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What We Know with Max Foster
Kennedy Names HHS Deputy Jim O'Neill As Acting CDC Director; Trump Administration Cancels Nearly $5 Billion In Foreign Aid; U.S. Plans To Send Hundreds Of Children Back To Guatemala; Ukraine: Russia Launches Second- Largest Air Assault; Modi, Putin And Xi To Meet In China Amid U.S. Pressure; Israel Ramps Up Attacks Ahead Of Planned Gaza City Assault; Hearing In Cook's Challenge To Firing Ends Without Ruling. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired August 29, 2025 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:00:24]
MAX FOSTER, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: A new boss at the United States preeminent health agency after days of confusion and chaos.
This is WHAT WE KNOW.
U.S. Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. has named Jim O'Neill as the acting CDC director. O'Neill's a former technology and biotech investor
who's been serving as Kennedy's deputy. He's not a physician, and he has a limited medical background. He's only held the role at HHS since June.
This comes days after CDC director, Dr. Susan Monarez, was suddenly ousted, reportedly for clashing with Kennedy over vaccine policy. Four top CDC
officials, resigned in protest. There's growing pressure on Secretary Kennedy over his unconventional medical views, and many current and former
CDC staffers are expressing concern that science may be suppressed under new leadership at the agency.
One of the officials who resigned told CNN. Kennedy isn't seeking advice on health policy from CDC experts and has never even got a briefing from them
on measles, COVID-19 or the flu.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. DEMETRE DASKALAKIS, FORMER DIRECTOR, CDC NATIONAL CENTER FOR IMMUNIZAITON & RESPIRATORY DISEASES: So no one from my center has ever
briefed him on any of those topics.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN HOST: Really?
DASKALAKIS: So I don't know where he's getting his -- really.
COLLINS: No one has ever briefed him on any of those issues that you just mentioned there, including measles, given the outbreak in the United States
right now.
DASKALAKIS: He's getting information from somewhere. Yeah, he's getting information from somewhere, but that information is not coming from CDC
experts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
FOSTER: Jacqueline Howard has more from Atlanta, the home of the CDC. Obviously, so many people within the CDC will be fighting this move, but it
seems to be happening, right? He's in place, Kennedy's man.
JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: That's right, Max, Kennedy sent a letter to CDC employees telling them that he has named Jim O'Neill to serve
as acting CDC director at this time. But as you mentioned, Max, there are a lot of worries and concerns within the agency around where the agency is
heading. And many employees said that they admired Dr. Susan Monarez, who was suddenly ousted. And now, there's a lot of tension, a lot of confusion
around what the agency is going to look like under Jim O'Neill.
And, Max, what we do know about Jim O'Neill, as you said, he is Kennedy's deputy. He does have a history in the Department of Health and Human
Services. He did work at HHS under the George W. Bush administration previously. But like you said, Max, he's not a doctor. He does not have an
advanced degree in public health. And so, there are concerns around the risk of science being suppressed, and politics playing a role in public
health. And that's what CDC employees tell me they fear the most.
They hope that Jim O'Neill takes that to heart and keeps the science first. But they said that right now the agency is just under so much turmoil. It
really is a chaotic atmosphere right now, Max.
FOSTER: We have seen a shift in actual policy, haven't we? Particularly with COVID-19 vaccines.
HOWARD: That's right. We have seen that shift when it comes to who the vaccines are eligible for or who's eligible for the vaccines. The FDA just
this week here in the United States, approved the COVID-19 vaccines for a limited group, for adults ages 65 and older and for younger people who have
an underlying health condition that puts them at an increased risk of COVID-19. And in some states here in the United States, you need a
prescription to get the COVID-19 vaccine.
This is an evolving regulatory environment, but that's what it looks like right now in 16 states where there are some added restrictions to access
the vaccines. So, like you said, Max, we're seeing this shift not just within the leadership at CDC, but also within the policies that we're
seeing coming out of the Trump administration.
FOSTER: Jacqueline, thank you so much. We'll see how it plays out.
HOWARD: Absolutely.
FOSTER: President Trump, meanwhile, canceling nearly $5 billion in foreign aid. These funds have already been approved by the U.S. Congress, with some
lawmakers calling the move unlawful. However, the Trump administration says it's using a rare pocket rescission to do so. The administration also says
the president has this authority under the Impoundment Control Act.
Alayna Treene, explain that one to us.
