Because it's going to, you know, it's something

that certainly President Putin will really be able to big up to his people, right?

VOLKER: Yeah. Of course. Yeah, it's definitely in Putin's interest to be seen meeting with President Trump. Putin, after all, is an indicted war

criminal for abduction of Ukrainian children. He is considered a pariah throughout all of Europe.

He's not able to travel easily because of this indictment by the International Criminal Court. So, getting a summit meeting with President

Trump is a very big deal. And I don't think Trump needs it, but certainly it does a lot for Putin.

FOSTER: So why doesn't he want Zelenskyy? Because that would dilute that optic.

VOLKER: I think what Trump really cares about is just ending the war. That is his singular focus here. And he knows that in order to end it, you got

to get Putin to end it, because he's the one who continues it.

Zelenskyy never wanted this war and would still agree to a ceasefire right now. You got to get Putin to do that. And it's got to be the two sides that

agree to a ceasefire, which means that it has to be on acceptable terms for Ukraine as well.

FOSTER: It would be extraordinary, though, wouldn't it, seeing them all together. But, you know, I think people have got quite carried away with

the idea that it would, but this could very well just be part of Trump's negotiation tactic, right? To set up this idea with the expectation that

there will be some sort of deal to announce.

[15:40:04]

I mean, they're talking about tomorrow still, aren't they?

VOLKER: Well, all of this is in flux. The Russians are insisting on a bilateral U.S.-Russian meeting. President Trump is trying to add Zelenskyy

into that. We don't know whether the Russians will agree to that or whether Zelenskyy would agree to that. And we don't know whether the U.S. would go

forward with just a bilateral meeting without any indication of any progress from Putin.

FOSTER: Okay. Kurt, as ever, thank you so much for joining us from D.C.

Still to come, what do you get? The man who has everything or the man who is about to impose tariffs on your competitors? How does a solid gold bar

sound?

Apple CEO seems to think it was a good idea. We'll explain the images.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FOSTER: There are plenty of ups and downs to being CEO during the Trump administration.

Take Apple's Tim Cook. One week, he's facing expanded tariffs from the U.S. president. The next, he's giving him a lavish custom plaque in the Oval

Office. It's essentially a glass cutout designed by a former marine corporal in Kentucky on a 24-carat gold base made in Utah.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TIM COOK, APPLE CEO: This bar was made in the U.S., in California, and this glass comes on the morning line. It's engraved for President Trump.

It's a unique unit of one.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Well, Apple recently committed to building iPhone components in the U.S. President Donald Trump has said companies that make these promises

would be exempt from new tariffs on semiconductors. And it appears he liked the gold bar as well, didn't he, Richard?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: You like the whole thing actually. So what -- I have a close up picture of it here. So, I can tell

you it says president Donald Trump. Apple American manufacturing program.

And then it's got a facsimile of Tim's signature, made in USA. And it's, you know, the idea is this special glass that is used, its meant to reflect

sort of the wafer thin of the computer chip, but it's the glass, the same glass that's going to be used for as part of the new manufacturing process

that they're going to be setting up that special glass used for iPads, Apple watches and the like.

The whole thing is a bit bizarre. I mean, it seems to be a case of what do you have to take the president? Your tithe, if you will, your present, your

gift, be it a glass with a gold bar or a 747 jet from Qatar.

FOSTER: Why aren't we questioning you know, the ethics of accepting these gifts anymore? Because they keep happening.

QUEST: Of course, they -- people are questioning them. The official answer would always be that these are not gifts to Donald Trump. They're gifts to

the president, and that they will end up in the library. His final -- wherever his presidential library is set up, that's going to be the line

that was used for the 747. And I'm assuming that that's the same logic that's going to be used here.

These are not personal gifts to Donald J. Trump and squire, but to the president of the United States. At least that's the way it's always

portrayed.

But what is now really becoming clear, and it's now starting to become extremely well documented, is the number of gifts, whether it be buildings

that are put up cars that are given a Tesla, for example, or this, that or the other that are given to the president in some or his family in some

shape or other. And whilst the unspoken is not a quid pro quo, nobody is fooled for one moment.

FOSTER: Okay, Richard, thank you. I'm sure you'll have more analysis of the gold later on "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" at the top of the hour.

QUEST: Pure gold.

FOSTER: Like your show.

There are new improvements meanwhile to the popular A.I. chat tool, ChatGPT. Still to come, OpenAI's major upgrade. We'll explain.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:50:02]

FOSTER: The popular ChatGPT tool getting a big upgrade. A short while ago, the A.I. company behind ChatGPT unveiled its new A.I. model. It's called

GPT-5.

The company says it's faster. It's better at tasks such as writing, coding and answering questions.