[15:05:02]
ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yeah, a lot of -- a lot of wonky terms that are involved in this. And that's part because this initiative is
really being pushed by the director of the Office of Management and Budget, Russell Vought. He is someone who has been very committed to looking at
clawing back funding throughout the government. But this, of course, particularly is so concerning to lawmakers because, one, it has to deal a
lot with foreign aid. But, two, this is already money that had been appropriated by Congress.
Now, this -- this pocket rescission, as they are calling it, that the president used in order to do this, is a tool that has not been used for
decades. And that's part of what were hearing now from lawmakers who are saying that essentially this is illegal. A lot of Democrats are coming out
and criticizing it.
But we also heard from a Republican senator, Susan Collins of Maine. She is the chairman of the Senate Appropriations Committee. I want to read you
just a bit of what she said. She said, quote, given that this package was sent to Congress very close to the end of the fiscal year, when the funds
are scheduled to expire, this is an apparent attempt to rescind appropriated funds without congressional approval.
And part of the reason, again, I know this is getting a bit into the details here, but the reason I think that is so important to note is
because at this point, given this is so close to the end of the fiscal year, you know, just in a couple of weeks, well see that unless congress
takes this up and reconsiders this type of funding, this is likely to go away.
And just to give you a sense of what this nearly $5 billion in funding that's being clawed back looks like it includes $3.2 billion that is being
cut from U.S. aid. Of course, we've already seen U.S. aid be significantly decreased ever since President Donald Trump came into office. It also
includes $393 million from the State Department peacekeeping activities, $322 million from the State Departments democracy fund, and more than $444
million, Max, and other peacekeeping aid.
All to say, again, really keeping in what we've seen with the president, who is not as interested in having all of this money going to aid other
countries abroad, this could potentially be, you know, headed for a legal fight. We have to see where it lands. But I am certain we're going to hear
a lot more from some of Congress, particularly when they come back shortly after their recess.
FOSTER: Alayna, thank you so much for explaining that. It's going to have a huge impact around the world.
TREENE: Right.
FOSTER: Trump administration planning to send hundreds of Guatemalan children back to their home country, sources tell CNN. More than 600
children in government custody could be deported. The children who arrived in the U.S. alone are amongst the 2,000 that are in U.S. government
custody.
Priscilla Alvarez is following this story for us.
Priscilla, could you just explain how they ended up in the U.S. in the first place on their own?
PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. So, this is an unprecedented move, targeting a set of children who arrived to the U.S.-Mexico border
unaccompanied. That means that they have traveled through, usually, Central America. They arrived without a parent or a legal guardian. So they are
deemed unaccompanied migrant children, and they are sent over to the custody of the Health and Human Services Department, which is charged with
their care.
When these children are in that custody, officials work to find a U.S.- based family and place the children with that family while they go through their immigration proceedings and where an immigration judge will determine
if they have protections in the United States. So that is the group of children that we are talking about. And in my experience, covering this,
that can mean many children who have parents, aunts, uncles, sisters who are in the U.S., and that is who they are seeking to be reunited with when
they arrive to the United States.
Here's what this program is planning to do, however. This is where and the administration has identified more than 600 Guatemalan children who are in
U.S. government custody. They are waiting to be reunited with U.S. based family and also going through their proceedings.
But this is where the change happens. The administration is working on plans in coordination with the Guatemalan government, to send them back to
their country of origin. Now, I'm told that this could include a wide range of ages and that these children that are in custody don't have a parent in
the United States. Their parent, for example, may be in Guatemala as well as other family members.
The reason this is concerning among advocates who work with these children is because oftentimes when unaccompanied children are coming to the United
States, they're fleeing conditions back at home. Sometimes that is fleeing what is happening in their home with their parents. Sometimes it's because
their parents don't feel that they can protect them in country. And so, they send them to the United States.
So it's not always the right resolution for the children to go back to the country of origin. However, there have been other cases where children have
asked to be returned.
[15:10:02]
So, this is all new. It's a program that has not been done before. But what is clear from my -- from my sources is that it is something that is being
done in partnership with Guatemala. So, these are two governments working on this and planning to roll it out soon -- Max.
FOSTER: Fascinating. Priscilla, thank you for bringing us that.
Ukrainian delegates are meeting with U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff in New York. The Ukrainian president's chief of staff says he wants to, quote,
push forward real diplomacy with the U.S. This comes as the death toll is rising in Kyiv, following Russia's second largest aerial attack since the
war began. We're also hearing that Ukraine has destroyed two key bridges inside Russia, using Moscow's own mines and drones.
A key gathering in China this weekend brings together three major world leaders, each under pressure from the U.S. China's Xi Jinping will host
more than 20 leaders, including Russian President Vladimir Putin and Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi, at a regional security forum.
CNN's Ivan Watson reports on what's at stake.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Three world leaders whose countries dominate the map of Asia are about to meet in
China for a summit of the Shanghai Cooperation Organization. But looming over this Eurasian gathering will be the elephant not in the room.
YUN SUN, CHINA PROGRAM DIRECTOR, STIMSON CENTER: For this particular summit U.S. may not be at the table, but U.S. is always present.
WATSON: India's Prime Minister Narendra Modi will make his first trip to China in seven years.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We did it with India.
WATSON: Days after Trump slammed a 50 percent tariff on Indian exports to the U.S.
China and India's relationship cratered after a series of deadly clashes first erupted along their disputed border in 2020.
JOE BIDEN, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So welcome again, Mr. Prime Minister. We have a big agenda.
WATSON: For decades, Washington has been grooming India as a democratic counterbalance to China. But that suddenly changed in July when Trump
called India a dead economy and announced his punishing tariffs, insisting it was a penalty for buying Russian oil.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: India needs the support of the United States and with that support no longer assured or in fact almost gone, Mr. Modi had no
option but to go and cut a deal with President Xi.
WATSON: Meanwhile, Russia's president will stand with his old friend Xi Jinping again shortly after Trump rolled out the red carpet for Vladimir
Putin in Alaska.
TRUMP: Thank you very much, Vladimir.
I'm very disappointed with the conversation I had today with President Putin.
WATSON: But Trump's on again, off again overtures to the Russian strongman unlikely to impact Russia and China's so-called "no limits" partnership.
Analysts say the glue that binds these once hostile neighbors ever closer is their shared perception of the U.S. as a threat.
SUN: For Washington, the traditional term that has been used is how do we break the Russia-China collusion? Well, it's a catch-22 because your desire
to break their collusion is the reason that they collude as a first place.
WATSON: In 2022, just days before Russia's invasion of Ukraine, Putin and Xi called for the creation of a new world order.
The U.S.'s biggest global competitor is now capitalizing on Trump's chaotic diplomacy.
SUN: The message here that we have seen China emphasize is China represents credibility. It represents stability. It represents policy predictability.
WATSON: Expect Xi to use this summit to present a Chinese-led alternative to a world long dominated by the U.S.
Ivan Watson, CNN, Tianjin, China.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FOSTER: Israel calling Gaza City a dangerous combat zone ahead of its planned major assault, the Israeli military is already ramping up attacks.
This video from social media shows explosions on the outskirts of Gaza City. This comes as Israel says it's recovered two deceased hostages. There
are now 48 hostages remaining in Gaza. Twenty of them are believed to be alive. Israel also suspending humanitarian pauses in fighting, which were a
way to bring in aid.
Jeremy Diamond tracking the IDF's latest strikes on Gaza City.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, Israeli military bombardment and artillery shelling of Gaza City is indeed ramping up as
Israel prepares for a full scale invasion of Gaza City, where nearly 1 million people live and are now at risk of being forcibly displaced. The
Israeli military indeed carrying out a number of strikes that have set off huge plumes of smoke, particularly in the northern part of Gaza City. Much
of this seems to be a precursor for a ground troop movement into that city. As we know right now, there are Israeli troops that are operating just
north of Gaza City in Jabalya, as well as in the southern Gaza City neighborhood of Zeitoun.
[15:15:09]
It's not clear how close we are to that ground troop movement actually happening in Gaza city, but the Israeli military now declaring Gaza city a,
quote, dangerous combat zone, ending the temporary ten-hour per day tactical pauses that were meant to allow humanitarian aid to flow in. In
terms of that part of Gaza City, those tactical pauses effectively over now in Gaza City. As an Israeli military official tells me, these are the
initial stages of this Gaza city operation, 59 people have been killed over the course of the past day, according to the Palestinian health ministry.
But of course, there are the broader risks of exacerbating the already awful humanitarian crisis in Gaza as a result of this military operation,
with nearly a million people at risk of being forcibly displaced and Gaza City, of course, already gripped by famine, according to un experts.
Now, Israeli troops also operating elsewhere in Gaza and have recovered the bodies of two Israeli hostages. We only know the identity of one of those
hostages so far. His name is Ilan Weiss. He is 56 years old. He was killed in Hamas's attack on October 7th on Kibbutz Be'eri, and his body was then
taken into Gaza and has been held as a bargaining chip until now. But his body has now been returned to his family and will finally be able to get a
proper burial.