The CEO of OpenAI discussed the upgrade earlier.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAM ALTMAN, CEO OF OPENAI: It can write an entire computer program from scratch to help you with whatever you'd like. And we think this idea of

software on demand is going to be one of the defining characteristics of GPT-5 era. It can help you plan a party, send invitations, order supplies.

It can help you understand your healthcare and make decisions on your journey.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Lisa Eadicicco, the tech editor for CNN Business, was watching that presentation.

I mean -- I mean, there was lots of very complex computer language, if I can call it that wasn't there. But the demos were extraordinary, weren't

they? The way you saw the app basically write a load of code very quickly and create apps that, you know, I mean, even I could do it.

LISA EADICICCO, CNN BUSINESS TECH EDITOR: Exactly. And I think that's a big part of this update. As Sam Altman said during the presentation, GPT-5

is really making ChatGPT better at the things that it already does. And one of those things is code generation.

So there are two areas where GPT-5 should bring some pretty big improvements. One of those, like you mentioned, is what's known as vibe

coding, which is the ability to just kind of type in a prompt and have ChatGPT or another service, just kind of create a website for you from

scratch. And that's something that a lot of people do if they're not really experienced, they just need to make a website as a hobby.

But there are also some pretty big implications for people who work in software engineering as well. During the presentation, Sam Altman and other

leadership from OpenAI kind of showed how the new model will make it possible to kind of debug things faster, and instead of just doing it, the

model will now kind of show you its process and be a little bit more communicative along the way, which is really important, because if we're

going to trust A.I. models to help us with work and do things for us, I think being a little bit more transparent about the process and improving

some of the safety elements, which is also a big theme with GPT-5, is going to be really, really crucial.

FOSTER: And the various levels aren't there, but they were saying that actually the best level, the highest grade app is available free for

everyone. Once you've used it a certain amount, you have to start paying. But actually they're really putting it out there.

EADICICCO: Yeah. So with GPT-5, they really are trying to get it out there to everybody. So GPT-5 is available across all models, whether you're using

the free version or in one of the paid tiers. And this is something a little bit different for OpenAI.

And another thing that they're doing is that they're just making GPT-5 the default model. So, in the past, you would have to choose the model

depending on what you wanted to do. If you wanted deep research, if you just wanted a quick answer. But this model is capable of figuring that out

on its own based on the prompt, so that the user doesn't have to switch back and forth anymore, which I think is going to go a long way in kind of

making this type of technology a bit more popular and kind of getting rid of some of the early, I guess, pain points early on.

FOSTER: Okay, Lisa, thank you.

EADICICCO: Thank you.

FOSTER: Now it does feel like turbulence is becoming more severe and more frequent, doesn't it? Last week, a flight from the U.S. to the Netherlands

was hit with such strong turbulence that 25 people were taken to hospital following the emergency landing. A 73-year-old man died of a heart attack

during turbulence on a flight from London to Singapore last year. Scientists believe the rise in turbulence may in part be due to climate

change as well.

CNN meteorologist Allison Chinchar reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: The thing is, turbulence does follow certain patterns, so we kind of tend to know what parts of the globe have

more severe turbulence than others. Take a look at this map. This shows you the most turbulent flights in 2024. You're looking for those orange red

highlighted areas.

The most turbulent is in South America along the Andes Mountains. The second one in portions of Asia right near the Himalayas. Notice a pattern

there? We're talking mountainous regions. The United States and Europe also have similar areas of very turbulent flights. We're talking the Rocky

Mountains as well as the Alps across portions of Europe.

All of these have that thing in common, which is mountainous regions, and that triggers a lot of turbulence as that air kind of goes up and down the

mountains. It can kind of create eddies or circular motion within the atmosphere.

Now here's the thing, that's one form. The other is called clear air turbulence. And clear air turbulence is a little bit different. In fact,

most of it actually happens on very sunny days.

But this is the one we're concerned about when it comes to climate change, because this is the one that is likely going to increase over time because

of climate change specifically. Now, clear air turbulence is caused by wind shear. That's a rapid change of wind speed or direction with respect to the

altitude. But as the planet warms, that type of turbulence is actually intensifying.

Take, for example, from 2020 to 1979, we saw a 55 percent increase of that kind of turbulence over the North Atlantic and a 41 percent increase over

the continental U.S. specifically.

[15:55:11]

So, this is certainly going to be a concern going forward, because as we warm that air, we change the air patterns around them. And again, this

could end up leading to more severe air turbulence, maybe even in some places where we wouldn't necessarily normally focus in on, especially when

it comes to some of those routes that we just showed where we normally expect to see that high turbulence.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOSTER: There we are, Allison Chinchar.

I am Max Foster. That is WHAT WE KNOW.

"QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" with Richard up next.

END

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