The fate of so many other hostages still hangs in the balance, though. There are now 48 hostages remaining in Gaza, 20 of whom are believed to be
alive. But we know, of course, that the conditions in which they are being held in are desperate.
Jeremy Diamond, CNN, Tel Aviv.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FOSTER: Coming up, the fate of Lisa Cook's job as Federal Reserve governor. How an emergency court hearing turned out today as she sues to block Donald
Trump from firing her.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:20:16]
FOSTER: An emergency court hearing over President Donald Trump's attempt to fire Federal Reserve Governor Lisa Cook ended today after two hours with no
immediate ruling from the federal judge overseeing it. The president claims he's terminating Cook with cause for committing mortgage fraud. She's suing
to block the firing while her case is heard saying Mrs. Trump's actions are unlawful.
It comes as a Trump administration housing official sent a new criminal referral to the Justice Department against Cook late on Thursday, this time
related to mortgage on a property in Massachusetts.
Let's go to Katelyn Polantz, who can explain all of this from Washington.
I mean, it is sounding very complex, isn't it? But Cook's basic case is she hasn't been found guilty of anything yet. She's being fired for it.
KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: And she says that the president shouldn't have the power that he says he has in determining what
it means to fire someone for cause. So those allegations, Max, you're right. They are unproven at this time. They are just allegations she's not
been charged with any crime. That's a large part of her argument here. It's that these are allegations and there's an accusation that her legal team is
levying toward Donald Trump, saying he's using these as a pretext that his real reason for wanting to remove Lisa Cook from the Fed board of governors
is because he doesn't like that the Federal Reserve is not lowering interest rates at this time.
So that's that part of the allegations. The Justice Department, though they are standing for the president in court saying we do believe -- we believe
the judicial branch, so a judge at the trial level in federal court in Washington today should not be able to second guess it whenever the
president says he has for cause to remove someone, even if it's an unproven allegation like they're doing with Lisa Cook, the judge says that might not
be exactly where I'm going to go, but there isn't much in the law that defines what for cause termination is in this particular circumstance.
So that's one of the questions this judge is going to have to answer. We're not expecting even initial rulings on this to come until at earliest
Tuesday of next week, because both sides have more legal arguments that they want to put in writing to Judge Cobb.
FOSTER: And the judge is dealing with something completely unprecedented. So it's a huge decision, isn't it? I mean, if she does get ousted, how does
it do you think change the balance on the board? He's obviously very determined to do it. And even if he just gets rid of her temporarily and
replaces her, it does sort of, tip the balance to some extent, doesn't it?
POLANTZ: It could. I mean, it's a seven-person board. She is an appointee from 2022, in the Biden administration. And Donald Trump would like to put
someone of his own onto the Federal Reserve board and have interest rates lowered or have more political control, at least. But a large part of the
argument here in court is about the sanctity and independence of the Central Bank, of the Federal Reserve and its governors, its leadership.
What the Justice Department says is it's actually more harmful to the credibility of the Federal Reserve board. If there are allegations hanging
over someone like Lisa Cook of something like having incorrect financial information or filing incorrect financial documents, but what the court
will ultimately have to do and what they've done with other people Trump has fired from this administration, is that they'll have to determine whose
harm is greatest, is the greater harm to the government right now if she continues to serve, or is it a greater harm to her if she's fired
wrongfully? Max?
FOSTER: It's going to be -- it's a test case, isn't it? It's fascinating.
Katelyn, thank you.
POLANTZ: It is.
FOSTER: While Donald Trump tries to exert control over the Fed, his children are trying to bolster their reputations as crypto magnates. Eric
Trump and Don Jr. have founded American bitcoin, which aims to start trading in September. And as Kristie Lu Stout reports, they're making a big
push in Asia's booming crypto market.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ERIC TRUMP, SON OF PRESIDENT TRUMP: Everybody wants bitcoin, everybody is buying bitcoin.
KRISTIE LU STOUT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Eric Trump is hyping crypto in Hong Kong just as bitcoin is on fire. In August, the digital
asset hit a record high of $124,000.
Crypto is booming on the back of policy support from Eric's father, U.S. President Donald Trump, and fans here at Bitcoin Asia are all in.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bitcoin is just better technology for money.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bitcoin is definitely going to be played a very big part of the future.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think its going to be higher and higher.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We love bitcoins.
[15:25:00]
STOUT: The Trump family has piled into crypto through a range of investments, including World Liberty Financial, Trump's very own meme coin,
and American bitcoin set to start trading in September.
Chinese crypto mogul Justin Sun, famous for paying over $6 million for a banana duct taped to a wall, pumped $75 million into World Liberty tokens.
Afterwards, U.S. securities regulators hit pause on their civil fraud case against him.
HILARY ALLEN, LAW PROFESSOR, AMERICAN UNIVERSITY: There are no limits on the opportunities that there are to seek favor with the person issuing
those crypto assets.
STOUT: After arranging Trump to speak at his conference last year --
TRUMP: I want to thank David Bailey for inviting me.
STOUT: Bailey is bringing the party to Hong Kong.
DAVID BAILEY, BITCOIN INVESTOR: China's one of the biggest bitcoin mining locations in the world. They have one of the biggest user bases of bitcoin
in the world. Their citizens own a huge percentage of bitcoin. They're a bitcoin superpower. And you know, my word of advice to China would be to
embrace being a bitcoin superpower, just in the same way that the United States is embracing it and own it.
STOUT: In 2021, China banned crypto trading and mining over financial stability concerns. But sands are shifting.
In August, Hong Kong became one of the first markets in the world to regulate issuers of fiat backed stablecoins. That's crypto linked to real
world currencies like the U.S. dollar. It's all part of a bigger bid for this Chinese city to become a digital assets hub.
ALLEN: The FOMO, you know, the desire to be a hub comes from this. I think general sense in our society that we have that you need to be the leader in
whatever the latest hot technology is, because that's how you get progress, that's how you get growth. There are a lot of negatives for society, and
really the primary legal use case is speculation.
STOUT: "The New Yorker" estimates President Trump and his family have made over $2.3 billion from crypto ventures.
E. TRUMP: This is the time to buy. Volatility is your friend. Buy right now. Shut your eyes. Hold it for the next five years and you are going to
do terrifically well.
ROCKSTAR DEV, DEVELOPER: People love to hear Eric Trump, so I personally not a big fan, but I, you know, like what he's doing for bitcoin,
appreciate it.
STOUT: Judging from the hype here, they're banking on more upside to come in Asia.
Kristie Lu Stout, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FOSTER: Still to come, a week of turmoil at the CDC. I will talk to someone who once ran that critical health agency about the changes happening there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:30:57]
FOSTER: A Ukrainian delegation met with U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff in New York earlier today. Kyiv says the talks focused on pushing forward real
diplomacy to end the war. The talks come a day after Russia launched a massive air assault on Kyiv, the second largest aerial attack since the war
began.
CNN's Jennifer Hansler joins us from Washington with more.
Obviously, we just haven't seen any diplomacy, despite those huge efforts from the White House and Europe. Do you feel any shift here because of
these meetings today?
JENNIFER HANSLER, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT REPORTER: Well, Max, I think the answer there is no. We actually haven't seen any sort of U.S. readout yet
of these meetings, which I think is telling in and of itself that they ended some hours ago, and we have yet to see any sort of U.S. response to
how the meetings actually went. From the Ukrainian side, the key point they seem to drive home about these meetings is that they are willing to be an
active, good faith participant in any sort of diplomatic efforts. And it is Russia that is the problem.
I was told in the days leading up to this meeting that that was sort of the main focus that they wanted to tell Washington, we are trying to work with
you and it is Putin and it is Moscow. That is not.
Now, we saw from Andriy Yermak, who was one of the top Ukrainian officials in that meeting in New York. He said he briefed Witkoff on the situation
with, quote, unquote, Russian war crimes, including that deadly missile and drone strike on Kyiv yesterday. He also said they were coordinating their
efforts on diplomatic approaches. He also tried to raise the specter of the need for U.S. pressure on Moscow.
And I want to read you just a quote from his readout that he put on X today. He said, quote, "We are open to direct negotiations at the leaders'
level and ready to discuss the broadest spectrum of issues. We believe that global pressure is needed to ensure Russia is genuinely ready to move
forward towards peace, and in particular, to hold critically important leaders' meetings for that purpose."
Of course, we heard President Trump voicing his desire to have President Zelenskyy and Putin sit down together. There has been no indication from
Moscow that Putin is ready to do so. And Ukraine is saying here that the U.S. and international allies need to put their -- Russia's feet to the
fire here to actually get them to play ball.
Now, of course, the important context here, Max, is, even as all of this is happening, we have continued to hear public statements from the White House
that sort of put Russia and Ukraine on equal footing.
Yesterday, Karoline Leavitt was asked about those deadly strikes on Kyiv, and she said they were terrible. But she also said there had been a drone
strike on Kursk by the Ukrainians. And she said that perhaps both sides were not ready to end the war. Ukrainians, of course, are trying to push
forward the message that that is just not the case -- Max.
FOSTER: Okay, Jennifer, thank you for joining us from the State Department there.
Now, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. has named a new acting director of the embattled CDC. Jim O'Neill, a former biotech investor who's been Kennedy's deputy
secretary of health and human services, will take over the health agency. Though O'Neill has been involved in health policy decisions, he has no
formal training as a doctor or a researcher. He replaces Susan Monarez, who was fired this week after reportedly clashing with Kennedy over vaccine
policy. Her dismissal caused four senior officials to resign in solidarity.
One of those officials who resigned says he is worried that political agendas and bias are getting in the way of following scientific evidence.
He says the changes happening at the CDC should be a warning to everyone.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DASKALAKIS: CDC does not have bias. On the contrary, the people that have been installed by Secretary Kennedy are full of ideology and bias that will
actually contaminate the science. So, I think that we have evidence that this is coming, and I think that the other part that we're seeing is that
decisions are being made and data is being retrofitted to be able to address the decision. I think that that is really a clear sign that, that
the direction that the country's public health is going is not one that is evidence-based or science-based, which is why our resignations are really
together, are trying to raise a red flag for everyone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[15:35:13]
FOSTER: So, what we want to know is, is public health in the United States moving in the wrong direction?
Joining us now, Dr. Tom Frieden, who was the CDC director during the Obama administration.
Appreciate your time with us today.
You will, of course, still have lots of contacts in the agency today. What's the atmosphere like?
DR. TOM FRIEDEN, FORMER DIRECTOR, CENTERS FOR DISEASE CONTROL & PREVENTION: Well, this is unprecedented. In the 80-year history of CDC, no director has
been fired. There has never been a time when a large part of the leadership resigned in protest. And I know the four doctors who resigned, all of them
have dedicated their careers to doing what CDC does best, which is working 24/7 to protect Americans from threats.
And right now, that protection is very much under threat, because we are seeing ideological and nonscientific perspectives being used to set
policies that may result in people not being able to get or afford vaccines or treatments or information to protect themselves, their families and
their communities.
FOSTER: Do you really think resigning was the right decision, though, because Donald Trump is unlikely, and Kennedy is unlikely to respond or --
to that pressure? Probably just let them go and you've lost these great minds from the agency which -- you know, will help change the culture,
which is probably what the administration is looking for.
FRIEDEN: I don't know the inside story. I do know that the environment there seemed such that, with the firing of a director, that this
administration appointed and the repeated, assertions of state from Secretary Kennedy that just aren't true. He has repeatedly accused others
of conflicts of interest, whereas in fact, some of the people around him have very deep conflicts of interest. He has repeatedly accused others of
bias where as when I've looked in detail at his statements, they are either misleading or untrue repeatedly, especially about vaccines.
For example, the link between autism and measles or any vaccines has been looked at very carefully and were really doing a disservice to people with
autism and their families by repeating things that are disproven and not looking for the real causes, and also by not focusing on improving care and
prevention and support for those families.
FOSTER: What systems are in place to protect the agency against political interference? Because we've been hearing that Kennedy hasn't been taking
any scientific briefings on many of the key issues. So isn't making decisions on scientific advice which one would assume the new leader of the
CDC will be similar to, because he's been appointed by Kennedy?
FRIEDEN: The truth is that we're now seeing that many of the things that we thought were safeguards were really more traditions. And those traditions -
- those traditions have been broken.
Now, it's certainly the case that any institution can be better. CDC can be better, as can any other institution. That means, for example, being
quicker, being more practical, connecting better with state and local entities, communicating more effectively. And I think it was moving in
those directions. But what's happening now is basically science and organizations being hijacked for an anti-science, anti-fact agenda that may
result in the spread of infectious diseases. And although the claim is making America healthier, what were seeing is the dismantling of systems
that keep Americans healthy, whether its from tobacco control or birth defect prevention or other areas. All of these are areas that this
administration has dismantled.
FOSTER: What's your feeling? Is it going to be a mass walkout there?
FRIEDEN: There are still thousands and thousands of dedicated professionals at CDC. They work 24/7 to protect Americans. And I think we in the
community, we in society need to protect them so that they can do their job of protecting us.
FOSTER: In terms of where things go from here -- you know, these key figures that have resigned, unlikely to be offered their jobs back,
presumably. And there will be a new culture, no doubt put into place in the organization because it has a new leader, you know, what sort of
organization is being created here, do you think?
FRIEDEN: Well, it doesn't really have a new leader. The person who's been announced is in a very important position. It's called the deputy secretary
position. He basically runs day to day all of health and human services, which is all of the health insurance, all of NIH, all of the entities that
are part of the Department of Health and Human Services, of which CDC is just one. So, they kind of have a part time, politically appointed person
who has no medical or health training.
This is a really time of danger where if there's a problem or as we need to advance health programs, they're all at risk. And because of that, we're
all at risk.
FOSTER: Okay. Thank you, Dr. Tom Frieden, at a time. I know that a lot of pressure in your industry. Thank you so much for joining us.
FRIEDEN: Thank you.
FOSTER: Still to come, 20 years on, the memories of Hurricane Katrina remain. We take a look at those who rebuilt New Orleans after so much was
lost.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
FOSTER: Twenty years ago today, New Orleans was being hit by its worst hurricane ever. On August the 29th, 2005, Hurricane Katrina slammed into
the U.S. Gulf Coast, bringing powerful winds and rain. Nearly 1,400 people died across multiple states, most in Louisiana.
CNN's Gustavo Valdes takes a look at the city's long road to recovery.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GUSTAVO VALDES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Twenty years after Hurricane Katrina devastated New Orleans, you can see signs of the new life in the city.
These houses are an example of the recovery in the Lower Ninth Ward, one of the city's most affected areas.
(voice-over): Angelica Rivera is one of the many workers who helped bring it back to life.
Is the New Orleans you see today the same New Orleans you came to?
[15:45:02]
ANGELICA RIVERA, PRESIDENT, COLMEX CONSTRUCTION: No, not at all.
VALDES: With small children, one barely a few months old, she moved from Orlando after the storm, following her husband, a handyman who saw an
opportunity working in construction.
RIVERA: I'm not going to lie. I cried a couple of times because I was, like, I don't want to be here.
VALDES: Because basic services like drinking water and electricity were slow to return. But they didn't give up, growing their business from a
small team only doing house framing to a full- set construction company, helping many homeowners who they say were swindled by contractors who took
their money and left town.
RIVERA: So, a lot of people were without money and without a house.
VALDES: Their growth was fueled by thousands of workers who came from across the country and outside the U.S. to work in construction.
RIVERA: Because most of the people that was here was Latinos.
VALDES: Who worked in difficult conditions, battling the intense heat and humidity to rebuild this iconic American city. Their efforts are celebrated
in this sculpture in the infamous Ninth Ward ground zero of the deadly floods.
DR. JUAN JORGE GERSHENIK, NEONATOLOGIST: I really believe that they were key in trying to get the New Orleans area back.
VALDES: Dr. Juan Gershenik commissioned the sculpture after speaking with children of those workers, who he says were shy about their parents'
profession. He wanted them to be proud of the work their parents did.
GERSHENIK: Undoubtedly, that was my first goal.
VALDES: High praise coming from a person considered one of the heroes of the post-Katrina tragedy, evacuating premature babies out of the hospital,
manually blowing oxygen to one of them for hours, accolades he'd rather be given to others.
GERSHENIK: The understanding of how much the contribution of the Latinos was made during the post-Katrina recovery time.
VALDES: Many of those came thinking their stay in the Big Easy would be temporary. But now, they call it home.
According to the U.S. Census, the Hispanic population of metropolitan New Orleans has doubled in the past 20 years, as the number of Black and white
residents has decreased.
RIVERA: Someone said that if you drink water from the Mississippi River, you stay in New Orleans and you will never leave. I think I did that
because this is our home now.
VALDES: Gustavo Valdes, CNN, New Orleans.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FOSTER: A physical fight broke out in the Mexican senate earlier this week following a heated debate on the possibility of U.S. military intervention.
It happened on Wednesday after one of its members was angry, apparently angry, over not getting a chance to speak. Senator Alejandro Moreno of the
opposition party PRI stepped up to the podium and grabbed the arm of Senate President Gerard Fernandez Norona from the ruling party. Moreno later said
that he confronted Norona for changing the meeting agenda to prevent the opposition from speaking out.
Now, believe it or not, summer is almost over. Who claimed the title of song of the summer? You'll have your own ideas, but we'll help you decide,
next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:50:43]
FOSTER: It's Labor Day weekend in the U.S. the unofficial end of summer, which leaves us with one big question, of course. Unresolved question. What
was the song of the summer? If you're a Sabrina carpenter fan, you may already know.
(MUSIC)
FOSTER: That song, "Manchild", is already one of five songs that Spotify has declared as its songs of summer, along with "Ordinary" by Alex Warren,
and "Shake It To The Max" by MOLIY. What we don't know is what really is the song of the summer.
The only person we could turn to for an answer. Nick Reilly, content editor for "Rolling Stone U.K." What do you reckon?
NICK REILLY, CONTENT EDITOR, ROLLING STONE UK: I think maybe there isn't a song of the summer. And I say that because, as you said, the thing that
Spotify have said five different songs has been different, talking different circles. And I think that's been the interesting thing this
summer. Last year it was so easy to identify it as a Brat summer. The cultural phenomenon that was brought Charli XCX had it in a cocked hat. It
was so culturally ubiquitous you couldn't escape it.
Whereas this year I think there has been a number of contenders. You mentioned Alex Warren, and that song came out in February or March, and
it's gone on to become this kind of massive emotional hit that has turned him into a global star. You mentioned Sabrina Carpenter.
But another one that's been doing the rounds. And I think its an interesting shout is a song called "Golden", and it's not actually by a
real band. And I say that because its by a band called Hunter X, and they are the stars from the fictional band from the Netflix film "K-Pop Demon
Hunters", which, I mean, I'm not sure how aware you are of the kids animated films on Netflix, but its this story of this group of girls who
are a girl band by day, and they fight demons by night.
And the lead song from that, "Golden" has become a massive global hit. It's been number one in the U.K. and Genius, the online song database. So, it's
been their most googled song in the last few months.
So. I think it's a one where there's a number of contenders.
FOSTER: I know, but isn't that interesting? Because often that's a big summer hit, it defines teenagers' lives, doesn't it? Or people going to
festivals, young people, you know, that song that reminds everyone of that summer and there hasn't been one effectively this year, has there, one
uniting song.
I mean, I'm asking big questions here, but do you think there's something in the zeitgeist which means that we're not connecting around a particular
song or there just wasn't, you know, just didn't appear this year, frankly.
FOSTER: Well, it's really interesting. And just before I start speaking to you, I was kind of looking into it. And the guardian had a really, really
interesting piece earlier this summer. And when they researched the phenomenon, one of the main findings was that, new listening habits were
slightly down in the sense that people and their propensity to go out and discover something new, to listen to new music, those measures are down,
and there is a increased, reliance and familiarity in nostalgia, and certainly, where people have been going for older songs, familiar songs,
leaning in them. It's meant that perhaps a newer song has failed to break through.
So I think that's part of it. I think a lot of these, you know, a lot of the time these days, if you have a song that goes viral on TikTok, it's a
massive thing as well. So I think the kind of old school goalposts by which we measure what would be a song of the summer? It's really, really changed
for all these different reasons. And I think for this year, perhaps all of those are part of the reason why there hasn't been a clear winner or a
clear favorite in the way that Charli XCX very much was last year.
FOSTER: It really was undoubted, wasn't it? Wasn't even a debate.
Nick, really appreciate it. Thank you so much.
REILLY: Thank you.
Speaking of nostalgia, a new exhibition in London giving fans a glimpse at the Beatles when they were on the cusp of superstardom. The photographs
were taken by Paul McCartney in 1963 and 1964. They chart the early years, the Beatles success. Just after the release of their debut album, "Please,
Please Me", it's the period where the Beatles were popular in the UK, but not yet a global phenomenon.
McCartney discovered the long lost photos during the COVID pandemic. They're now on display at London's Gagauzian Art Gallery if you want to
look.
Finally, this hour, staff at a hospital in London have opened a time capsule sealed by Princess Diana more than 30 years ago. Diana visited
children at the great Ormond Street Hospital regularly. Two children selected the items that were preserved. They include a pocket sized TV.
Some tree seeds and a Kylie Minogue CD. Capsule was unearthed to make way for the construction of a new cancer center.
Other memorabilia recovered includes a solar powered calculator, a European passport, and a collection of British coins. Bit controversial because they
were meant to be locked away for centuries, but we've got to see them early.
I'm Max Foster.
That's WHAT WE KNOW.
"QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" up next.
END
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